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I would only a trade Dani to Okc for Jalen Williams, and that's not happening.

Yeah I wouldn't trade deni right now. He's far too valuable!

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willbcocks wrote:I do think Deni's stage of development and contract make for an interesting conversation. His value derives from three things:

1. He will produce at a high level for years into the future
2. He produces at a high level now
3. He is locked into extremely affordable contract for a number of years.

As a team in the early stages of a rebuild, number one is great for us, number two helps sets the culture but doesn't add that much value to us, and number three doesn't add value to us. In sum, a lot of his value is wasted on our team. A team that is competing now would get a lot more value out of him. He would be particularly value to a team that needs to compete now and in the future but is hamstrung by high salaries to other players.

Would a team like OKC give a huge package to get him? They'd have him and J Williams locked into bargain contracts, Shai at a great contract, probably allowing them to pay chet and still not be totally strapped moving forward.

If they were, I would consider moving him.

I get the theory, but judging by conversations on the trade board, nobody is willing to offer any surplus value for Item #3. All the packages offered, are, at best, valuing him for #1 and #2 alone. Another issue is that all Wizards are instantly devalued on the premise that you pad stats on a bad team.

The bottom line is nobody is offering a likely lotto pick in 2025 for him. All I've seen are offers for a 2024 mid-lotto pick, or a grab bag of 2 or 3 distant future picks belonging to a team that will be extremely good so those picks will be in the 20's.

The only package even remotely interesting would be one from OKC based on Giddy + picks. And that's only interesting if you think a team can be good with Giddey as the primary ball handler (because it doesn't work when he is off ball). And even that construct is iffy because Giddey is likely to sign a much more expensive contract than Deni just did.

QMemphis wrote:

nate33 wrote:

QMemphis wrote:
Yeah I would trade our lottery pick and additional draft capital plus salary for Deni

Deni is better than every prospect in this draft. If Deni could magically re-enter the draft this year, I would take him at #1 without thinking twice.

Deni just went for 32 points, 10 boards, 5 assists, 3 blocks and 2 steals, by the way.

Oh I know I was tracking the game. Ziaire Williams, John Konchar, Yuta Wannabe, 2024 pick (currently 7th), 2030 (Pick Swap 2nd most favorable Suns/Wizards), 4 2nds, for Deni

Any conversation with Memphis for Deni would have to start with JJJ. It's that simple.

OKC wouldn't give up JJJ and if Washington ends up with Sarr, the two would not be a good fit. It would be something like Giddey plus strong draft equity to get Avdija. The package of scraps, a middling pick this year, and a middle of the pack pick in 2030 might or might not get Kuzma though.

penbeast0 wrote:OKC wouldn't give up JJJ and if Washington ends up with Sarr, the two would not be a good fit. It would be something like Giddey plus strong draft equity to get Avdija. The package of scraps, a middling pick this year, and a middle of the pack pick in 2030 might or might not get Kuzma though.

Jaren Jackson Jr is on Memphis not OKC.

I can't see Deni getting traded. Not happening.

gambitx777 wrote:

popper wrote:In retrospect, I guess we should have traded Jones for a second rounder.

Hide aight is always 2020. You really want to avoid being so bad moral is gone we are almost there but you can't just trade everyone under value the players don't respect that.

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I don't think that's really right. If you're not going to have an asset for '24-'25, or it won't be meaningful. You should probably flip it. One of the reasons I wanted to trade Kuzma in the present, rather than wait longer is what just happened to the Guardians. The Guardians just turned what was a CY Young caliber pitcher, into a deadline asset for trade in '23, but Bieber got hurt right before the deadline, so they couldn't engage in talks (for which they were only half serious), then decided against trading him during the winter meetings in '23-'24, and now saw him just go down after 1 week of the season with Tommy John surgery. A key building block asset for the team was flushed down the toilet for nothing because they waited. That is the worst case scenario of course, but then again so are the wizards, most of the time.

Now add in this key piece: bad team morale, & players respecting the build and the F.O.'s. This can matter. But the question is, why would it matter with us? We aren't competing until '26-'27 at the earliest for much, and how many of the players on the current roster are building blocks (Bilal, Deni) or key assets long term (Tristan?). The answer to that is largely none. What do we care about the team morale or potential attitude issues with regards to players who aren't going to be here in the first place. You can have glue guy vets to try and ensure a bottom line level of professionalism and dedication, but I don't think you should be keeping that, over flipping for assets, when you are #1 bereft of virtually any talent to speak of #2 starting from a point that rebuilds never start from (virtually no assets worth a damn because you had too much pride and stupidity to trade guys like Beal when you should have) and #3 not working with the players that will have any relevance to your long term future anyway (in terms of trade pieces or long term value).

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:What about something with ATL? I remember talk of them being interested in Kuzma... They have 2 first round picks, maybe something like Kuzma for Hunter & their later pick at 20?

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/8770715

ATL gets more of an offensive focal point, star type player, Washington gets a more team oriented player, could be a good fit with Deni.

Does anyone like this? Is it realistic/possible? I like it for us because Hunter is 2 yrs younger, has a lower salary, and I think could just be a better fit for our team moving forward. I might even like it just straight up. But the late 1st to me is the main motivation, I actually like several players projected in that range.

