RealGM

J~Rush wrote:

Indy07 wrote:This is coming from a kid who went to Oden's high school. I love Oden to death, he is an awesome guy, he's funny and he was amazing to watch in high school. However I wouldn't be that quick to appoint him heir to the throne of NBA centers. Some guy named Dwight Howard seems to be enjoying his reign

I'm just not impressed with Dwight Howard. It's mainly due to seeing one Joel Pzrybilla hold him to under ten points on average in the season series. Maybe he just had the flu when I watched him =/

Everyone has bad games, if you judge Dwight based only on 2 bad games out of a season of 82 mostly great games, that's a bit ridiculous, especially since Orlando won both games despite his apparently unimpressive play. Also, his first game against Portland his full statline was 9 points, 14 boards and 3 blocks, and the second game he put up 10 points, 14 boards and 4 blocks, so they weren't exactly terrible overall performances.

Anyways, Oden is clearly not a prospect who you can "honestly give a stonecold guarantee" that he will be the best in the league at his position. Even LeBron was questionable, since nobody in the league really knew what his position would be (as a prospect, many thought LeBron would be a super-sized PG, ala Magic Johnson).

/off topic

ponder276 wrote:

J~Rush wrote:

Indy07 wrote:This is coming from a kid who went to Oden's high school. I love Oden to death, he is an awesome guy, he's funny and he was amazing to watch in high school. However I wouldn't be that quick to appoint him heir to the throne of NBA centers. Some guy named Dwight Howard seems to be enjoying his reign

I'm just not impressed with Dwight Howard. It's mainly due to seeing one Joel Pzrybilla hold him to under ten points on average in the season series. Maybe he just had the flu when I watched him =/

Everyone has bad games, if you judge Dwight based only on 2 bad games out of a season of 82 mostly great games, that's a bit ridiculous, especially since Orlando won both games despite his apparently unimpressive play. Also, his first game against Portland his full statline was 9 points, 14 boards and 3 blocks, and the second game he put up 10 points, 14 boards and 4 blocks, so they weren't exactly terrible overall performances.

Anyways, Oden is clearly not a prospect who you can "honestly give a stonecold guarantee" that he will be the best in the league at his position. Even LeBron was questionable, since nobody in the league really knew what his position would be (as a prospect, many thought LeBron would be a super-sized PG, ala Magic Johnson).

/off topic

+1

His game reminds me of Steve Nash/ Pete Maravich. I think he's getting too overhyped right now. Shorter Magic Johnson? Comon now.. lets be real! I have to say.. I had really high expecations for him bc I keep hearing how good he is, but after watching his tape I'm kinda puzzled at what the fuss is all about. Yes he does have good feel for the game, knowing when and who to deliver the ball to at the right time. He also posseses a pretty good first step and decpetive speed to get into the lane. However, you have to remember the defense isnt nearly as quick or athletic as those in the NBA. THose gaps hes seeing in the spanish league are gonna close up alot quicker in the NBA which can neutralize his playmaking skills. He better be a damn good shooter like Nash to compensate for his lack of athleticism bc I rly dont see his game translating that well in the NBA.

Lebron was a one-in-a-decade type of prospect.

Rubio is nowhere near that level of talent.

That said I love his game, but I think he'll be a little slowed down by NBA defenses. I see him making a few all-star games but never really being considered as equal to Paul/Deron....

They are both great players, but also quite different. Rubio won't ever be an elite scorer in the NBA, he is more of a Jason Kidd-type facilitator, while Rose is a powerful slasher that may have a Dwayne Wade ceiling. I am giving the edge to Rose here.

i think i am more impressed with Rubio now than Rose in Memphis (not saying much since all i've seen of Rubio is a few youtube clips.

but i can easily see that he is really really talented. he's got amazing court vision+ basketball IQ.
and apparently he plays great D too.

maybe Rose's got higher ceiling because of his physical attributes, but i think Rubio's got better "chance" of becoming the better of the two.

I take Rubio, easily. It's a bit ridiculous to say that you should take Rose just because he is a "proven American."

Remember, Tractor Traylor was a "proven American," and Milwaukee slept on Dirk Nowitzki...

his basketball IQ better be as good as it was hyped up to be because his highlight reels are definately unimpressive and that's sad... its hard to have an unimpressive highlight real... even sebastien telfair back in his hayday had an impressive mixtape on youtube...

