Draft Countdown: James Harden

[TiKusDom]

^^ Paul pierce went behind

1 Michael Olowokandi (C) Nigeria Los Angeles Clippers Pacific-Jr.
2 Mike Bibby (PG) United States Vancouver Grizzlies Arizona So.
3 Raef LaFrentz (C/F) United States Denver Nuggets Kansas Sr.
4 Antawn Jamison (F) United States Toronto Raptors (traded to Golden State) North Carolina Jr.
5 Vince Carter (G/F) United States Golden State Warriors (traded to Toronto) North Carolina Jr.
6 Robert Traylor (F/C) United States Dallas Mavericks (traded to Milwaukee) Michigan Jr.
7 Jason Williams (PG) United States Sacramento Kings Florida Jr.
8 Larry Hughes (SG) United States Philadelphia 76ers Saint Louis Fr.
9 Dirk Nowitzki (PF) Germany Milwaukee Bucks (traded to Dallas) DJK Würzburg (Germany)
10 Paul Pierce (G/F) United States Boston Celtics Kansas Jr.

So basically it was a hit and miss, he should of one top 5 but slid to 10 . It is more than possible Harden falls to 9, but hes no pierce. Pierce is a lot longer, in college he was a fierce competitor who you can tell played with fire. Harden isnt as long, doesnt seem to have the same angry fire, athletically a step behind, very hard to compare the two apart from the fact that they rely on finesse more so than other wings.

[Gruel]

Harden should probably develop a Jason Richardson/Quentin Richardson postgame. Similar body type to both.

[Pchu]

I couldn't think of a comp for him.

He is not Brandon Roy, Roy is two inches taller than Harden. And Roy can always get to spots on the floor somehow, but I don't see the same thing with Harden.

However, he is probably the most NBA ready SG in this draft. His stock might drop if his workout didn't go as well. Maybe the Raptors could have a steal at 9.

[SpaceJam]

I couldn't think of a comp for him.

He is not Brandon Roy, Roy is two inches taller than Harden. And Roy can always get to spots on the floor somehow, but I don't see the same thing with Harden.

However, he is probably the most NBA ready SG in this draft. His stock might drop if his workout didn't go as well. Maybe the Raptors could have a steal at 9.

In the sense of craftiness on the floor and with the ball, I can compare Harden to Roy. Harden has the ability and desire to drive inside which makes him that much better of a prospect at the 2. I don't know about his handles or defense, however if they were both above average that would still make him a great player to pick top 5.

[Anatomize]

The lack of post up game leads me to think he's more of a Michael Redd than a Pierce.

[Gruel]

+1 ^
All along I've compared him to a John Salmons/Michael Redd.

[rdtx2005]

WHAT?.. a Harden thread without his BIGGEST FAN CHOKER?

[MacDaddy]

The lack of post up game leads me to think he's more of a Michael Redd than a Pierce.

Absolutely not. He's not nearly the shooter that Redd is, but he has an uncanny ability to get to the basket and finish. The reason people compare him to Paul Pierce is that he seems to be able to get to the hoop, or make space for shots with herky-jerky moves that throw his defenders off balance. If by post game, you mean the ability to catch the ball near the basket and finish, there aren't a lot of college guards right now who can do that more efficiently.

James Harden is a smart, unselfish basketball player who makes great decisions on and off the ball. Crying about whether he's 6'4" and change or 6'5" and change is foolish - the guy can really play. There were enough games this season where he took over in the clutch and carried his team that I wouldn't be the least bit worried about his lousy tournament showing.

[ZeriousLy]

WHAT?.. a Harden thread without his BIGGEST FAN CHOKER?

What does that have to do with anything? You're basing your assessment off of 3 games. Harden's body of work still makes him a top 5 pick.

[Anatomize]

The lack of post up game leads me to think he's more of a Michael Redd than a Pierce.

Absolutely not. He's not nearly the shooter that Redd is, but he has an uncanny ability to get to the basket and finish. The reason people compare him to Paul Pierce is that he seems to be able to get to the hoop, or make space for shots with herky-jerky moves that throw his defenders off balance. If by post game, you mean the ability to catch the ball near the basket and finish, there aren't a lot of college guards right now who can do that more efficiently.

James Harden is a smart, unselfish basketball player who makes great decisions on and off the ball. Crying about whether he's 6'4" and change or 6'5" and change is foolish - the guy can really play. There were enough games this season where he took over in the clutch and carried his team that I wouldn't be the least bit worried about his lousy tournament showing.

