Game 57: Utah Jazz (26-30) vs Charlotte Hornets (13-41)

[Inigo Montoya]

Did anyone catch Sexton making a 3 at the 8:09 mark of the third quarter, and then the camera zoomed in on him just as he says (and it's even audible) F--- You! and giving the finger to someone? That was hilarious.

Spoiler:

[Jammer]

Your main problem last night, and recently, has been defense. Defense on the ball, and defense on the back line (Collins played well but is still undersized and laterally slow to react). But that is what it is.

You played an undersized 1, 2, 3 lineup and Sexton, Clarkson and George were all about the same, with rookie George on the short end with 5 Turnovers. Yet, Otto Porter, Jr. sat on the bench, supposedly fully healthy, and would definately have helped the defense and possibly the offense as well with some more force around the basket. The minutes at the 1, 2, 3 were divided up as:

34 Clarkson (played much of his time at SF)
31 George
26 Sexton
25 Dunn

plus Hendricks got 26 minutes and Sensabaugh 13.

It just seems to me that if you wanted to win yesterday's game vs. Charlotte, you should have given Otto Porter, Jr. some run. If I was him and sat out last night's game I'd be STEAMING and SCREAMING GET ME OUT OF HERE. No surprise the press reports this morning have him slated for a buyout. it might not have mattered, he might have already asked for one. But I sure as hell think he should have logged some time at SF, no matter what the future plans. That is, if you were actually trying to win that game.

[Inigo Montoya]

I mean, the Jazz could have played Kessler more than 17 minutes. I'm sure it would have helped the defense. With all due respect to Porter Jr., he's not in the Jazz's plans. If they wanted a defense from a wing they could have kept Agbaji who is also much younger, or Fontecchio. It's clear they care more about developing Hendricks (and maybe the Sensei) at this point even if it costs them games. In time, he also could be a good wing defender.

[red4hf]

I mean, the Jazz could have played Kessler more than 17 minutes. I'm sure it would have helped the defense. With all due respect to Porter Jr., he's not in the Jazz's plans. If they wanted a defense from a wing they could have kept Agbaji who is also much younger, or Fontecchio. It's clear they care more about developing Hendricks (and maybe the Sensei) at this point even if it costs them games. In time, he also could be a good wing defender.

Hmm.....Is that why Hendricks didn't actually play in the 4th, as Hardy sat him in favor of 31 year old Clarkson...... Clarkson was -19, Hendricks +10......

I mean, there could be a rational explanation, I'd love to hear it........

[Inigo Montoya]

I mean, the Jazz could have played Kessler more than 17 minutes. I'm sure it would have helped the defense. With all due respect to Porter Jr., he's not in the Jazz's plans. If they wanted a defense from a wing they could have kept Agbaji who is also much younger, or Fontecchio. It's clear they care more about developing Hendricks (and maybe the Sensei) at this point even if it costs them games. In time, he also could be a good wing defender.

Hmm.....Is that why Hendricks didn't actually play in the 4th, as Hardy sat him in favor of 31 year old Clarkson...... Clarkson was -19, Hendricks +10......

I mean, there could be a rational explanation, I'd love to hear it........

Hendricks got 26 minutes which is a good run and what George was getting on average before he was made a starter again after the deadline. I'd say that's a fair amount of minutes for developing and much more than Kessler got.

I'm not a huge fan of playing Clarkson and Markkanen so many minutes but it looks like Hardy is still trying to win games, hence the minutes for Clarkson. Whether or not playing Clarkson contributes to winning games, that's a different discussion.

As for +/-, I never liked this stat so I've tried to make a habit of not using it or building my arguments around it, and I don't even know if Hardy knows what the +/- is for each player during the game, let alone if he makes decisions based on it.

[red4hf]

I mean, the Jazz could have played Kessler more than 17 minutes. I'm sure it would have helped the defense. With all due respect to Porter Jr., he's not in the Jazz's plans. If they wanted a defense from a wing they could have kept Agbaji who is also much younger, or Fontecchio. It's clear they care more about developing Hendricks (and maybe the Sensei) at this point even if it costs them games. In time, he also could be a good wing defender.

Hmm.....Is that why Hendricks didn't actually play in the 4th, as Hardy sat him in favor of 31 year old Clarkson...... Clarkson was -19, Hendricks +10......

I mean, there could be a rational explanation, I'd love to hear it........

Hendricks got 26 minutes which is a good run and what George was getting on average before he was made a starter again after the deadline. I'd say that's a fair amount of minutes for developing and much more than Kessler got.

I'm not a huge fan of playing Clarkson and Markkanen so many minutes but it looks like Hardy is still trying to win games, hence the minutes for Clarkson. Whether or not playing Clarkson contributes to winning games, that's a different discussion.

