Moderators: LyricalRico, nate33, montestewart
payitforward wrote:AFM wrote:...mostly this has all been blown out of proportion at this point.
I'll say!
I'd be happy to deal Brad if the trade is right -- certainly I'd be pleased w/ the Knicks trade we've just been discussing. But... what Brad has said or done that should be so vexing to people I do not at all understand.
dlts20 wrote:This is the Beal that some of you still prefer. Getting paid the max to take 14 uninterested shots while kuzma chucks and y'all think this is our best opportunity to win.... Smh
Getting the max and not trying to place his will on the game at all while also allowing kuzma to chuck for his max... Smh
nate33 wrote:Bradley Beal ranks 6th in the league in clutch USG% (among guys with more than 10 clutch appearances). And among the top 50 guys in USG, Beal ranks 1st in TS% by a country mile. His TS is an unbelievable 81.0%. The next highest guy is Jrue Holiday at 70.3%. Jokic is next at 67.5%. Paul George is next at 65.1%. Most guys are in the 50’s.
Beal is also averaging a very good 11.5 FTA/36 in the clutch and shooting 91.5% from the line.
The only knock on Beal’s clutch performance is the turnovers. But the turnover average is coming down. After initially averaging over 7 turnovers per 36 clutch minutes, he has pulled that average down to 5.7. That’s still among the highest turnover rates for high volume guys, but it no longer is a ridiculous outlier. For comparison, Giannis averaged 5.3 turnovers/36, Paul George 4.7, Harden 4.7 and Garland 3.9, Poole 3.7, Tatum 3.6, Curry and Ja 3.5.
DCZards wrote:nate33 wrote:Bradley Beal ranks 6th in the league in clutch USG% (among guys with more than 10 clutch appearances). And among the top 50 guys in USG, Beal ranks 1st in TS% by a country mile. His TS is an unbelievable 81.0%. The next highest guy is Jrue Holiday at 70.3%. Jokic is next at 67.5%. Paul George is next at 65.1%. Most guys are in the 50’s.
Beal is also averaging a very good 11.5 FTA/36 in the clutch and shooting 91.5% from the line.
The only knock on Beal’s clutch performance is the turnovers. But the turnover average is coming down. After initially averaging over 7 turnovers per 36 clutch minutes, he has pulled that average down to 5.7. That’s still among the highest turnover rates for high volume guys, but it no longer is a ridiculous outlier. For comparison, Giannis averaged 5.3 turnovers/36, Paul George 4.7, Harden 4.7 and Garland 3.9, Poole 3.7, Tatum 3.6, Curry and Ja 3.5.
Damn! BB is having a hell of a season. Numbers like that make me proud to be labeled a Beal “apologist.”
CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Yeah having a hell of a season if you ignore availability, defense, and consistency."
nate33 wrote:CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Yeah having a hell of a season if you ignore availability, defense, and consistency."
Beal has been extremely consistent for a guard who relies on jumpers.
pcbothwel wrote:nate33 wrote:CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Yeah having a hell of a season if you ignore availability, defense, and consistency."
Beal has been extremely consistent for a guard who relies on jumpers.
Im so tired of this "Beal is an atrocious defender" narrative. Are their times that he should be better... no doubt. But Context matters.
Look at all the of the lead guards in the league with usage at or above Beals (28%).
Beal is the same tier of defender as Booker, Fox, Curry, Lillard, or Morant.
And he is certainly better than Trae, Jalen Green, and Poole.
Comparing him to the overall league average or low usage POA defenders like Bev, Derrick White, Jrue, Delon, Caruso, Smart, etc. really distorts his ability among his peers.
nate33 wrote:CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Yeah having a hell of a season if you ignore availability, defense, and consistency."
Beal has been extremely consistent for a guard who relies on jumpers.
Kanyewest wrote:It's interesting that Beal is considered not that good among NBA experts. For instance on the ringer's top 100 list, Devin Booker is considered the 11th best player in the league and that Beal is considered the 54th best player in the league (last updated February 18). And yes Beal has been injury prone but he's still played more games than Booker. Not saying that Beal is better than Booker, I'm just don't think the gap between the two is that large....
payitforward wrote:Kanyewest wrote:It's interesting that Beal is considered not that good among NBA experts. For instance on the ringer's top 100 list, Devin Booker is considered the 11th best player in the league and that Beal is considered the 54th best player in the league (last updated February 18). And yes Beal has been injury prone but he's still played more games than Booker. Not saying that Beal is better than Booker, I'm just don't think the gap between the two is that large....
The idea that Booker is the 11th best player in the league (based either on this year or his career) is completely laughable.
