Inside Source:Calderon and Johnson for Butler and Crittenton

[FluLikeSymptoms]

I like that BC won't part with Johnson, that guy is a great piece.

I'd rather trade Jack than Calderon, especially if we get Butler. Jose/Butler/Hedo/Bosh/Bargs would be amazing.

[boshville]

I love how people say Butler would help the team rebounding when he won't. The exact same thing was said about Marion how he would help our perimeter defense and rebounding, when he didn't. The rebounding improved marginally under Marion and I imagine it'd be the same with Butler. Outside of Bargnani, we'd have no other reliable 3-PT scorer...

Its funny how you say Marion didn't help us improve out D or rebounding but we improved greatly in both fields when he arrived. I don't recall the exact numbers or rating statistics used, but we improved greatly in both areas.

[Chpwags]

Rebounding improved significantly with Marion last year what games were you watching? We were one of the top rebounding teams statistically with marion in the line up.

[RINSE]

I love how people say Butler would help the team rebounding when he won't. The exact same thing was said about Marion how he would help our perimeter defense and rebounding, when he didn't. The rebounding improved marginally under Marion and I imagine it'd be the same with Butler. Outside of Bargnani, we'd have no other reliable 3-PT scorer...

Selective memory? I'm pretty sure the addition of Marion improved our team rebounding.

[gp2015]

Let's decrease DD's minutes, increase Banks' minutes and bring on a declining and aging Butler.

Sounds like a great idea.

You can say the same for Calderon - aging, declining, injury-prone player. Plus add in the fact that Jose is being overpaid and signed to a long term contract plus is the worst defensive player in the NBA.

[timdunkit]

I love how people say Butler would help the team rebounding when it won't. The exact same thing was said about Marion how he'd help our perimeter defense and rebounding, when he didn't. If rebounding improved marginally and I imagine it'd be the same with Butler. Outside of Bargnani, we'd have no other reliable 3-PT scorer...

The rebound did improve with Marion ... with Marion we were top 5 defensive rebounding team in the league. You have to realize who Butler would be replacing in our 4rth quarter line up. He is a much defender then Jose, in terms of man to man and help defense. He is a much better rebounder and he can actually play that scorer role you need beside a playmaker like Hedo. Jose is one of the best shooters in the league but Jack/Hedo/Butler are all decent 3pt shooters who need to be respected. In terms of Butler, he actually needs to be guarded because he can take his man of the bounce and drive, whereas, Jose needs a pick all the time. Its going to have its up and down but Butler brings skills that Jose doesn't ... and o yeah on a much more friendlier contract then Jose, so even if you think its a lateral move basketball wise, we still end up with the better contract.

[TheDunc]

I love how people say Butler would help the team rebounding when he won't. The exact same thing was said about Marion how he would help our perimeter defense and rebounding, when he didn't. The rebounding improved marginally under Marion and I imagine it'd be the same with Butler. Outside of Bargnani, we'd have no other reliable 3-PT scorer...

Bargs,Hedo,Jack and Belinelli is enough 3 point shooting for right now. Id hope that BC could get a 3pt specialist for the playoffs though. Maybe Douby?

[Schad]

Let's decrease DD's minutes, increase Banks' minutes and bring on a declining and aging Butler.

Sounds like a great idea.

And revert to Rasho as our primary big. Good talent-wise, but I'm not loving the idea.

[timdunkit]

Let's decrease DD's minutes, increase Banks' minutes and bring on a declining and aging Butler.

Sounds like a great idea.

And revert to Rasho as our primary big. Good talent-wise, but I'm not loving the idea.

And hence BC isn't giving up Amir (though personally I would if I could get a deal lined up with NJ for Boone).

[Dr Positivity]

Holy **** that would be amazing. Not only would Butler be an improvement, but he actually has a BETTER contract than Jose

But if I recall your last thread turned out to be bs

[FluLikeSymptoms]

Let's decrease DD's minutes, increase Banks' minutes and bring on a declining and aging Butler.

