Accept it, Toronto: You

[Trax416]

Wait who thinks Miami is a big market and Toronto isn't? The Raptors are worth more then Miami is, sell more tickets then Miami does, and have a sports team in every pro league.

Toronto has one of every single professional franchise. We are on the verge of getting an NFL team and would have more pro teams then any city in America because not only do we have an MLS team, but we would also have a CFL team. We also have the Honda Indy.

Toronto is a gigantic sports market. The Leafs are the biggest team in the NHL. Toronto FC is the biggest team in MLS. Blue Jays may be struggling, but they make more revenue then most NBA teams. Toronto FC sells more tickets to each game then Boston does.

Toronto is a huge sports market. Basketball is still growing. If the Raptors can capture the hockey market, we would be the second largest team in the NBA right now, (Leafs are worth almost as much as the Knicks, dollar for dollar, they are actually worth more).

[Hank_Scorpio]

He's right. Toronto is not New York, Miami, LA, or Boston.

But its also not Indianapolis. Its not Charlotte. Its not Denver or Portland or Salt Lake City or Sacramento. Its not San Antonio or Oklahoma City. Its not Milwaukee or Minnesota. Those are cities where players start to seriously think about whether they want to play there. I think Toronto has transcended those places.

I'd put Toronto in a small group of teams with Philly, Atlanta, Phoenix, Houston and Dallas. These teams tend to neither really benefit nor suffer from their location - they are cities where players are generally happy to play. Now I'd rank Toronto as a better city than any of them, but it suffers from being in Canada, and so is on par with them.


So what do we learn here? Nothing as far as I can see.

[sanity]

Toronto isn't New York, but Boston isn't New York and most definitely Miami is not New York. A small market that is backed by an entire country isn't the same type of small market that... hmm... Memphis, Ohio is.

[Tofubeque]

Laughed at this comment:

"doesn’t the writer of this article see that when Yao Ming scores a basket, half of china jumps up? Or when Bargani hits a 3, Toronto and Italy jump up? What happens when Stephon Marbury scores a basket? 5000 people in New York light a joint?"

[Tanking It]

I was going to create a post on the general board but I will make my point here. One of the major myths is that a player will get more attention and hence publicity money playing in the major market of LA, NY, Chicago, and Miami (according to this dweeb), but there is absolutely no proof of this. In fact it could almost be proven that Toronto creates more recognition than almost any other argument.

Has not NY players proved that there is an affect, when you look at things like jersey sales? Or how did players like Marbury and now Nate, have top ten selling jersey's in the league?

I think Nate is the greatest example, Nike would give him this own shoe over bosh. Does that not say something?

[KJS1508]

I don't see how being a NY or LA matters really. They are both big market teams and yet one still has no chance in hell of winning anything. So does being a big market team really help?

[Hank_Scorpio]

I think Nate is the greatest example, Nike would give him this own shoe over bosh. Does that not say something?

http://www.sneakerright.com/product_353.html

[Hank_Scorpio]

I don't see how being a NY or LA matters really. They are both big market teams and yet one still has no chance in hell of winning anything. So does being a big market team really help?

Of course it does.

Its just that being a big market team does not trump crappy management. It just makes it a little bit easier. If all other factors are equal, what player is going to choose Indianapolis over LA? None.

[Ari_Emanuel]

SMALL MARKET FRANCHISE??!! TORONTO IS ONE OF THE YOUNGEST FRANCHISES IN THE LEAGUE IN A REGION THAT IS STILL DEVELOPING ITS INTEREST IN BASKETBALL AND ALREADY ITS ONE OF THE BIGGEST MARKETS IN THE LEAGUE!!!


Articles like this just confirm my suspicion that Americans have a deep routed resentment and jealousy towards us for having such great city (Toronto) and economically powerful region (Southern Ontario). Since the Great War, Americans have been in denial about their failure to conquer not only Canada's heartland, but our entire country as a whole. They've responded by trying to convey indifference (ie, who cares about Canada) which is exactly the way people act when they know they can't have something. It works when you pull it off with class but in this instance, it betrays insecurity and foolishness. If Yao Ming can be voted in as an all-star year after year, and if Chris Bosh can become a perennial all-star, then it is absolutely ridiculous to reason that Chris Bosh will have trouble making it into the HOF because he play a few degrees north of the border. He will have the support of two of the most populous regions in North America when his ticket is called (Texas and Canada) which together make up more than 10% of the population of the entire continent. He will also have the respect of the entire world if he takes this franchise to the NBA finals because it will put him in the record books. As a matter of fact Chris Bosh is in an enviable position, if he's man enough to take advantage of it, because he is playing for a international franchise that will continue to grow its brand globally as it develops its winning culture and markets itself and its international talents across Europe.

The truth is, half of the American franchises operate at a loss because the burn through cash like Opera burns through a box of doughnuts. Toronto is one of the few franchises that is viable and anyone who knows anything about business will understand that that will make Toronto relevant for as long as the NBA exists.

End rant.

