Simone Biles

[bwgood77]

the question is why did she quit midway and waste roster spot? nobody forced to do it.

Because she had anxiety due to crazy expectations and knew it was best to put her mental (and likely physical health first). You won't know this will be a problem until in the moment.

The U.S. has a great team with enough people to cover. Most of the others still ranked near the top and some barely didn't make the finals due to being squeezed out because only 2 people per country were allowed. And the team events we are fine.

The U.S. has plenty of roster spots.

Her health is more important to focus on.

[SK21209]

She's the best in the world and obviously she wanted to be able to do it, so I don't have a problem with her making that decision. The part that is kind of unfortunate is that another gymnast could have had that once-in-a-lifetime Olympic experience. Obviously Biles feels differently now than they did months ago when she decided to compete, so its just an unfortunate situation all-around.

[Mavrelous]

I don't get what do people want from her, she's the who gave up years of hard work, you think she just threw it away for nothing?
I'm also glad she's raising awareness to the mental health problem rampant in modern societies.

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[LikeABosh]

A basketball player makes much more money and has many more opportunities to recover. There's always next year for the basketball player. It is a much more severe case career-wise for a gymnast to miss the Olympics.

"Mental health isn't as important to people who have money"

You're paid more so you have more resources to deal with it.

Right, but are you saying it'd be less excusable for LeBron to miss game 7 due to mental health reasons because he had more resources to deal with it?

[bwgood77]

this is one of those things that i won't be able to understand 100% because i haven't had the type of mental health issues that these top athletes are experiencing, and certainly didn't face the types of pressures they face. but for some sports it's definitely not ok if you feel that it's affecting ability to just "forget" and go. entirely possible you could not walk straight again.

how it'll be received by some or maybe even majority of the couch potato critics is obvious. they don't matter though. not their body on the line.

which is entirely different level than something like basketball. you're probably not gonna mangle your body if you can't play at your max and mess up.

This is exactly the way to approach the thinking if you have not experienced it. Having experienced severe anxiety as well as other things, aside from it being debilitating, or where you may have paralysis by analysis, you often feel that no one really "gets" it and may pass judgement solely from their own experiences in life, so you can't talk to anyone who truly understands.

[bwgood77]

She's the best in the world and obviously she wanted to be able to do it, so I don't have a problem with her making that decision. The part that is kind of unfortunate is that another gymnast could have had that once-in-a-lifetime Olympic experience. Obviously Biles feels differently now than they did months ago when she decided to compete, so its just an unfortunate situation all-around.

Do they not have reserves?

[LouisLitt]

I don't get what do people want from her, she's the who gave up years of hard work, you think she just threw it away for nothing?
I'm also glad she's raising awareness to the mental health problem rampant in modern societies.

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I don't think people want anything from her really.

But when you've watched male sports your whole life and commentators will literally rip players apart for being mentally weak and soft, you become conditioned.

So either one of two things have to happen.

1. We stop **** on men if they underperform in big games. For basketball specifically, we stop with the "Mamba Mentality" and "MJ's mindset".

Or

2. We say that women aren't as mentally tough as men.

You can't keep **** on male athletes year round for decades and then coddle women.

[BlazersBroncos]

I have a lot of mixed feelings on this. One would be, clearly, that the expectations put on her are something I could never handle. The other is that its arguably selfish to take that roster spot if you dont think your mind is right. The other is that some of these expectations are of her own making, she could have turned down the interviews, the sponsors, etc and just been the really good gymnist that stays out of the spotlight. Every time you take the money to get more exposure, your building yourself and your expectations up. When you know you have anxiety disorder, this is just not a good thing to do.

I also think there has to be something within the area of sports that builds its own type of anxiety disorder. Are Biles and Love going to express anxiety disorder if they ended up becoming accountants rather than sports superstars? I would seriously doubt it. I have more empathy for the person who cant handle being a entry level tax processor because of anxiety disorder than millioneers that chose a profession that ends up heaping expectations on them. IDK, this might be insensative, but it seems that competitive sporting events are intrinsically going to create anxiety. That just doesnt seem a 1-to-1 comparison to me in terms of the people in my life who are facing anxiety just dealing with day to day, mundane stuff.

Finally, is there any chance she was just worried about losing?

[bwgood77]

Imagine if Lebron decide to quit in the nba finals due to mental health. Dude would be blasted not called a hero. Mental health is only taking serious when it's females but when its a man everyone laughs

This is ridiculous. And if it is the case, that's on the people judging, not the experience of what someone is going through.

[Parataxis]

My thing is...we need to address mental health issues. We do. I just wonder where this might lead.

I know that this is a sensitive subject, but what happens if you’re trying to run a business and five employees call out saying they aren’t mentally able to work on that day? A teacher takes a week off citing mental concerns. A surgeon. An EMT. A firefighter. The list goes on and on. The world could come to a standstill if everyone took the time to deal with their issues...because let’s be honest. Everyone is dealing with something.

What happens if you have five employees call out saying they have the flu? A teacher takes a week off citing kidney stones? A surgeon. An EMT...

People take time off work all the time because of injuries and illnesses. This isn't new or groundbreaking. You deal with it by being a good manager and recognizing that employees are going to call in sick occasionally, and figure out ways to handle it. The same as has always been done.

Do you really think that firefighters and EMTs never call in sick?

[Ambrose]

There’s a double standard. The media would be killing LeBron if he quit in the middle of the finals.