Sounds like a great idea.

And revert to Rasho as our primary big. Good talent-wise, but I'm not loving the idea.

And hence BC isn't giving up Amir (though personally I would if I could get a deal lined up with NJ for Boone).

You'd take Boone for Amir?

[Sojourn]

Somehow ... I'm 100% sure it doesn't work like that ... Scouts play a big role in trades and lower executives. I believe there was a story a while ago saying how teams would sometimes send lower level management to scope out if a team would be interested in a trade ... but if it got leaked, the GM could always deny that no such talks had happened.

alright, lets assume 50 ppl were aware of the trade- why would any of the 50 share the details of the trade to an outsider? if a person within the organization notified an outsider of trade discussion, even accidentally- that person should be terminated immediately. its almost the same as someone finding out who was going to be laid off in a company and brazenly discussing the "names" with ppl prior to anyone actually being canned. likewise, if caledron were swapped for butler- caledron would be shipped to the most dysfunctional team in the league and i would imagine that caledron and his agent would be infuriated. in fact, caledron could go public with his disgust and curb any notion of him being shipped out of town before the talks picked up any traction. as for the OP coming up with the names- there have been dozens of threads over the years which have crafted a caledron for butler sway, so this isnt news for raptor fans.

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

Funny, last I remember reading about Butler this year was about his beeing called a cancer on that team. How he was jacking up shots any chance he got, and was killing the flow.

Arenas blew up on him before this whole gun thing, saying he was the reason they sucked. That's from Arenas though, so take it for what it's worth.

I don't think that's right,it was Butler who complained about Arenas and lack of touches

Nah, Arenas was upset because of Butler's horrible shooting percentage this year, and that he was taking so many shots.

He also complained about the free agents on the team being too greedy, looking for new contracts.

It leaked in a article, then the commentators talked about it on the next game and they dropped Butlers name.

[timdunkit]

And revert to Rasho as our primary big. Good talent-wise, but I'm not loving the idea.

And hence BC isn't giving up Amir (though personally I would if I could get a deal lined up with NJ for Boone).

You'd take Boone for Amir?[/quote]

I'd take Boone/Butler for Amir/Jose ... yeah sure. Boone is a pretty good back up big and along with Reggie Evens could provide solid 20 minutes at the back up big positions. He brings a lot of the same intangibles that Amir brings in toughness, rebounding and a presence in the paint.

[Lionel Messi]

I love how people say Butler would help the team rebounding when it won't. The exact same thing was said about Marion how he would help our perimeter defense and rebounding, when he didn't. If rebounding improved marginally and I imagine it'd be the same with Butler. Outside of Bargnani, we'd have no other reliable 3-PT scorer...

Marion helped our rebounding a lot...He brought exactly what we thought he would bring.

Caron Butler can transition to shooting guard very easily, those of you saying he would force hedo to the bench (or start at PG??? lol, he wont be starting at pg) are being silly. Butler is a fine pair with hedo at SG because he can defend SGs fairly well and Hedo can hit the long ball.

Caron butler isnt a terrible shooter, although he has struggled a lot this year. I think in a new scenery he'll pick it up, he even said that if he gets traded he's going to look to prove himself and it really sounds like he'll be refreshed on a new team.

Also, he'd be our best perimiter defender by miles, he used to be a very good defender. He has slowed down a bit but he's still an average defender on the wiz and will be above average on the raptors in my eyes.

I can definetely understand why amir is holding this trade up, amir looks like one of those guys thatll develop into a defensive presence and a PF who can knock down the open J. Like Juwan Howard but with a lot more defence...i mean amir is actually our best defender this year.

Also, i remember this OP brought up some other very legitimate rumours so i trust him. It's not like he's proposing something ridiculous or guaranteeing itll happen either.