Rose > Jennings > Rubio

While we have all the traditional "prospect" data on Rose. We have nothing but Youtubes and anecdotes on Rubio. Great fun, but pure fantasy comparos. I'm waiting for the Rubio game eyeball tests, workouts and maybe even the summer league data that Rose has already gone through. You are all guessing. Most of us have just heard of this guy like last week and are flailing around in the dark without night vision. Spare the anecdotes

It's sad that people judge a player on his highlight reels. Maybe ACB basketball isn't as flashy? Same can be said about Olympic basketball. Does that make it any less potent? Highlight reels are completely useless because you cannot judge a player purely on his best moments. And Rubio has a lot of "best" moments- meaning he produces night in and night out in a professional league at 17 years of age. This and the way he has dominated his age group makes him one of the top European prospects ever without a doubt. Sure, his shooting has exhibited inconsistencies. That said, it is much improved throughout the years.

As for him or Derrick Rose: I would definitely give the edge to Rubio while qualifying that Rose is clearly the better athlete. Still, Rubio has proven much more at a higher level despite the differences in the European and NBA games. I think he will translate much better than most people are expecting- his flashy Pete Maravich like plays may attract fans and boast an organization. I'm going to reserve judgment until I see his matchup with the US, but I have to say that Rubio clearly has accomplished more Rose and will probably be the better NBA player.

I think he´s the reign Top-PG of the ACB...that must tell you something...

According ESPN's Ford, he is now the candidate to the TOP pick in 2010 after how he played in the gold medal game.
I think Rubio's defense was very, very good in the olympics, his ballhndling and decision making was good and his shooting poor, he belonged there and was never owned, that's saying a lot for a 17 years old kid.

this for me is the perfect rationale before the gold medal game against the USA.

a team who is close to competing in the playoffs would pick rose. but a rebuilding team would definitely go for rubio who is a boy wonder at 17.

but after that game:

Rubio is by far #1 over rose. he has shown that he can play well against the best at his position and at the biggest stage, not to mention that it is against a superior USA team who is looking to redeem themselves. and the best part is, he's only 17 yo.

Its too hard to answer.

Euro ball and NBA ball are very different beasts.

It does not matter anyway, hes two drafts away from playing in the NBA. Really, who cares

Vindicater wrote:Its too hard to answer.

Euro ball and NBA ball are very different beasts.

It does not matter anyway, hes two drafts away from playing in the NBA. Really, who cares

He will be eligible for next years draft.

Some people have said he wants to wait one more yeaer though. Of course, that's said alot but then many change their mind when that much money is staring them in the face.

I think people still need to see more of Rubio to judge off of him. Vindicater made a great point that international basketball and college basketball are very contrasting style of play, so it's too early to judge a 17 year old kid at this point in time.

However, after watching him play in the Olympics, he does have the tools to become a top-notch NBA point guard. He hasn't put them all together, yet (at least from what I watched in the Olympics).

I need to see more of Rubio to compare him to Rose, so I'll refrain from doing so...for now.

bald odds say that elite #1 overall level PGs don't come around in back to back years. Either Rubio and or Rose are overhyped in that... unless the emphasis on the PG position has truly gone through the roof and touted PGs are gonna go top 5 every year now just because. Or until 5 years from now we're all going remember those 2 busts Rose and Rubio we all were sure were the next whohas? what a laf!

lets just remember Eurohypes Darko and Bargnani and Skitishwhatever when dreaming about the overseas fantasy players. Seems like the best ones end up either unhyped or taken in the second round lower 1st while the golden boys go fzzzt. We get too nutty gushy over these mysterious Eurobeards. Not to mention Yi and Yao and Yo

fleetwood macbull wrote:bald odds say that elite #1 overall level PGs don't come around in back to back years. Either Rubio and or Rose are overhyped in that... unless the emphasis on the PG position has truly gone through the roof and touted PGs are gonna go top 5 every year now just because. Or until 5 years from now we're all going remember those 2 busts Rose and Rubio we all were sure were the next whohas? what a laf!

lets just remember Eurohypes Darko and Bargnani and Skitishwhatever when dreaming about the overseas fantasy players. Seems like the best ones end up either unhyped or taken in the second round lower 1st while the golden boys go fzzzt. We get too nutty gushy over these mysterious Eurobeards. Not to mention Yi and Yao and Yo

Because Yao was such a bust . . .

Also, a lot of current, good Euros were taken with mid to high firsts:
- Pau Gasol: 3rd overall, drafted straight out of Spain
- Dirk Nowitzki: 9th overall, drafted straight out of Germany
- Peja Stojakovic: 14th overall, drafted straight out of Greece
- Hedo Turkoglu: 16th overall, drafted straight out of Turkey
etc.

They are both terrific, but can't compare because Rubio is still too young. At 17 he has already demonstrated to be a competent professional player ,but it's clear that he is not mature, phisically and technically. Offensively especially he has to learn a lot, and I'm not only talking about his shot. Rose is a freak athlete,but good playmaking instincts. Tough to say who is going to be better.They play different ways. I'd take Rubio because I just saw him in the Olympics..when I'm watching Rose I will change my mind. It's like the debate Paul-Deron..u really don't know who is better.