Do you think Michael Redd averages 21 points a game only on shots?

The last four years he's averaged 7 freethrow attempts per game, he hits 2 3's, he's a better off the dribble shooter and mid range, but they both possess a nice mix of driving and catch and shoot.

Redd and Harden are not very explosive or athletic. Defensively, Redd has never been considered a very good defender, Harden's average size and average lateral quickness will cause him similar problems guarding some of the explosive 2's in the league, but eventually I think he'll improve tremendously in this department

What separates the two is mid range, off the dribble shooting, and Harden's passing ability.

I'm wishing we draft Harden badly, I think he's exactly what our team needs. Michael Redd is underrated, he may not be the best all around player, but I don't think any of us would cry from a 20 point shooter/slasher who gets to the line on our team.

Cleveland tried badly to get Redd, in the right system, such a gifted scorer can flourish.

The reason i think our system fits Harden is because he's able to create off the dribble, he makes smart passes, he plays a team oriented game, he can catch and shoot (bodes well with Jose), and he penetrates/gets to the line.

I think he would make the Raps an immediate playoff team, and I hope the lottery plays in our favor so we can grab him. Harden is the type of player who would compliment Bargs/Bosh beautifully.

[Kayjay]

^^ Paul pierce went behind

1 Michael Olowokandi (C) Nigeria Los Angeles Clippers Pacific-Jr.
2 Mike Bibby (PG) United States Vancouver Grizzlies Arizona So.
3 Raef LaFrentz (C/F) United States Denver Nuggets Kansas Sr.
4 Antawn Jamison (F) United States Toronto Raptors (traded to Golden State) North Carolina Jr.
5 Vince Carter (G/F) United States Golden State Warriors (traded to Toronto) North Carolina Jr.
6 Robert Traylor (F/C) United States Dallas Mavericks (traded to Milwaukee) Michigan Jr.
7 Jason Williams (PG) United States Sacramento Kings Florida Jr.
8 Larry Hughes (SG) United States Philadelphia 76ers Saint Louis Fr.
9 Dirk Nowitzki (PF) Germany Milwaukee Bucks (traded to Dallas) DJK Würzburg (Germany)
10 Paul Pierce (G/F) United States Boston Celtics Kansas Jr.

So basically it was a hit and miss, he should of one top 5 but slid to 10 . It is more than possible Harden falls to 9, but hes no pierce. Pierce is a lot longer, in college he was a fierce competitor who you can tell played with fire. Harden isnt as long, doesnt seem to have the same angry fire, athletically a step behind, very hard to compare the two apart from the fact that they rely on finesse more so than other wings.

That draft order makes more sense backwards than it does forward.

[sh00n]

I'd love to nab Harden.

Man, I read that fast and saw nob. I need sleep.

As long as we get top 3, I'm happy. If it ends up top 2, I'm ecstatic. Harden would make me really excited for this season, Ricky or Blake would put me right back into the mix of hardcore devotion to this team.

[Undefeated]

Redd and Harden are not very explosive or athletic. Defensively, Redd has never been considered a very good defender, Harden's average size and average lateral quickness will cause him similar problems guarding some of the explosive 2's in the league, but eventually I think he'll improve tremendously in this department

True, Redd and Harden are not the explosive type of players, but in my opinion, Harden’s size and lateral quickness won’t be that huge of a factor once he does enter league even if he was to defend the explosive SGs. If you watch Harden play, he’s a very smart player since he has the perfect timing to make a steal or a block… Basketball IQ is greater than having the explosiveness… You see, Joey has the explosiveness yet he’s dumb as rock, but if he did have B-ball IQ, he would be a much better player…

I'm wishing we draft Harden badly, I think he's exactly what our team needs. Michael Redd is underrated, he may not be the best all around player, but I don't think any of us would cry from a 20 point shooter/slasher who gets to the line on our team.

Any player that can take some of the offensive load off of Bosh, than I am fine with it. Redd lacks the IQ which won’t make him as good of a defender like Harden. I agree, this team needs James Harden… James Harden FTW!

Cleveland tried badly to get Redd, in the right system, such a gifted scorer can flourish.

Not the right system, but any player with two legs playing with LeBron will make them look much better than they were before (i.e. Mo Williams)…

[Dr Positivity]

Love him... LOVE him.

His athleticism is actually a bit underrated I think. His first step is better than Derozan's. This bodes very well for his transition into the NBA.