Frichuela wrote:

pcbothwel wrote:

nate33 wrote:I think they will start shopping him soon. They're not going to make a bad trade, but they will listen to offers. I don't know if he gets traded this summer, but my guess is that he is gone by the Trade Deadline.

Another possibility is that they sit down with Kuzma and convince him to dial back the usage and go back to being a useful role player who defends and rebounds.

Not happening Nate. Kuz would certainly do that if he was on a contender, but not a bottom 5 team. I love how Kuz has rubbed off on Deni in regard to confidence and physicality, and I hope he does the same with Bilal for the time being. But I hope we land Holmes, Almansa, or CMB and move Kuz sooner than later.

Agreed. I truly hope he gets traded in the offseason.

My preferred trade would be Memphis for a package of Aldama+fodder (Kennard)+2025 MEM 1st (say top 5 protected).

Still prefer Deni but wanna talk Kuzma. How has his influence been on the team ?

QMemphis wrote:

nate33 wrote:

QMemphis wrote:Yeah I would trade our lottery pick and additional draft capital plus salary for Deni

Deni is better than every prospect in this draft. If Deni could magically re-enter the draft this year, I would take him at #1 without thinking twice.

Deni just went for 32 points, 10 boards, 5 assists, 3 blocks and 2 steals, by the way.

Oh I know I was tracking the game. Ziaire Williams, John Konchar, Yuta Wannabe, 2024 pick (currently 7th), 2030 (Pick Swap 2nd most favorable Suns/Wizards), 4 2nds, for Deni

I gave you a +1 for the tone and interesting perspective. Thanks for visiting...

dckingsfan wrote:

QMemphis wrote:

nate33 wrote:Deni is better than every prospect in this draft. If Deni could magically re-enter the draft this year, I would take him at #1 without thinking twice.

Deni just went for 32 points, 10 boards, 5 assists, 3 blocks and 2 steals, by the way.

Oh I know I was tracking the game. Ziaire Williams, John Konchar, Yuta Wannabe, 2024 pick (currently 7th), 2030 (Pick Swap 2nd most favorable Suns/Wizards), 4 2nds, for Deni

I gave you a +1 for the tone and interesting perspective. Thanks for visiting...

Appreciate it, I have been tracking Deni since last year but really locked in to him around December when I was looking for a trade deadline guy for the Grizz. But I get it I wouldn’t trade the guy either he is a winning player. A few posters suggested Kuzma, but I got a few questions about his game.

QMemphis wrote:

dckingsfan wrote:

QMemphis wrote:Oh I know I was tracking the game. Ziaire Williams, John Konchar, Yuta Wannabe, 2024 pick (currently 7th), 2030 (Pick Swap 2nd most favorable Suns/Wizards), 4 2nds, for Deni

I gave you a +1 for the tone and interesting perspective. Thanks for visiting...

Appreciate it, I have been tracking Deni since last year but really locked in to him around December when I was looking for a trade deadline guy for the Grizz. But I get it I wouldn’t trade the guy either he is a winning player. A few posters suggested Kuzma, but I got a few questions about his game.

Kuzma is solid, good all around game, versatile offensively, can score inside with a bag of moves & drop steps, can hit from long range. Tends to take tough shots, can play defense and is good on the boards when he's motivated. Can play the 3 or 4, has even played some 5 this year. Good teammate, seems to enjoy working with young players. Can run the offense, his detriment comes when he tries to do too much.

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:

QMemphis wrote:

dckingsfan wrote:I gave you a +1 for the tone and interesting perspective. Thanks for visiting...

Appreciate it, I have been tracking Deni since last year but really locked in to him around December when I was looking for a trade deadline guy for the Grizz. But I get it I wouldn’t trade the guy either he is a winning player. A few posters suggested Kuzma, but I got a few questions about his game.

Kuzma is solid, good all around game, versatile offensively, can score inside with a bag of moves & drop steps, can hit from long range. Tends to take tough shots, can play defense and is good on the boards when he's motivated. Can play the 3 or 4, has even played some 5 this year. Good teammate, seems to enjoy working with young players. Can run the offense, his detriment comes when he tries to do too much.

The flip side on Kuzma is that when he thinks he's the man offensively, he doesn't play much defense, and he's never been league average in shooting efficiency. I agree that if you could get him to play defense the way we have seen him play it and have some selection in his shots, he would be an above average forward in this league. Thinking he's Kobe Bryant, he's below average, and would be better served as an instant offense rotation guy. A guy who needs a strong minded coach and team framework to be his best but given that could be a nice third scorer on a very good team.

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:

QMemphis wrote:

dckingsfan wrote:I gave you a +1 for the tone and interesting perspective. Thanks for visiting...

Appreciate it, I have been tracking Deni since last year but really locked in to him around December when I was looking for a trade deadline guy for the Grizz. But I get it I wouldn’t trade the guy either he is a winning player. A few posters suggested Kuzma, but I got a few questions about his game.

