Will Masai Tank 4 Flagg?

[dTox]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Trading the pick is an option to add another "lottery talent". You can do that draft night this year.

[NotMyKawhi]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Trading the pick is an option to add another "lottery talent". You can do that draft night this year.

Yeah, that would be a great idea. Trade another top 6 pick for a poeltl so we can finish bottom 6 again

[dTox]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Trading the pick is an option to add another "lottery talent". You can do that draft night this year.

You do not trade a lottery pick on a team that just came out of a bottom 6 record

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Trading the pick is an option to add another "lottery talent". You can do that draft night this year.

You do not trade a lottery pick on a team that just came out of a bottom 6 record

Yup, it has value now...it wont if we're 30w+.

[WaltFrazier]

Barnes will be miserable and gone if we don’t plan to win until after we have drafted and developed a player who isn’t even in the nba yet.

Our core is 23-25. You don’t have 3 years to become good. Next year we need to be .500 and the following year we need to be on the come up.

If they were 19-21 go ahead and tank a year. But this will become miserable and toxic if you make these guys lose for the next 3 years

Id love to hear how you would go about being a good to great team in the next 2 years.....We havn't ever signed a superstar free agent...We Have Zero major assets to trade in any deal for a Superstar player....

We have GTJR, Poeltl, Bruce Brown, Chris Boucher, Kelly Olynyk as players who could be up for trade....Thats gonna get us any kind of player back for us in a trade that would make a significant change? I don't think so...But wait we have Draft picks to trade...Look how that turned out for us...

Internal growth? Barnes, IQ, Barrett, Dick all good young players but are they ready to win anytime soon? i don't think so and to ask them to be on the level of a good NBA team is a big ask for a young team.

Free agency? We gonna sign Dennis Schroder again to be the starting PG? ...That will put us over the hump...

We have one option atm and thats to stock pile talent...The best way and the best way its always been for us to bring in talent is through the draft....The higher the picks the more likely chance of getting a Superstar in the draft....Its the best and most efficient way for us to get better while Scottie is here.

Both povs are valid here. That's why it's not a pretty picture the next few years.

[Steelo Green]

The Raptors were with Fred, Pascal and OG and were a lottery team but somehow without them, we are too good to tank?

Thunder with Shai tanked but somehow Raptors are too good to do it.

Wolves, Thunder, Celtics, Mavs are minus the Nuggets who are obviously a historical outlier the contenders in the NBA. All come from lottery picks and tanking.

We aren't even close.

[Shakril]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Thats exactly how good teams are build. You have a good competetive core and add a Talent that elevates that team.
Its exactly what we have. Its way harder to do it without that said core or if you only have that talent. How many good talents have left their team cause the team wasnt able to create a good foundation around them? Far too many.

It is delusional to think otherwise and do it like the Pistions.

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

If you can get 80-90% of that pick's max value back now. Why not?

[grimlock]

You can't tank for Flagg, our roster is to good to tank.
The best you can do is trade for a first to a team on the cusp of implosion and hope for the best. i.e. the Atlanta Hawks

[LBJKB24MJ23]

Raptors could benefit a talent in the lottery next year, for long term purposes and continutity of high end talent on the roster.

right now the Raptors have 0 bench. could change with this draft with the two later picks. but 0 expectations from them in terms of contribution this upcoming season.

Atlanta winning the lottery played against the odds. so if you're expecting the Raptors to go for play in and win the lottery or have aKawhi like trade happen soon, you're probably better off betting the Raptors going for 45+ win season instead on Fanduel this upcoming season.

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

Raptors could benefit a talent in the lottery next year, for long term purposes and continutity of high end talent on the roster.

right now the Raptors have 0 bench. could change with this draft with the two later picks. but 0 expectations from them in terms of contribution this upcoming season.

Atlanta winning the lottery played against the odds. so if you're expecting the Raptors to go for play in and win the lottery or have aKawhi like trade happen soon, you're probably better off betting the Raptors going for 45+ win season instead on Fanduel this upcoming season.

It's possible, but you'd need to add multiple all-star level players. As long as they fit the timeline, I'm fine with that.

It's a buyer's market.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

Raptors could benefit a talent in the lottery next year, for long term purposes and continutity of high end talent on the roster.

right now the Raptors have 0 bench. could change with this draft with the two later picks. but 0 expectations from them in terms of contribution this upcoming season.

Atlanta winning the lottery played against the odds. so if you're expecting the Raptors to go for play in and win the lottery or have aKawhi like trade happen soon, you're probably better off betting the Raptors going for 45+ win season instead on Fanduel this upcoming season.

It's possible, but you'd need to add multiple all-star level players. As long as they fit the timeline, I'm fine with that.

It's a buyers market.

outside of BBQ, Poeltl, Boucher, Brown + draft picks are the trade fodder for us..

[dTox]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Thats exactly how good teams are build. You have a good competetive core and add a Talent that elevates that team.
Its exactly what we have. Its way harder to do it without that said core or if you only have that talent. How many good talents have left their team cause the team wasnt able to create a good foundation around them? Far too many.

It is delusional to think otherwise and do it like the Pistions.

We have a good competitive core?

[bobbyp3588]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Why should we think that what you say carries any weight whatsoever? Who are you? What’s your basketball pedigree?

