2024 NBA Draft Thread

[NYPiston]

that's your opinion. And people are obviously entitled to that. I just like to wait for as much information before I make these kinds of declarations. Even now, before we've seen them at the combine, got their timed speeds, verticals, and measurements, it's too early, let alone a year ago when you all decided this.

"So it's not wrong to say a draft is weak pre draft, and technically still be right about that even if it ends up being strong after the fact."

What kind of logic is this? Right now, 9/10 of you on here and in the media are saying it's weak. If 1/10 is saying it's not then when it turns out to be strong that 1/10 guy is right and those 9/10 are wrong. There's no gray area. If you think there's a possibility it could be strong "after the fact" you have the opportunity before draft night to say the draft class is average or even good instead of weak. You declaring it's weak negates that possibility. You can't say "well...everyone else said it was weak so now that it's strong after the fact I'm TECHNICALLY still right". No...just no. That makes zero sense

It's a general consensus from people who scout for a living that this is a weak draft especially at the top. It doesn't mean they'll be right, the "consensus" has been wrong before, but the prevailing thought from many right now in the predraft process is that this draft is weaker than most.

If you disagree you're entitled to your opinion but give reasons why you think it's not a weak draft, why you disagree with the consensus?
I can say from my amateur point of view that I haven't been impressed with this college class at all. I haven't seen the Ignite guys play so can't speak on them from my personal view or the international guys but this is an abnormally weak college class IMO. When you have guys like Sheppard, Cody Williams and Clingan looking like potential top 5 picks you know it's a weak college class especially when looking at recent drafts in comparison.

This doesn't mean that there won't be some franchise guys to come out of this draft, this doesn't mean that there isn't any quality in the draft but in terms of high end talent which is where drafts are primarily judged there doesn't appear as of right now to be any players at the top that look like franchise prospects or even a lead guy on a team at the very least which makes it even tougher on teams in the top 5 to project forward.
You had Wemby, Scoot and Miller last year, Paolo, Chet and Jabari the year before, Cade, Green, Mobley the year before that etc. There are no guys to hang your hat on in this draft and say, oh yeah that guy is going top 3 for sure. The scouts will really hard to earn their money this year.
I wish I, as a Pistons fan, can have something to be excited for in this draft but I keep coming up with nothing. It's a bad year to be bad.

[FarBeyondDriven]

1) absurd. This is when we get official measurements. This is when we get to find out how they perform in drills. How high they jump. We get to see their intelligence and personality when they're being interviewed and forced to answer questions. This is when we get to see these prospects we've been talking about on the same court together.

2) Yes...you all WERE saying it was a bad class because you in particular, seemingly judge draft classes mostly on OAD talent out of the United States. This is clearly a flawed premise since draft classes aren't only about OADs. There are so many talented international prospects and even the OAD weren't putting themselves in the best position to succeed and help their draft stock. And the talent pool you were judging, the OADs everyone had in the first round of their big boards, is completely different than the OAD we're left with in the first round currently. Half the kids you used to claim it was a weak OAD class were replaced with other OAD yet your opinion never changed to reflect that.

3) It just seems like everybody wants it to be a bad class because they've been saying it since last Summer and none of your opinons have changed despite the months of new information and a dozen prospects that weren't on anyone's radar revealing themselves. Like, you can't possibly admit your opinion based on flawed reasoning and a rush to judgment could be wrong.

4) It's rich that it's ME that has to curtail my posting habits. Everyone else can just freely say "weakest class ever" in all their posts but I'm not allowed to disagree and try to get people to see that perhaps they're being premature by writing it off a year ago.

No one is saying it is the worst draft ever, though, and yet you continue to say that everyone is ... continue to disparage everyone you can, it's just silly. There is a difference between respectful disagreement and whatever it is you are doing.

what are you talking about? That's pretty much the consensus on this and GB, reddit, from all the "experts" and talking heads. Are we just making **** up now? If it was worth it I'd quickly find a dozen posts in 5 minutes proving this but it's really not.

edit - screw that. I've got time

"This is the worst draft I've ever seen in my life" - HadanEffectHere

"this draft is one of the worst I've ever seen." - NYPiston

"This has to be one of the worst drafts ever"- bigboi

"Sucks that is happening in a year that's projected to be one of the weakest draft classes in a while too." - Castle Black