Just to name, off the top of my head, 20 guys better than Mitchell this season: Steph, Jimmy Butler, Haliburton, Harden, SG-A, Kawhi, Lillard, Giannis, Markkanen, Aaron Gordon, Anthony Davis, Sabonis, Donovan Mitchell, Rudy Gobert, Zion, Brogdon, KD, Jrue Holiday, Desmond Bane, Jarrett Allen, Jayson Tatum, Kenyon Martin, Jr. Jalen Brunson, Draymond, Darius Garland, Joel Embiid, Julius Randle, Kyrie, Isaiah Joe, ... wait, that's at least 30, & I could certainly continue.
No, it's actually only 28. So why not add the MVP, Nikola Jokic.
Oh, & a rookie, Walker Kessler -- who is having a season that puts him among the... I don't know... maybe 15-20 top-performing players in the league. Don't know that it'll continue of course, but give a guy credit for what he does....
I only counted guys who've played 1000+ minutes, btw.
& if we're talking career, rather than just this year, I guess I should mention LeBron, huh?
Beal & Booker are the prototype for the kind of player who is always over-rated. I.e. guys who score a lot of points on jump shots. Neither is even in the conversation for the top 30 or so players in the game.
That said, both this year & on their careers, Beal has been a better player than Booker -- tho there have been a couple of years when Booker's numbers were better than Beal's.
Dat2U wrote:payitforward wrote:Kanyewest wrote:It's interesting that Beal is considered not that good among NBA experts. For instance on the ringer's top 100 list, Devin Booker is considered the 11th best player in the league and that Beal is considered the 54th best player in the league (last updated February 18). And yes Beal has been injury prone but he's still played more games than Booker. Not saying that Beal is better than Booker, I'm just don't think the gap between the two is that large....
The idea that Booker is the 11th best player in the league (based either on this year or his career) is completely laughable.
Just to name, off the top of my head, 20 guys better than Mitchell this season: Steph, Jimmy Butler, Haliburton, Harden, SG-A, Kawhi, Lillard, Giannis, Markkanen, Aaron Gordon, Anthony Davis, Sabonis, Donovan Mitchell, Rudy Gobert, Zion, Brogdon, KD, Jrue Holiday, Desmond Bane, Jarrett Allen, Jayson Tatum, Kenyon Martin, Jr. Jalen Brunson, Draymond, Darius Garland, Joel Embiid, Julius Randle, Kyrie, Isaiah Joe, ... wait, that's at least 30, & I could certainly continue.
No, it's actually only 28. So why not add the MVP, Nikola Jokic.
Oh, & a rookie, Walker Kessler -- who is having a season that puts him among the... I don't know... maybe 15-20 top-performing players in the league. Don't know that it'll continue of course, but give a guy credit for what he does....
I only counted guys who've played 1000+ minutes, btw.
& if we're talking career, rather than just this year, I guess I should mention LeBron, huh?
Beal & Booker are the prototype for the kind of player who is always over-rated. I.e. guys who score a lot of points on jump shots. Neither is even in the conversation for the top 30 or so players in the game.
That said, both this year & on their careers, Beal has been a better player than Booker -- tho there have been a couple of years when Booker's numbers were better than Beal's.
Gobert? Martin Jr? Isaiah Joe? Is any consideration AT ALL given to minutes played and usage? Do you realize low usage players are generally (not always) a burden offensively because they require their on-floor teammates to create shots those low usage guys you love so much are unable to create themselves?
Now if you wanted a separate ranking for role players vs guys who carry the offensive load for their teams, that would make some sense but to compare a rim runner/lob threat or a 3&D wing to a high volume shot creator is a silly exercise.
Kanyewest wrote:It's interesting that Beal is considered not that good among NBA experts. For instance on the ringer's top 100 list, Devin Booker is considered the 11th best player in the league and that Beal is considered the 54th best player in the league (last updated February 18). And yes Beal has been injury prone but he's still played more games than Booker. Not saying that Beal is better than Booker, I'm just don't think the gap between the two is that large.
The availability probably downgrades him as being considered a top player. Although the positive with Beal is that he's starting to knock down his 3 point shot at 37% which IIRC Beal was shooting worse from 3 than Westbrook. It looks like Beal is starting to become a more consistent 3 point shooter. The addition of Porzingis and guys like Morris/Wright probably help create more spacing for Beal.
Now, the next step is for Beal to put together a good stretch of games in a row - he put up relative duds in the games against New York and Chicago than Atlanta- maybe because those teams had much better defenders to throw at him. But Beal is capable of filling it up against good defensive teams like the Timberwolves.