But for season reason, people tend to coddle woman in similar situation.

I agree with most of this, however, some people in this thread have made really good points about this being different.

Where I agree is LeBron would certainly get ripped a new one for doing the same. Women absolutely get more leeway in these situations. I am absolutely convinced that athletes (and people in general) use mental health as an excuse so they won't be questioned about their reasoning. That's not to say I don't believe in mental health or that it isn't a valid reason to stop doing something but I absolutely believe it's overused.

With that said, if you aren't 100% in the right state of mind for gymnastics you could quite easily paralyze yourself for life. I'd argue the risk of injury is much higher in gymnastics in general, and severe injury at that. Plus, as someone else said, she's spent 4-5 years training for this and I believe I read she was having foot issues too. I would tend to think most people wouldn't give up 4-5 years of hard work if the reasoning wasn't legit.

[Moonorchid]

Simone Biles is one of the most dominant athletes I’ve ever seen. She’s performed through injury before. For her to withdraw completely on the biggest stage a gymnast can perform on means it was serious.

Just looking at that vault, before I even knew what happened, it looked off and she looked spooked. This isn’t basketball where a players poor mental health means just a bad game, she could seriously injure herself trying to push through this when her head isn’t completely right.

I think what she’s doing is incredibly brave precisely because of what is happening right now. She owes us nothing.

I also think the words of present and past gymnasts should be taken into account cause I’ve learned a lot of what Simone biles has gone through and is going through from their own past experiences.

I’ve seen Kerry Strug brought up and I definitely think that moment in history needs to be re-examined and look at it in the way it happened. A young girl was forced to perform on a very injured ankle, when she didn’t have to (that part has been omitted for the part) and it forced her into early retirement.

I 100% support Simone Biles decision and she is still the undisputed GOAT.

[Emhoward]

My thing is...we need to address mental health issues. We do. I just wonder where this might lead.

I know that this is a sensitive subject, but what happens if you’re trying to run a business and five employees call out saying they aren’t mentally able to work on that day? A teacher takes a week off citing mental concerns. A surgeon. An EMT. A firefighter. The list goes on and on. The world could come to a standstill if everyone took the time to deal with their issues...because let’s be honest. Everyone is dealing with something.

I guess the difference is that most people go and do their jobs everyday regardless of mental state because it’s their livelihood and they need their paycheck. So I think it’s great that Simone is able to recover and that she gets the help she needs, we should also focus on those who do their job everyday with issues that are going through things and don’t necessarily have the option of taking time off. I don’t want it to seem like I’m belittling her or her issues. I just wish others with issues who needed help could get it without the fear of lost wages or stigmas at the work place.

I get what you're saying, thing is most of us regular folk don't do our jobs in front of millions of people and cameras. I think that adds an anxiety and pressure most of us aren't familiar with. Obviously due to this, they are rewarded both with money and fame, but in the moment that doesn't help deal with the mental of it all.

Others are comparing this to other sports, and while there is a huge difference because of the potential for injury in Simone's case, I think we all can admit that we may be a little too hard on athletes and how hard it is to perform on a mental level what we expect them to do. Going forward I'll try to have more compassion when discussing what looks like mental shortcomings -- Paul George, Ben Simmons etc. I mean can you imagine what Ben Simmons has been going through this summer -- his situation is clearly mental, but there's a lot less compassion there (I think his cavalier attitude at times doesn't help).

[WarriorGM]

"Mental health isn't as important to people who have money"

You're paid more so you have more resources to deal with it.

Right, but are you saying it'd be less excusable for LeBron to miss game 7 due to mental health reasons because he had more resources to deal with it?

It's not as dangerous so what's the reason? Yips and he believes the team would perform better without him? Then he'll take a hit to being called the best. To be frank the scenario you have laid out may have already happened in the 2011 finals but with LeBron continuing to play. His career survived.

Kevin Love and DeMar DeRozan have spoken out about mental health. They seem to retain respect from what I can tell.

[KembaWalker]

can't call yourself the GOAT and then quit as soon as you mess up

anyone who acts like they support her and still trashes on Ben Simmons is a hypocrite

[TheRealKaboom]

I have mixed feelings on it all.

On one hand I understand it, it's tough to compete under that pressure and she wasn't at her best. And her mental health is what matters most.

On the other hand, it hurts to see them win silver when they should have been bringing home the gold. And Russia of all countries wins the gold.

Russia was banned from competing in these Olympics. What are you talking about?

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[Frank Dux]

i support her, but i think there’s a double standard. Imagine if Lebron, Kobe, or Giannis quit on their team after game three of the NBA finals? they wouldn’t be celebrated. they would be called “mental midgets” and ridiculed into oblivion.

[LikeABosh]

You're paid more so you have more resources to deal with it.

Right, but are you saying it'd be less excusable for LeBron to miss game 7 due to mental health reasons because he had more resources to deal with it?

It's not as dangerous so what's the reason? Yips and he believes the team would perform better without him? Then he'll take a hit to being called the best. Kevin Love and DeMar DeRozan have spoken out about mental health. They seem to retain respect from what I can tell.

...mental health is the reason.

?????

[LikeABosh]

To be frank the scenario you have laid out may have already happened in the 2011 finals but with LeBron continuing to play. His career survived.

Yeah, and he was **** on relentlessly. That's why the other user brought it up

[John Murdoch]

How did this turn into a lebron thread , i can see Fultz