"this draft class is one of the weakest projections in years." - JimmyFromNz

"This draft class might sincerely be the worst since 2013. There's not a single tier A or even tier B prospect." CP3nthusiast

"Tanking? Next year’s draft is going to be one of the worst drafts in over 20 years." - ocelot17

"its suppose to be a trash draft class" - Illmatic860

"There is no one in the 2024 draft class is worth tanking for" - Marvin Martian

this took 5 minutes. Doesn't include reddit and all the draft "experts" that have been claiming this for months

Read on Twitter

?s=20

yeah, nobody is saying this

[FarBeyondDriven]

that's your opinion. And people are obviously entitled to that. I just like to wait for as much information before I make these kinds of declarations. Even now, before we've seen them at the combine, got their timed speeds, verticals, and measurements, it's too early, let alone a year ago when you all decided this.

"So it's not wrong to say a draft is weak pre draft, and technically still be right about that even if it ends up being strong after the fact."

What kind of logic is this? Right now, 9/10 of you on here and in the media are saying it's weak. If 1/10 is saying it's not then when it turns out to be strong that 1/10 guy is right and those 9/10 are wrong. There's no gray area. If you think there's a possibility it could be strong "after the fact" you have the opportunity before draft night to say the draft class is average or even good instead of weak. You declaring it's weak negates that possibility. You can't say "well...everyone else said it was weak so now that it's strong after the fact I'm TECHNICALLY still right". No...just no. That makes zero sense

It's a general consensus from people who scout for a living that this is a weak draft especially at the top. It doesn't mean they'll be right, the "consensus" has been wrong before, but the prevailing thought from many right now in the predraft process is that this draft is weaker than most.

If you disagree you're entitled to your opinion but give reasons why you think it's not a weak draft, why you disagree with the consensus?
I can say from my amateur point of view that I haven't been impressed with this college class at all. I haven't seen the Ignite guys play so can't speak on them from my personal view or the international guys but this is an abnormally weak college class IMO. When you have guys like Sheppard, Cody Williams and Clingan looking like potential top 5 picks you know it's a weak college class especially when looking at recent drafts in comparison.

This doesn't mean that there won't be some franchise guys to come out of this draft, this doesn't mean that there isn't any quality in the draft but in terms of high end talent which is where drafts are primarily judged there doesn't appear as of right now to be any players at the top that look like franchise prospects or even a lead guy on a team at the very least which makes it even tougher on teams in the top 5 to project forward.
You had Wemby, Scoot and Miller last year, Paolo, Chet and Jabari the year before, Cade, Green, Mobley the year before that etc. There are no guys to hang your hat on in this draft and say, oh yeah that guy is going top 3 for sure. The scouts will really hard to earn their money this year.
I wish I, as a Pistons fan, can have something to be excited for in this draft but I keep coming up with nothing. It's a bad year to be bad.

literally been doing this for months. It's arguably the strongest international class in NBA history and it's an extremely deep class with role players that will contribute thru the end of the 2nd round. And it's possible the OAD is being underrated due to how things played out with their choices of teams, their teammates, and injuries.

I agree, the lack of those supposed elite guys at the top, not that I necessarily agree they aren't in the same tier as some of the guys you mentioned (Mobley, Smith, Green) has made these scouts with their lazy analysis who get it wrong almost every season, lose their collective minds. I just don't need to see 18 y/o Yang, Risacher, Sarr, Topic and Salaun dominate in college to know they're really good NBA prospects but apparently everyone else does.

Concerning the OAD college class. I've spoken in length about why this APPEARS to be one of if not the weakest ever. Two of the best prospects, Holland and Buzelis, went to the train wreck that was G-League Ignite. Collier went to the train wreck that was USC. Castle went to a team with National Championship aspirations where he'd be the 4th option. Williams was injured all season and the veterans on that team were playing to improve their draft stock taken away his touches/shine. Furphy was a backup for the first month of the season and the 5th option behind vets. George was a backup for the first month and a half, played out of position and behind vets desperate to establish their own draft stock.

Basically all of these things combined with and maybe due to NIL has made evaluating these prospects more difficult than any draft class ever. You're basically left having to emphasize diagnosing whether prospects have NBA translatable size, length and athleticism suggesting upside and chances at development and focusing on the sporadic flashes showing they have translatable skills. You cannot rely on statistics and reading box scores which seems the most important things to scouts.