[Volcano]

people who don't really follow the NBA don't know who CP3 or Ray Allen are anyways

I don't follow hockey..but are we considered a small market team in the NHL?

[Reignman]

As Fairview and Macdaddy mentioned, we just need to start winning some **** games.

An example of that: San Antonio. A small market with big market perception because they keep **** winning.

And BTW, by the tone of this guys article, sounds like he got banged by a She-man on Church St. in Toronto.

[Ballin]

Maybe Im misunderstanding what he's saying or a lot of you guys are but I think what he was trying to say is outside of Toronto or Canada there really is no market for the Raptors (or Jays or whatever). Raptors are Canadas only team so we will rake in revenue sure, but south of the border people probably don't even know or care who else is on our team other than Bosh and he's saying Bosh is a big enough star- in a market that is recognized in the States, he would be much bigger. Need proof? We rank 29th in the NBA for road attendance, http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/attendanc ... asonType=2

When Raptors are in town in the States... No one cares.

[ForeverTFC]

These writers need to recognize that sharing a city with the Maple Leafs is a hard task. The Leafs are to the NHL, what the Cowboys and Lakers are to the NFL and NBA respectively.

The Raptors are the second team of this city, and outside of Boston, NY, LA and perhaps Dallas, no other city can hold two top level teams like Toronto.

We are one of the only cities that has a team in four of the five major leagues in North America including the NHL, NBA, MLB, and MLS. We are on our way to bringing an NFL team to this city.

Our MLS, NHL and NBA teams are in the top third of the league revenue wise. All these teams, including the Jays are never in financial trouble.

Looking at the sports culture of this city as a whole, it is a moronic statement to refer to any of these franchises as 'small market'.

[nikeone]

Accept it dimemag you will never be in the big leagues, SI, ESPN, Sporting news hell im sure most people would rather read a two page sports page in a local paper before they pick up that joke of a magazine. I rememebr a while back you were offering free magazines and even then you couldn't give them away.

Tell me why I should give a damn what your worthless mag who employs grade school writers has to say?

[Rebel INS]

I was going to create a post on the general board but I will make my point here. One of the major myths is that a player will get more attention and hence publicity money playing in the major market of LA, NY, Chicago, and Miami (according to this dweeb), but there is absolutely no proof of this. In fact it could almost be proven that Toronto creates more recognition than almost any other argument.

Has not NY players proved that there is an affect, when you look at things like jersey sales? Or how did players like Marbury and now Nate, have top ten selling jersey's in the league?

I think Nate is the greatest example, Nike would give him this own shoe over bosh. Does that not say something?

This is off topic but the only guys that have their own shoe are guys like Kobe and Lebron...everyone else just gets a customized edition of an existing design. Even tmac/garnett/dwight..etc all just get different colored versions of Creator/commador's

Nate's shoes are just custom Foamposites/flightposites...overrated and overpriced kick btw

[Yeezus_]

I hope the writer comes here and reads my post. He is seriously dumb. All his arguements are weak with no real evidence. Everything he presents can be easily counterd. I never even heard of the guy before, probably just trying to get attention by bashing on Toronto.

[nikeone]

I was going to create a post on the general board but I will make my point here. One of the major myths is that a player will get more attention and hence publicity money playing in the major market of LA, NY, Chicago, and Miami (according to this dweeb), but there is absolutely no proof of this. In fact it could almost be proven that Toronto creates more recognition than almost any other argument.

Has not NY players proved that there is an affect, when you look at things like jersey sales? Or how did players like Marbury and now Nate, have top ten selling jersey's in the league?

I think Nate is the greatest example, Nike would give him this own shoe over bosh. Does that not say something?

Nate became famous because of the dunk contest not because he plays in New York, if the guy never won that dunk contest and couldn't jump through the roof nike wouldn't give a damn and he wouldn't sell a single jersey.

[JYD]

Hank made a good post up there...Toronto is middle of the road, at least for most NBA players today. Miami and NY and LA and will attract players on the city alone. I think Toronto is well liked in NBA circles, but when you add everything up it isn't a destination of desire. It's not some backwater town either though.

However, Toronto can easily be considered a big market team when it comes to the pool of foreign talent out there, which is only getting bigger. It's not a coincidence Belinelli got traded here, and we all know how much the Euro players we've had/have now like it here.

I think when you add the fact NA players generally like playing in Toronto (much more than they did years ago) to the fact we are easily the number one destination of choice for a rapidly expanding pool of foreign talent, the argument can be made that we are at least turning the corner into a big market franchise.

And if you want to talk endorsement attractiveness, long term we could be very attractive to all NBA players. If the team becomes popular among european and other international fans, then every player that plays for us get that much more exposure worldwide and endorsement opportunities can present themselves. Which is why it's very savvy to market this team as international.

[Shaazzam]

Whenever anyone needs to generate traffic all they need to do is rip Canada or the Raptors and teh interwebz goes batty.

[Tofubeque]

I think Nate is the greatest example, Nike would give him this own shoe over bosh. Does that not say something?

Big men don't sell shoes.

Guys with freakishly high verticals sell shoes.