Anyways, you guys have to realize that butler can play the 2...stop thinking one of him/hedo/jack are gonna come off the bench, it's not happening.

Regarding DeMar: He'll just get the same (if not more) minutes off the bench and will relegate one of wright/marco/weems to very limited minutes or at least cut down on wright/marco's minutes. Im sure we can all agree that we wouldnt mind seeing less of antoine wright.

I wouldnt mind giving up amir, but it's a really tough call and id much rather give up wright + weems/belli + a 2nd round pick + jose.
Amir is a very important player off the bench for us.

[LebronMJ23]

Guys turn off the homer status....Butler+crittenton for Jose+amir is a good deal for the raptors...amir will prob walk away 4 nothing the summer.so the trade is essentially Jose for Butler...in which case we get way less salary and a way better 2 way player....this is a no brainer and laughable that BC turned it down...is BC stupid?

[Hit Em Up]

Past Raptorginius7 thread:

Hump & Kapono for G-Wallace & BC interested in Marbury : viewtopic.php?f=32&t=855820

BC might trade Bosh this past summer : viewtopic.php?t=898459

Triano may insert Roko and Kapono into starting unit and put Bargs and AP on bench: viewtopic.php?t=858317

I dont know how legit this guy is

[timdunkit]

Somehow ... I'm 100% sure it doesn't work like that ... Scouts play a big role in trades and lower executives. I believe there was a story a while ago saying how teams would sometimes send lower level management to scope out if a team would be interested in a trade ... but if it got leaked, the GM could always deny that no such talks had happened.

alright, lets assume 50 ppl were aware of the trade- why would any of the 50 share the details of the trade to an outsider? if a person within the organization notified an outsider of trade discussion, even accidentally- that person should be terminated immediately. its almost the same as someone finding out who was going to be laid off in a company and brazenly discussing the "names" with ppl prior to anyone actually being canned. likewise, if caledron were swapped for butler- caledron would be shipped to the most dysfunctional team in the league and i would imagine that caledron and his agent would be infuriated. in fact, caledron could go public with his disgust and curb any notion of him being shipped out of town before the talks picked up any traction. as for the OP coming up with the names- there have been dozens of threads over the years which have crafted a caledron for butler sway, so this isnt news for raptor fans.

Wow ... your really taking this technically ... The world isn't black and white and I have no clue why people would leak information out but they do. Like others have mentioned, the OP has reported rumours in the past with accuracy. Mods lock threads up about inside info unless the thread maker can prove they have inside connections. I'm guessing raptorsgenius has proven to be liable about the inside info he gives out ...

[danny-callahan]

I'll wait till a legit source claims this is on the table. Sounds like BS.

[A Space Cow]

Somehow ... I'm 100% sure it doesn't work like that ... Scouts play a big role in trades and lower executives. I believe there was a story a while ago saying how teams would sometimes send lower level management to scope out if a team would be interested in a trade ... but if it got leaked, the GM could always deny that no such talks had happened.

alright, lets assume 50 ppl were aware of the trade- why would any of the 50 share the details of the trade to an outsider? if a person within the organization notified an outsider of trade discussion, even accidentally- that person should be terminated immediately. its almost the same as someone finding out who was going to be laid off in a company and brazenly discussing the "names" with ppl prior to anyone actually being canned. likewise, if caledron were swapped for butler- caledron would be shipped to the most dysfunctional team in the league and i would imagine that caledron and his agent would be infuriated. in fact, caledron could go public with his disgust and curb any notion of him being shipped out of town before the talks picked up any traction. as for the OP coming up with the names- there have been dozens of threads over the years which have crafted a caledron for butler sway, so this isnt news for raptor fans.

If it's 50 people, they can't pinpoint the leak. Being fired and being traded are not similar comparisons. Basketball players acknowledge that economics and trades are part of the business. Calderon wouldn't "go public in disgust" because he's a professional on a contract. When players disrupt their teams in that fashion, it diminishes their value going forward.