If I was a Pistons fan I'd be excited because Risacher, Salaun, McCain and Knecht are exactly what you need and depending on the lottery results and where you pick you are guaranteed to be getting at least one of them. They'd all compliment your current roster and provide the shooting and spacing you desperately need.

[CptCrunch]

Does McCain flirt with declaring?

Curious what Duke's lineup will be next year

My gusses

Gone:
Kyle Filipowski (Top 20)
Jared McCain (Top 35)
Jeremy Roach (Undrafted/Europe, but he can play another year in college)
Ryan Young (Already a consultant...literally on Linkedin)

Incoming
OAD:
Cooper Flagg
Khaman Maluach

50/50 OAD:
Isaiah Evans

30/70 OAD (Late pick)
Kon Knueppel
Patrick Ngongba II

3-4 year player:
Darren Harris

Returning
Caleb Foster (So)
Tyrese Proctor (Jr)
Sean Steward (So)
Mark Mitchell (Jr)
Jaylin Blakes (Sr)
TJ Power (So)

Starter:
Foster
Proctor
Flagg
Stewart
Maluach

Bench:
Mitchell, Evans, Knueppel, Blakes, Power

Duke failed this year because they didn't have a NBA guard or NBA wing who can initiate offense. Roach was simply too bad for a senior. Next year gonna be rough unless Foster becomes a legit guard or Flagg literally is a Kyrie/Zion tier prospect.

[TheSuzerain]

Does McCain flirt with declaring?

Curious what Duke's lineup will be next year

My gusses

Gone:
Kyle Filipowski (Top 20)
Jared McCain (Top 35)
Jeremy Roach (Undrafted/Europe, but he can play another year in college)
Ryan Young (Already a consultant...literally on Linkedin)

Incoming
OAD:
Cooper Flagg
Khaman Maluach

50/50 OAD:
Isaiah Evans

30/70 OAD (Late pick)
Kon Knueppel
Patrick Ngongba II

3-4 year player:
Darren Harris

Returning
Caleb Foster (So)
Tyrese Proctor (Jr)
Sean Steward (So)
Mark Mitchell (Jr)
Jaylin Blakes (Sr)
TJ Power (So)

Starter:
Foster
Proctor
Flagg
Stewart
Maluach

Bench:
Mitchell, Evans, Knueppel, Blakes, Power

Duke failed this year because they didn't have a NBA guard or NBA wing who can initiate offense. Roach was simply too bad for a senior. Next year gonna be rough unless Foster becomes a legit guard or Flagg literally is a Kyrie/Zion tier prospect.

Flagg at 3 looks weird to me but maybe he's just good enough.

I've got to think Mitchell and/or Power transfers in the above scenario.

[babyjax13]

No one is saying it is the worst draft ever, though, and yet you continue to say that everyone is ... continue to disparage everyone you can, it's just silly. There is a difference between respectful disagreement and whatever it is you are doing.

what are you talking about? That's pretty much the consensus on this and GB, reddit, from all the "experts" and talking heads. Are we just making **** up now? If it was worth it I'd quickly find a dozen posts in 5 minutes proving this but it's really not.

edit - screw that. I've got time

"This is the worst draft I've ever seen in my life" - HadanEffectHere

"this draft is one of the worst I've ever seen." - NYPiston

"This has to be one of the worst drafts ever"- bigboi

"Sucks that is happening in a year that's projected to be one of the weakest draft classes in a while too." - Castle Black

"this draft class is one of the weakest projections in years." - JimmyFromNz

"This draft class might sincerely be the worst since 2013. There's not a single tier A or even tier B prospect." CP3nthusiast

"Tanking? Next year’s draft is going to be one of the worst drafts in over 20 years." - ocelot17

"its suppose to be a trash draft class" - Illmatic860

"There is no one in the 2024 draft class is worth tanking for" - Marvin Martian

this took 5 minutes. Doesn't include reddit and all the draft "experts" that have been claiming this for months

Read on Twitter

?s=20

yeah, nobody is saying this

Okay, so three people here said it is the worst ever, not sure how that constitutes 'everyone'. Don't care about reddit, twitter, etc. If the consensus here was that it is the worst draft ever, I would think that you'd find more than three people. Instead of saying everyone thinks it is the worst draft class ever, you should be talking about "the people who think it is the worst class ever", which, here, is a small group.