I'm thinking a 21/5/5 player in the NBA, which is awesome

[Kabookalu]

A best case scenario for James Harden is Brandon Roy. A safe comparison is John Salmons. Worse case scenario is Anthony Parker.

If Harden is available when our pick comes around and we skip him, I'm going to hang BC's, Sam Mitchell's, and Will Solomon's heads on a pitch fork.

[saham]

The Raptors need James Harden. BC should do everything possible to get Harden. If that means trade the pick + cash/Humphries for Harden + bad contract, i would still do it.

[Anatomize]

If we can somehow get Mike Miller in here at SF, and draft Harden, I would be really excited for the Raps.

What does Mike Miller's contract look like? is there any possibility to S&T Marion over to them? I love Marion but I think Mike Miller brings so many weapons offensively, and adds another ball handling passer who can shoot and drive out of the SF spot, he's also a very good rebounder at his position. Miller is also a pretty pesky on ball defender, takes charges, and brings good team help defense. Personally, I think of him as being one of the most underrated small forwards.

[Raps in 4]

If we can somehow get Mike Miller in here at SF, and draft Harden, I would be really excited for the Raps.

What does Mike Miller's contract look like? is there any possibility to S&T Marion over to them? I love Marion but I think Mike Miller brings so many weapons offensively, and adds another ball handling passer who can shoot and drive out of the SF spot, he's also a very good rebounder at his position. Miller is also a pretty pesky on ball defender, takes charges, and brings good team help defense. Personally, I think of him as being one of the most underrated small forwards.

He made $9 million last year.

[Anatomize]

how many years does Mike Miller have remaining?

[Dennis P]

Got this from draft express. He would DEFINITELY be our guy if he's available when we pick.

James Harden’s situational statistics should ease many of the concerns teams have about his game. It appears that he's one of those players who "finds a way to get by" despite his shortcomings.

Very efficient, while maintaining fairly high usage rates, Harden made 47% of his shots in logged possessions –an excellent percentage for a two. None of the 5 players who used as many possessions as Harden (Marcus Thornton, Jermaine Taylor, Jodie Meeks, Jerel McNeal, Dar Tucker) were as efficient as he was from the field. Out of those players, only Meeks' PPP was higher than Harden’s, thanks to how many 3's he made, while Thornton matched him at 1 PPP.

A lot of Harden’s efficiency comes from an area that most probably wouldn’t expect it to. In spite of his perceived athletic limitations, Harden was a terrific finisher around the basket this season. Not only did he get to the rim more than any other player on our list (8.7 Pos/G), he ranked in first comfortably at 1.25 PPP. Considering the questions surrounding his ability to translate his finishing ability to the NBA, these numbers can only help his cause. Ironically, they don’t seem to offer much support for one of his bigger perceived strengths.

Harden's biggest shortcoming ended up being in the perimeter shooting department. He was terrific on the very few catch and shoot opportunities he received with his feet set (2.4 Pos/G), but really struggled when being contested (.85 PPP) or shooting off the dribble (.73 PPP). In fact, the 27% he shot from the field off the dribble is the lowest of any of the nineteen players in our sample. Fortunately for Harden, this is clearly a part of his game he can work on, but he'll have to put in the appropriate time in the gym. In terms of things a team can count on him to do well in the short-run, his ability to score with space deserves consideration at the top of that list.

Harden's intelligence and excellent skill-level really shine through in his ability to score in transition--which was an important part of his game in college. He ranks behind only Wayne Ellington (who obviously had a big advantage playing under Roy Williams' up-tempo system with Ty Lawson) in this category at 1.22 PPP.

Something NBA types will be happy to learn is that Harden created quite a bit of offense by himself in isolation type situations—his 5.2 possessions per game ranks just behind Dar Tucker amongst the 19 we looked at. He still has quite a bit of room to improve here, though, only ranking 7th in PPP with .89. We should point out that three of the players (Paul Harris, Alex Ruoff and Eric Devendorf) ranked ahead of him here were very low usage types—the only two who really stand out as being superior in this aspect are Jeff Teague (5 possessions per game, 1.08 PPP) and Jack McClinton (4 possessions per game, 1.07 PPP). Harden turns the ball over at a fairly high rate, and isn't as effective driving right (39% FG) as he is going left (44% FG)—which makes sense since he’s left-handed. He also doesn't draw quite as many fouls as you might hope. However, it is more than safe to say that Harden could be a very effective offensive player if team’s put him position to succeed.