As for +/-, I never liked this stat so I've tried to make a habit of not using it or building my arguments around it, and I don't even know if Hardy knows what the +/- is for each player during the game, let alone if he makes decisions based on it.

That explanation would make perfect sense IF Clarkson was having a great game, or even a decent one, and Hardy was riding the hot hand...... That's not what happened though..... Clarkson did nothing to justify his minutes, in fact he was actively hurting the team with his play...... Hardy's inability, or refusal, to make in-game adjustments is very worrying......

[Crunch 99]

It just seems to me that if you wanted to win yesterday's game vs. Charlotte, you should have given Otto Porter, Jr. some run.

I could be wrong, but I don't think Porter was with the team and available to play. The article below from a couple of days ago says the Jazz allowed him to leave the team. When the Jazz traded for him, I doubt the Jazz expected to buy him out, but things quickly started moving that direction. Porter wants to join a contender.

2/21/24 https://thejnotes.com/posts/otto-porter-may-already-be-done-with-the-utah-jazz-01hq72k2y5g3

[Inigo Montoya]

That explanation would make perfect sense IF Clarkson was having a great game, or even a decent one, and Hardy was riding the hot hand...... That's not what happened though..... Clarkson did nothing to justify his minutes, in fact he was actively hurting the team with his play...... Hardy's inability, or refusal, to make in-game adjustments is very worrying......

I think Hardy was desperate for a bucket. The Jazz had a drought in the 4th quarter that caused them to lose their lead. Sure, Clarkson wasn't good but you know how he is, the guy is a professional scorer who is always a threat to score even when he's missing 10 in a row.

[bkohler]

I mean, the Jazz could have played Kessler more than 17 minutes. I'm sure it would have helped the defense. With all due respect to Porter Jr., he's not in the Jazz's plans. If they wanted a defense from a wing they could have kept Agbaji who is also much younger, or Fontecchio. It's clear they care more about developing Hendricks (and maybe the Sensei) at this point even if it costs them games. In time, he also could be a good wing defender.

I might be wrong but it really didn’t feel like it was the rookies that cost the team the game last night. Honestly I’d have preferred to lose with them on the floor than seeing our veterans flounder. I might have just been imagining it but it feels like Clarkson is not good right now. And I think we can probably say for certain now that Kessler isn’t a mentally strong player yet. He seems to be in his own head more than most but maybe I’m just reading that wrong. Clarkson was -19 last night and Kessler was -18.

[Inigo Montoya]

I mean, the Jazz could have played Kessler more than 17 minutes. I'm sure it would have helped the defense. With all due respect to Porter Jr., he's not in the Jazz's plans. If they wanted a defense from a wing they could have kept Agbaji who is also much younger, or Fontecchio. It's clear they care more about developing Hendricks (and maybe the Sensei) at this point even if it costs them games. In time, he also could be a good wing defender.

I might be wrong but it really didn’t feel like it was the rookies that cost the team the game last night. Honestly I’d have preferred to lose with them on the floor than seeing our veterans flounder. I might have just been imagining it but it feels like Clarkson is not good right now. And I think we can probably say for certain now that Kessler isn’t a mentally strong player yet. He seems to be in his own head more than most but maybe I’m just reading that wrong. Clarkson was -19 last night and Kessler was -18.

I'm not saying that rookies cost us the game, like they played awful and made glaring mistakes that put the Jazz in a hole or something, it's just that if instead of playing Hendricks and Sensei the Jazz were playing Fontecchio and Olynyk they'd probably win this game, and possibly win it with ease. It's the price of development. But that doesn't mean the coach isn't still trying to win the game.

[Jammer]

Yeah, it was Clarkson at SF with the small guard lineup that concerned me. I would have thought Porter at SF would have helped defensively and the way Clarkson was playing, possibly offensively as well, but definately defensively.

[bkohler]

I think Hardy was desperate for a bucket. The Jazz had a drought in the 4th quarter that caused them to lose their lead. Sure, Clarkson wasn't good but you know how he is, the guy is a professional scorer who is always a threat to score even when he's missing 10 in a row.

I think it might be time for us (and the Jazz) to come to grips with the fact that Jordan is not the player he was last year, and last year was a step down from previous years. He's currently shooting 29% from three, has as sub replacement level PER, is considered the fourth worst player in the NBA (!) according to BPM, His defensive rating is 511/543 and worse his offensive rating is 402/543. DPM says he's the worse top 7 rotation defender in the NBA. His true shooting percentage is 182 out of 196 players that qualify.