Kuzma is solid, good all around game, versatile offensively, can score inside with a bag of moves & drop steps, can hit from long range. Tends to take tough shots, can play defense and is good on the boards when he's motivated. Can play the 3 or 4, has even played some 5 this year. Good teammate, seems to enjoy working with young players. Can run the offense, his detriment comes when he tries to do too much.

Yeah his efficiency and shot selection gives me Dillon irrational confidence without the elite defense. I do appreciate his offensive versatility though. I want us to use the 5 out concept to improve our offense and spacing.

penbeast0 wrote:

QMemphis wrote:
My hope is to get Deni as I have said previously on you guys page. He complements our Big 3 and that descending contract is gold for us. Your offer is solid but Luke is a shooter I believe we will keep but has potential if we go that route this offseason.

Kuzma has the same type of descending contract and is much more available. There are offers that would get Deni but you would have to pay star value for him and most fans of other teams balk at that. Kuzma you could get for contracts and a couple of mediocre 1sts most likely.

Here he would be the 4th option at best. Also don’t think he can be the connector on offense and post defender we are looking for. He has the capabilities just would need to buy in.

So what do you do with Bagley and/or Holmes if Sarr is the pick? Because I'm convinced Vuk is no worse than a backup at this point, and a spot starter with upside for more.

Do you package one of Holmes/Bagley with Kuzma and try to get a shooting guard?

Rafael122 wrote:So what do you do with Bagley and/or Holmes if Sarr is the pick? Because I'm convinced Vuk is no worse than a backup at this point, and a spot starter with upside for more.

Do you package one of Holmes/Bagley with Kuzma and try to get a shooting guard?

I'm not sure you can do much of anything.

If you can trade one of them for a roughly equivalent player at a guard position who also has an expiring contract, then, sure, do it. But I doubt such a trade will be out there. More teams are in need of guard depth than they are of center depth.

We will probably end up just buying Holmes out. Or maybe trading him for a longer (bad) contract and a pick.

I wouldn't worry about getting a fill in SG, Kispert is fine for that. If you can trade Kuzma for a superior long term talent you do that and work out the rotations later. Deni and Bilal are versatile and no one else is set in stone. Holmes and Bagley don't have trade value at this point so they'd just be there for contract matching.

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:What about something with ATL? I remember talk of them being interested in Kuzma... They have 2 first round picks, maybe something like Kuzma for Hunter & their later pick at 20?

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/8770715

ATL gets more of an offensive focal point, star type player, Washington gets a more team oriented player, could be a good fit with Deni.

Does anyone like this? Is it realistic/possible? I like it for us because Hunter is 2 yrs younger, has a lower salary, and I think could just be a better fit for our team moving forward. I might even like it just straight up. But the late 1st to me is the main motivation, I actually like several players projected in that range.

Posted this on the ATL board and got a favorable response...

Jamaaliver wrote:

SUPERBALLMAN wrote:Do you guys have interest in Kyle Kuzma? I remember talk of ATL being interested in him a while back, possibly for John Collins?

He's a good versatile big forward who can score, but we're (the Wizards) in major rebuild mode... And you have two 1st round picks.

I've always liked Hunter personally, would you consider Kuzma + 2nd round pick for Hunter + the later 1st rounder (from Kings projected 20)?

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/8771205

This is an interesting proposal. And after 3 disappointing seasons in a row, all options are on the table for Atlanta.

The only Hawk player we can be sure will be around for the long haul is Jalen Johnson. Jalen will need floor spacers in the frontcourt and Kuzma can definitely provide that. Kyle's in his prime, on a great contract and would provide depth at both forward positions while providing more scoring, more rebounding, more playmaking than Hunter.

This, in all honesty, is a really attractive offer. If we're hoping to field a competitive team next season, this is a great place to start rebuilding the roster.

The only real concern on our end would be the drop off in defense.
But defensive minded role players are easier to find in free agency than high scoring forwards on affordable long term contracts.

nate33 wrote:

Rafael122 wrote:So what do you do with Bagley and/or Holmes if Sarr is the pick? Because I'm convinced Vuk is no worse than a backup at this point, and a spot starter with upside for more.

Do you package one of Holmes/Bagley with Kuzma and try to get a shooting guard?

I'm not sure you can do much of anything.

If you can trade one of them for a roughly equivalent player at a guard position who also has an expiring contract, then, sure, do it. But I doubt such a trade will be out there. More teams are in need of guard depth than they are of center depth.

We will probably end up just buying Holmes out. Or maybe trading him for a longer (bad) contract and a pick.

What I am hoping is that one of Bagley or Holmes can be filler in a trade that gets us a longer term contract and assets back.

It might be a low probability gambit but... at the trade deadline there might be a team in need of a backup C that wants to dump salary.

My latest:

Simple deal:

Wiz trade Shamet(can be waived immediately so that his deal is non-gauranteed)+Davis (expiring unless Miami wants to pick up his option)+26 to Miami for Duncan Robinson (expiring)+15.

Why for Miami?
1). Ducks the tax while moving down 11 spots in this draft.

Why for the Wizards?
1). Move up in the draft while not adding any extra years in future salary commitments.

Robinson would also be tradeable at the deadline for some future 2nds as well.