[FarBeyondDriven]

what are you talking about? That's pretty much the consensus on this and GB, reddit, from all the "experts" and talking heads. Are we just making **** up now? If it was worth it I'd quickly find a dozen posts in 5 minutes proving this but it's really not.

edit - screw that. I've got time

"This is the worst draft I've ever seen in my life" - HadanEffectHere

"this draft is one of the worst I've ever seen." - NYPiston

"This has to be one of the worst drafts ever"- bigboi

"Sucks that is happening in a year that's projected to be one of the weakest draft classes in a while too." - Castle Black

"this draft class is one of the weakest projections in years." - JimmyFromNz

"This draft class might sincerely be the worst since 2013. There's not a single tier A or even tier B prospect." CP3nthusiast

"Tanking? Next year’s draft is going to be one of the worst drafts in over 20 years." - ocelot17

"its suppose to be a trash draft class" - Illmatic860

"There is no one in the 2024 draft class is worth tanking for" - Marvin Martian

this took 5 minutes. Doesn't include reddit and all the draft "experts" that have been claiming this for months

Read on Twitter

?s=20

yeah, nobody is saying this

Okay, so three people here said it is the worst ever, not sure how that constitutes 'everyone'. Don't care about reddit, twitter, etc. If the consensus here was that it is the worst draft ever, I would think that you'd find more than three people. Instead of saying everyone thinks it is the worst draft class ever, you should be talking about "the people who think it is the worst class ever", which, here, is a small group.

just stop

[NYPiston]

literally been doing this for months. It's arguably the strongest international class in NBA history and it's an extremely deep class with role players that will contribute thru the end of the 2nd round. And it's possible the OAD is being underrated due to how things played out with their choices of teams, their teammates, and injuries.

I agree, the lack of those supposed elite guys at the top, not that I necessarily agree they aren't in the same tier as some of the guys you mentioned (Mobley, Smith, Green) has made these scouts with their lazy analysis who get it wrong almost every season, lose their collective minds. I just don't need to see 18 y/o Yang, Risacher, Sarr, Topic and Salaun dominate in college to know they're really good NBA prospects but apparently everyone else does.

Concerning the OAD college class. I've spoken in length about why this APPEARS to be one of if not the weakest ever. Two of the best prospects, Holland and Buzelis, went to the train wreck that was G-League Ignite. Collier went to the train wreck that was USC. Castle went to a team with National Championship aspirations where he'd be the 4th option. Williams was injured all season and the veterans on that team were playing to improve their draft stock taken away his touches/shine. Furphy was a backup for the first month of the season and the 5th option behind vets. George was a backup for the first month and a half, played out of position and behind vets desperate to establish their own draft stock.

Basically all of these things combined with and maybe due to NIL has made evaluating these prospects more difficult than any draft class ever. You're basically left having to emphasize diagnosing whether prospects have NBA translatable size, length and athleticism suggesting upside and chances at development and focusing on the sporadic flashes showing they have translatable skills. You cannot rely on statistics and reading box scores which seems the most important things to scouts.

If I was a Pistons fan I'd be excited because Risacher, Salaun, McCain and Knecht are exactly what you need and depending on the lottery results and where you pick you are guaranteed to be getting at least one of them. They'd all compliment your current roster and provide the shooting and spacing you desperately need.

Thanks for the detailed response.

I think a lot of what goes into judging the strength of a draft going into the predraft process is high end talent, the top of the draft. There are good players in this draft but, ultimately, a draft gets judged on who the best players in the draft project to be (franchise talents) and this draft lacks that big time at least right now.

In terms of from my biased point of view, none of those names excite me as a fan of a 13 win team that suffered all season hoping for some kind of payoff. As a longtime member of the high draft pick club now, there was excitement about the possibility of Cade, Mobley, Green or Suggs, there was excitement about the possibility of Paolo, Chet, Jabari or Ivey, there was excitement about the possibility of Wembanyama, Scoot, Miller or a Thompson twin. Risacher, Sarr, Salaun, Knecht (who I like more than most but not in the top 5), McCain don't hold nearly that much appeal. It's depressing actually haha.
Out of that group, Risacher or Sarr seem to have the most projectable upside but I'm also a fan of a team that drafted fellow Frenchies Sekou and Killian so even those guys make me apprehensive so that's why I see this as an abnormally weak draft. I actually think it's a better draft for a team in the mid teens than at the top. I bet this will be like the Giannis draft where the best players are outside of the top 10 which would be par for the course for this Pistons fan.