How’s your crystal ball working out in all the other facets of your life? If you’re posting on RealGM, I’d suggest not so well…
At least not traditional crystal ball well..

When you state such strong opinions as fact like you have, you lose most if not all credibility. You don’t KNOW. It’s amazing the difference if you frame it with, “I think…”. Now you’re expressing an opinion not force feeding everyone an opinion disguised as fact. We can taste the difference.

AND, by the way, we won the ‘ship without a lottery talent.

[bobbyp3588]

This team will forever be on the treadmill without adding another lottery talent to this roster, this core just isn't good enough and you are dilusional to think otherwise.

Thats exactly how good teams are build. You have a good competetive core and add a Talent that elevates that team.
Its exactly what we have. Its way harder to do it without that said core or if you only have that talent. How many good talents have left their team cause the team wasnt able to create a good foundation around them? Far too many.

It is delusional to think otherwise and do it like the Pistions.

We have a good competitive core?

Why, yes. Yes, we do.

[Mak]

Raptors will never tank on purposes, only injuries will lead them to some kind of tank. This team should be around play in if healthy at worst. We just need this roster to play together for a season so we know what we have.

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

Raptors could benefit a talent in the lottery next year, for long term purposes and continutity of high end talent on the roster.

right now the Raptors have 0 bench. could change with this draft with the two later picks. but 0 expectations from them in terms of contribution this upcoming season.

Atlanta winning the lottery played against the odds. so if you're expecting the Raptors to go for play in and win the lottery or have aKawhi like trade happen soon, you're probably better off betting the Raptors going for 45+ win season instead on Fanduel this upcoming season.

It's possible, but you'd need to add multiple all-star level players. As long as they fit the timeline, I'm fine with that.

It's a buyers market.

outside of BBQ, Poeltl, Boucher, Brown + draft picks are the trade fodder for us..

Lots of teams want to get off money, that gives us leverage.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

It's possible, but you'd need to add multiple all-star level players. As long as they fit the timeline, I'm fine with that.

It's a buyers market.

outside of BBQ, Poeltl, Boucher, Brown + draft picks are the trade fodder for us..

Lots of teams want to get off money, that gives us leverage.

depends on what they do with GTJ, Quickley, Brown. that space for the Raptors could shrink significantly. esp if they S&T GTJ for instance (probably not happening but you never know if cap strapped teams need a scorer like GTJ)

[Shakril]

The Raptors were with Fred, Pascal and OG and were a lottery team but somehow without them, we are too good to tank?

Thunder with Shai tanked but somehow Raptors are too good to do it.

Wolves, Thunder, Celtics, Mavs are minus the Nuggets who are obviously a historical outlier the contenders in the NBA. All come from lottery picks and tanking.

We aren't even close.

Wolves needed 2 decades of beeing terrible. Only a good example for bad managment, but not a good one for tanking.

Celtics had one "bad" season in the last 10 years and that was 2013/14 with a 25-59 record, which is still higher than a tanking team would have. Every other year they were in the Playoffs. I dont see where the Celtics have tanked to become good.

Mavs worst season in recent years was 2017/2018; 24-58 and thats not even bad for a "tanking" team. Before and after they were always above 30 Wins. That is not tanking thats playing hard, despite beeing bad.

Nuggets isnt an outlier, its how championship teams are built. They give their young core time to develop and over time it pays off.
But they dont lose just to have a better pick.


And regarding the Thunder, there seems to be a big misconception about.
After the George Paul, Westbrook, Carmleo Fiasko they were forced to make a firesale as long as their assetts were worth something. Of course after that this team then was terrible, but it didnt cheat the game by losing on purpose - they competed.

Their record since then was:

2021: 22 - 50
2022: 24 - 48
2023: 40 - 42
2024: 57 - 25

Most notably, they improved from year to year.

The first two years they simply were a bad team, but they developed their players by playing hard.
Most of their assetts came also through trading - not through tanking.
Of course beeing cautions with Shai was the right choice, but it was not about losing them games. It was about giving shai the time he needed to be healthy again and it paid off.

OKC didnt care if their record was 10-72 or 30-52, they wanted to develop their players. And thats how you do it.

Essentially it took them 2 years to be in the mix again.

To sum it up:

All your examples for tanking are false. If you want an example for tanking: Look at what the Pistons are doing or 76ers have done. Essentially they failed to develop their Players or/and to build around their talent. Continuity comes into mind.

Embid is everything thats left of the 76ers Tank years and the best they managed was the 2nd round in the Playoffs.
After beeing terrible so many years, you would think they achieve more than that.
OKC is about to eclipse them in their first try.

Back to the Raptors comparsion to OKC:


Raptors are in a different spot than OKC was then. Raptors have 4 young players (Dick, Barnes, Quickley, RJ) that they can build with, they have 1 veteran (Poeltl) on the roster who is young enough and can be part of that team in the future. The rest will be replaced if the opportunity arises. Essentially you already have 5 players for the rotation.

If Barnes is our Shai, than you already have what you want and just need to develop and let them compete. If you dont think Barnes is it, then explore all options to aquire the talent and/or entice a starplayer by beeing a up and coming team, which means - compete.

Tanking only ruins the development of the players and annoys them, which leads them to leave a team.
And after all that you still can strike out on good talent and stand there with empty hands.