It's hard for me to say this but it might be time for him to move completely out of the rotation - maybe even take a few weeks off to rest. He's now functioning nearly entirely off of reputation and his +/- numbers for individual games tell the same story. The only time he's put together back to back positive plus minus numbers also happened to be when the Jazz went on a winning streak. Maybe the key to the Jazz wining is just replacing his minutes with well... anyone, as there's only 5 players that Vorp would say wouldn't lead to more wins if you replaced his minutes with theirs.

[bkohler]

I'm not saying that rookies cost us the game, like they played awful and made glaring mistakes that put the Jazz in a hole or something, it's just that if instead of playing Hendricks and Sensei the Jazz were playing Fontecchio and Olynyk they'd probably win this game, and possibly win it with ease. It's the price of development. But that doesn't mean the coach isn't still trying to win the game.

I get that point of view, I personally think that if Font and Olynyk had played this game and taken the rookies minutes, and the other veterans had played as poorly as they did we still would have lost. To me it's not that Font/Olynyk were taking the rookies minutes its that they were taking the minutes of other starters who aren't positive contributors (Clarkson / and at times Collins)

[red4hf]

That explanation would make perfect sense IF Clarkson was having a great game, or even a decent one, and Hardy was riding the hot hand...... That's not what happened though..... Clarkson did nothing to justify his minutes, in fact he was actively hurting the team with his play...... Hardy's inability, or refusal, to make in-game adjustments is very worrying......

I think Hardy was desperate for a bucket. The Jazz had a drought in the 4th quarter that caused them to lose their lead. Sure, Clarkson wasn't good but you know how he is, the guy is a professional scorer who is always a threat to score even when he's missing 10 in a row.

I get that argument, and nothing against Clarkson, one of my favorite players, but if you run the same play for the same guy, several times in a row, and you get nothing, and you stick with it, for a whole quarter, that just doesn't say much about you as a coach......

Not to mention that we never should have been in this position in the first place....... There's no excuse for us not winning that game by 20......

[Crunch 99]

Rookies are fun to watch right now,playing loose.

I found myself hoping Hendricks would come back in, and not just because I want to see him playing more... honestly, I didn't think that would happen for quite a while, but tonight, the rookies have been noticeably giving more effort.

Yes, I thought we might see Hendricks play some in Q4 after he got his mojo going in Q3 with 12pts on 5-6fga, 1-2 threes, 1-1FT, 4 rebs (3 off), 1 ast and +9 in 10:13 mins. It's great to see some positive signs of life from the young rookie!

Note: Stats above were edited after I got corrected Q3 detail from Popcorn Machine:
http://popcornmachine.net/gf?date=20240222&game=CHAUTH

[bkohler]

Rookies are fun to watch right now,playing loose.

I found myself hoping Hendricks would come back in, and not just because I want to see him playing more... honestly, I didn't think that would happen for quite a while, but tonight, the rookies have been noticeably giving more effort.

Yes, I thought we might see Hendricks play some in Q4 after he got his mojo going in Q3 with 12pts on 5-6fga, 1-2 threes, 1-1FT, 2 rebs, 2 ast and +4 in 10:13 mins. His nine boards for the game, including 4 orebs, were good too. It's great to see some positive signs of life from the young rookie!

This was my big takeaway from the game. I just want to see some flashes from our rookies, and we got that the other day with Keyonte, and now there are some great flashes from Hendricks. I loved the effort, the defense (that block that then somehow went in against Bridges was wild), and some building of confidence. He still looks really lost on offense, but that's something that I think will get cleaned up with time, as knowing where to go and where to be will come with time.

[Crunch 99]

I found myself hoping Hendricks would come back in, and not just because I want to see him playing more... honestly, I didn't think that would happen for quite a while, but tonight, the rookies have been noticeably giving more effort.

Yes, I thought we might see Hendricks play some in Q4 after he got his mojo going in Q3 with 12pts on 5-6fga, 1-2 threes, 1-1FT, 2 rebs, 2 ast and +4 in 10:13 mins. His nine boards for the game, including 4 orebs, were good too. It's great to see some positive signs of life from the young rookie!

This was my big takeaway from the game. I just want to see some flashes from our rookies, and we got that the other day with Keyonte, and now there are some great flashes from Hendricks. I loved the effort, the defense (that block that then somehow went in against Bridges was wild), and some building of confidence. He still looks really lost on offense, but that's something that I think will get cleaned up with time, as knowing where to go and where to be will come with time.

Edit: I made errors for Hendricks' Q3 stats on my initial try above. He was actually even a bit better, with 4 rebs, 3 OREBs, +9, and 1 ast in Q3. See Q3 stats in Popcorn Machine:
http://popcornmachine.net/gf?date=20240222&game=CHAUTH

[bkohler]

oooo I've never seen this popcorn machine before, that's fun!