[JMAC3]

One thing that I think that is getting overlooked is just how young this draft class is. Not that age is everything, but you have to think that if all of Topic, Saluan, Holland, Sarr and Risacher were all 1 year older and in next years class they would all take pretty significant jumps.

Last year
Bilal Coulibaly - 18.9 yrs
Scoot Henderson - 19.4 yrs
Anthony Black -19.4 yrs
Wemby - 19.5 yrs
Taylor Hendricks - 19.6 yrs
Cason Wallace - 19.6 yrs
Jarace Walker - 19.8 yrs
Amen Thompson - 20.4 yrs
Ausar Thompson -20.4 yrs
Brandon Miller - 20.6 yrs

vs This year
Nikola Topić -18.6 yrs
Tidjane Salaun -18.6 yrs
Ron Holland - 18.7 yrs
Alexandre Sarr - 18.9 yrs
Zaccharie Risacher- 18.9 yrs
Rob Dillingham -19.2 yrs
Stephon Castle -19.4 yrs
Cody Williams - 19.4 yrs
Matas Buzelis - 19.5 yrs
Ja'Kobe Walter - 19.6 yrs
Reed Sheppard - 19.8 yrs

[clyde21]

One thing that I think that is getting overlooked is just how young this draft class is. Not that age is everything, but you have to think that if all of Topic, Saluan, Holland, Sarr and Risacher were all 1 year older and in next years class they would all take pretty significant jumps.

Last year
Bilal Coulibaly - 18.9 yrs
Scoot Henderson - 19.4 yrs
Anthony Black -19.4 yrs
Wemby - 19.5 yrs
Taylor Hendricks - 19.6 yrs
Cason Wallace - 19.6 yrs
Jarace Walker - 19.8 yrs
Amen Thompson - 20.4 yrs
Ausar Thompson -20.4 yrs
Brandon Miller - 20.6 yrs

vs This year
Nikola Topić -18.6 yrs
Tidjane Salaun -18.6 yrs
Ron Holland - 18.7 yrs
Alexandre Sarr - 18.9 yrs
Zaccharie Risacher- 18.9 yrs
Rob Dillingham -19.2 yrs
Stephon Castle -19.4 yrs
Cody Williams - 19.4 yrs
Matas Buzelis - 19.5 yrs
Ja'Kobe Walter - 19.6 yrs
Reed Sheppard - 19.8 yrs

i mean, you didn't even include a bunch of guys from last year, who were younger than anyone you name dropped there, GG, Cam and Whitehead

[RyugaFan]

I mean often times the general draft community doesn't have a good read on how good a draft will be. 2020 and 2022 were being labelled weak and they have better players than 2021.

[JMAC3]

One thing that I think that is getting overlooked is just how young this draft class is. Not that age is everything, but you have to think that if all of Topic, Saluan, Holland, Sarr and Risacher were all 1 year older and in next years class they would all take pretty significant jumps.

Last year
Bilal Coulibaly - 18.9 yrs
Scoot Henderson - 19.4 yrs
Anthony Black -19.4 yrs
Wemby - 19.5 yrs
Taylor Hendricks - 19.6 yrs
Cason Wallace - 19.6 yrs
Jarace Walker - 19.8 yrs
Amen Thompson - 20.4 yrs
Ausar Thompson -20.4 yrs
Brandon Miller - 20.6 yrs

vs This year
Nikola Topić -18.6 yrs
Tidjane Salaun -18.6 yrs
Ron Holland - 18.7 yrs
Alexandre Sarr - 18.9 yrs
Zaccharie Risacher- 18.9 yrs
Rob Dillingham -19.2 yrs
Stephon Castle -19.4 yrs
Cody Williams - 19.4 yrs
Matas Buzelis - 19.5 yrs
Ja'Kobe Walter - 19.6 yrs
Reed Sheppard - 19.8 yrs

i mean, you didn't even include a bunch of guys from last year, who were younger than anyone you name dropped there, GG, Cam and Whitehead

Yeah just included the top 10 guys from each class, because 90% of the talk about the draft being weak is focused on the top of the draft.

[RyugaFan]

There's also incentive for GMs and scouts to call this weak and unpredictable. If and when they miss out on prospects they can claim everyone was low on them, and if they hit on someone they can claim the same thing and reap the benefits.

[clyde21]

One thing that I think that is getting overlooked is just how young this draft class is. Not that age is everything, but you have to think that if all of Topic, Saluan, Holland, Sarr and Risacher were all 1 year older and in next years class they would all take pretty significant jumps.

Last year
Bilal Coulibaly - 18.9 yrs
Scoot Henderson - 19.4 yrs
Anthony Black -19.4 yrs
Wemby - 19.5 yrs
Taylor Hendricks - 19.6 yrs
Cason Wallace - 19.6 yrs
Jarace Walker - 19.8 yrs
Amen Thompson - 20.4 yrs
Ausar Thompson -20.4 yrs
Brandon Miller - 20.6 yrs

vs This year
Nikola Topić -18.6 yrs
Tidjane Salaun -18.6 yrs
Ron Holland - 18.7 yrs
Alexandre Sarr - 18.9 yrs
Zaccharie Risacher- 18.9 yrs
Rob Dillingham -19.2 yrs
Stephon Castle -19.4 yrs
Cody Williams - 19.4 yrs
Matas Buzelis - 19.5 yrs
Ja'Kobe Walter - 19.6 yrs
Reed Sheppard - 19.8 yrs

i mean, you didn't even include a bunch of guys from last year, who were younger than anyone you name dropped there, GG, Cam and Whitehead

Yeah just included the top 10 guys from each class, because 90% of the talk about the draft being weak is focused on the top of the draft.

how do you know who will go top 10 in this class? half those guys probably won't go top 10.

[clyde21]

There's also incentive for GMs and scouts to call this weak and unpredictable. If and when they miss out on prospects they can claim everyone was low on them, and if they hit on someone they can claim the same thing and reap the benefits.

it's not a conspiracy, it's a weak class.

[JMAC3]

i mean, you didn't even include a bunch of guys from last year, who were younger than anyone you name dropped there, GG, Cam and Whitehead

Yeah just included the top 10 guys from each class, because 90% of the talk about the draft being weak is focused on the top of the draft.

how do you know who will go top 10 in this class? half those guys probably won't go top 10.

Yeah maybe, maybe not. Either way the top 10 will be a good bit younger this year than last. I feel pretty confident in that, which is the main point.

[DOT]

There's also incentive for GMs and scouts to call this weak and unpredictable. If and when they miss out on prospects they can claim everyone was low on them, and if they hit on someone they can claim the same thing and reap the benefits.

How is that different from any other year?

[RyugaFan]

There's also incentive for GMs and scouts to call this weak and unpredictable. If and when they miss out on prospects they can claim everyone was low on them, and if they hit on someone they can claim the same thing and reap the benefits.

How is that different from any other year?

The overwhelming sentiment is that it's weak. I don't expect an exec to go "wait no, there's a Giannis in this class" to these Intel guys.

[DOT]

There's also incentive for GMs and scouts to call this weak and unpredictable. If and when they miss out on prospects they can claim everyone was low on them, and if they hit on someone they can claim the same thing and reap the benefits.

How is that different from any other year?

The overwhelming sentiment is that it's weak. I don't expect an exec to go "wait no, there's a Giannis in this class" to these Intel guys.

I'm saying you could apply your logic to every year, that GMs and scouts always have an incentive to call drafts weak and unpredictable, it's not unique to this year.

[clyde21]

Yeah just included the top 10 guys from each class, because 90% of the talk about the draft being weak is focused on the top of the draft.

how do you know who will go top 10 in this class? half those guys probably won't go top 10.

Yeah maybe, maybe not. Either way the top 10 will be a good bit younger this year than last. I feel pretty confident in that, which is the main point.

eh, a lot of the guys you mentioned might not go top 10 at all. just like we thought Cam, who would be the youngest out of anyone in the 2024 group, would go top 10 and didn't.

Salaun most likely won't go top 10, i'd probably that JKW doesn't go top 10 either, and maybe not even Dilly, and instead will get replaced by more ready now players like we see in every class.