[AGE1207]

So many Jazz fans complained about how the Jazz picked Hendricks at #9 and aren't playing him and now that they do you're not even going to watch? To each his own. I can enjoy games even when the Jazz aren't winning.

I am not going through all of my posts to see if I said anything about the Jazz playing Hendricks. I admit on some fan discussion boards I expressed comments about the Jazz looking for more picks but they couldn't even get the #9 pick of the 2024 draft on the floor. That is not me complaining about Hendricks not playing.

A long time ago I accepted the Jazz most likely will not get a title. I have said multiple times the Lakers will get 4 more titles before the Jazz get back to the WCF. I started that comment before Lebron joined the Lakers. The Lakers need 3 more titles to prove me right. I bought the Jazz BS from 1987 (when I started following the Jazz) until about 2010. Now I recognize it is just a big business and everything the Jazz say is just a sales pitch to make more money. I have heard the same BS Ainge, Zanik and Smith are selling from their predecessors. WHAT ELSE CAN THEY SAY? I truly believed LHM was hungry for a title. I haven't seen that enthusiasm from the Jazz since he passed. Maybe I am just a cynical old guy but I am what I am.

I don't think you're cynical, and I agree with what you're saying. I've felt like this for a very long time, pretty much.

But I will say that I don't think that you hire a guy like Ainge just to continue to wallow in mediocrity as a conscious decision. If Smith wanted to continue with the same track, he could have just kept Dennis Lindsey. But at some point we also need to look at Jazz fans as part of the problem. My impression is that Jazz fans have a very low, and perhaps the lowest, tolerance for losing. They cannot accept bad teams, which kind of perpetuates the problem we've experienced of building a 45-50 win team, make the first round of the playoffs, maybe win it once in a while, and that's it. This seems to be good enough for too many people, which gives the ownership the support to keep doing it.

I give credit to Smith and Ainge for being willing to blow up the Mitchell-Gobert team when they could have ridden that core for years and get the same results. And they did it in a season when the Allstar game was in SLC, no less. This gives me the impression that they are trying to do better than what we're used to. But that means we're in a rebuild and right away people start complaining that the team isn't good. Well, yeah, that's part of a rebuild. But Jazz fans seem to show very little patience for this. Which is maybe why they're not going all in on tanking and half-assing it. If there was a support from fans for proper tanking, if people were willing to watch games even when the Jazz aren't that good, that gives the FO a lot more leeway to properly tank.

No disrespect but I don’t think you can put this one on the fans and the complaint isn’t that the team is not good, on the contrary. The complaint is that 2 years now we have seen a team outperform itself and rather than rewarding this at the trade deadline, our FO prefers to punish them.
Last year u could still argue that the strong draft warranted such a move, this year u can’t. This particular draft is weak, we owe OKC a protected pick anyway and u could sense a mile away this team was actually having fun, which is a rare thing in the NBA. Maybe they could have gotten to the play ins, maybe not but either way it would have been a valuable experience.
The FO kept players that wanted out and ousted players that wanted to stay. They left us with an unbalanced and unmotivated crew. We hear about a narrowly missed trade that would have made us stronger but simultaneously read about how our trades allow ups to look at our rookies as part of the “masterplan” and it’s ok we are weaker for now.
My issue isn’t “patience or lack there off”, my issue is that I don’t have faith in this masterplan, IF it exists.

And I don’t think the organisation can blame me for my doubts…

[vryadli]

But that means we're in a rebuild and right away people start complaining that the team isn't good. Well, yeah, that's part of a rebuild. But Jazz fans seem to show very little patience for this. Which is maybe why they're not going all in on tanking and half-assing it. If there was a support from fans for proper tanking, if people were willing to watch games even when the Jazz aren't that good, that gives the FO a lot more leeway to properly tank.

No disrespect but I don’t think you can put this one on the fans and the complaint isn’t that the team is not good, on the contrary. The complaint is that 2 years now we have seen a team outperform itself and rather than rewarding this at the trade deadline, our FO prefers to punish them.
...
My issue isn’t “patience or lack there off”, my issue is that I don’t have faith in this masterplan, IF it exists.

And I don’t think the organisation can blame me for my doubts…

Problem is that last trades are very definitely not a "rebuild". DM and Gobert trades defintely was. Vando and Conley it is not easy, but you can convince yourself.

This trades - no, it is not a rebuild moves. at least not in the sense building better team, not in any foreseeable future.

It is designing of perennial looser, the team which will be confident bottom feeder for next 15-20 years and provide a lot possibilities of drafts, PT for some initial developing of boys (they will learn teamwork only later, in some other teams) and continuous shuffling sets of mediocre players. Some fun and players will be happy with that, other not, but it was FO decision, so.