RealGM

fishercob wrote:

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:

Ruzious wrote:I always thought that kind of logic was assinine - "Don't help your team if it means helping a rival" - even when you're not really competing with the "rival".

Z would serve no purpose here. He'd take PT from the youngsters. And a vet like him near the end of his career deserves the opportunity to play in the playoffs. Meanwhile, he can choose to go to another team - if there's a better match - he doesn't have to go to Cleveland. Either way, I'll be rooting for a Cleveland/Dallas NBA finals.

Pride is not about logic. Pride is about putting up a fight when you're about an inch from dying even when logically giving up would be the less painful route. It's about saying to your fanbase "yes, this season has been a disaster but that doesn't mean we have to let other teams use our face as a stepping stone to championship."

Z has absolutely no purpose in Washington, I completely agree. It's the message your franchise is sending out to your fanbase by letting him go is what baffles me.

I was a Wizards fan afterall when MJ was playing. ( a bandwagon one, yes, but a fan nevertheless).

You, my friend, are a bad businessman if you would let emotions sway you from doing whats in the best interest of your company or team.

As a Wizards fan, I care first and foremost about the Wizards. I want our execs to do only what moves us closest to contention, with no regard for whom else it might help. If you're sore because Z returning to the the Cavs hurts your team du jour's chances of a title, well tough titties.

And who are you -- an admitted bandwagon fan -- to criticize anyone else's pride? Any true and self-respecting fan sticks with his (or her, perhaps?) team through thick and thin. They don't hop around based on who Nike tells them to worship that day,

Boom. Roasted.

NBA is a business but sports is all about mentality. What you wrote is like saying to the Beatles; "your main objective is not to create beautiful music but to sell records."

Z leaving makes sense from a financial point of view but it does not make sense from sports fans point of view.

Were or were you and Cleveland not rivals just a few years ago?

By letting Z goes, your franchise has admitted that the rivalry is dead. We lost. Cleveland can do whatever they want to us.

Ask yourself this; why does the Sacramento Kings franchise continue to be successful even when they're losing. Why does Arco arena rocks like no other whenever the Lakers come to town?

The answer is pride.

Verizon Center rocks every time Crabs come to town too. What's your point?

Pride goeth before the fall.

nate33 wrote:The rationale behind buying Z out is it lets other potential free agents know that Washington's management respects players.

There is no logical reason to keep Z in DC. All he would do is hurt our chances at lotto balls while taking playing time away from McGee. The only argument to keep Z is because it hurts Cleveland. But if I'm the GM I don't want the rest of the league to think that I'm willing to screw a well-respected veteran player out of an opportunity to play in the playoffs just because I want to spite a team.

Fair enough. I can see how that might be what your franchise is thinking.
Respect players and free agents will want to come to Washington.

How about respect to its' fanbase though? Face it, the rivalry with Cleveland is the hottest topic in Wizards land since MJ came out of retirement. Why douse the fire that burns your fanbase? (burn in a good way).

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:

Ruzious wrote:I always thought that kind of logic was assinine - "Don't help your team if it means helping a rival" - even when you're not really competing with the "rival".

Z would serve no purpose here. He'd take PT from the youngsters. And a vet like him near the end of his career deserves the opportunity to play in the playoffs. Meanwhile, he can choose to go to another team - if there's a better match - he doesn't have to go to Cleveland. Either way, I'll be rooting for a Cleveland/Dallas NBA finals.

Pride is not about logic. Pride is about putting up a fight when you're about an inch from dying even when logically giving up would be the less painful route. It's about saying to your fanbase "yes, this season has been a disaster but that doesn't mean we have to let other teams use our face as a stepping stone to championship."

Z has absolutely no purpose in Washington, I completely agree. It's the message your franchise is sending out to your fanbase by letting him go is what baffles me.

I was a Wizards fan afterall when MJ was playing. ( a bandwagon one, yes, but a fan nevertheless).

I give you points for chutzpa (sp?). Most people who admit they're bandwagon fans wouldn't have the guts to lecture others on pride.

Hilarious. Thanks. Yeah, I, personally, am a weenie, because my local sports team is run according to good business principles rather than the adolescent hormonal spewings of a bandwagon LA loser. Sure!

JWizmentality wrote:Verizon Center rocks every time Crabs come to town too. What's your point?

Pride goeth before the fall.

Not after Z goes back to Cleveland. Not after that. Would you go to war with the side who raises the white flag?

ZonkertheBrainless wrote:Hilarious. Thanks. Yeah, I, personally, am a weenie, because my local sports team is run according to good business principles rather than the adolescent hormonal spewings of a bandwagon LA loser. Sure!

Like sports is all about business. You get pumped up over the Wizards quarterly report?

Make him wear the Scarlet W! Screw Cleveland! Screw Ilguaskas! These colors (black, blue, sorta gold) don't run! On any given night, we might well be the most important NBA franchise in the most powerful city in the world! Death with dignity! Wizards pride!

montestewart wrote:Make him wear the Scarlet W! Screw Cleveland! Screw Ilguaskas! These colors (black, blue, sorta gold) don't run! On any given night, we might well be the most important NBA franchise in the most powerful city in the world! Death with dignity! Wizards pride!

You say that in jest but that's not far from the truth.

I love the wizards so much I have carved a big curly W on my chest!

ZonkertheBrainless wrote:I love the wizards so much I have carved a big curly W on my chest!

Maybe you should. That will make the moment your franchise goes back on top that much sweeter.

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:

fishercob wrote:Pride is not about logic. Pride is about putting up a fight when you're about an inch from dying even when logically giving up would be the less painful route. It's about saying to your fanbase "yes, this season has been a disaster but that doesn't mean we have to let other teams use our face as a stepping stone to championship."

Z has absolutely no purpose in Washington, I completely agree. It's the message your franchise is sending out to your fanbase by letting him go is what baffles me.

I was a Wizards fan afterall when MJ was playing. ( a bandwagon one, yes, but a fan nevertheless).

You, my friend, are a bad businessman if you would let emotions sway you from doing whats in the best interest of your company or team.

As a Wizards fan, I care first and foremost about the Wizards. I want our execs to do only what moves us closest to contention, with no regard for whom else it might help. If you're sore because Z returning to the the Cavs hurts your team du jour's chances of a title, well tough titties.

And who are you -- an admitted bandwagon fan -- to criticize anyone else's pride? Any true and self-respecting fan sticks with his (or her, perhaps?) team through thick and thin. They don't hop around based on who Nike tells them to worship that day,

Boom. Roasted.

So much stupidity, so little time.

obi-wan ke-fatso wrote:NBA is a business but sports is all about mentality. What you wrote is like saying to the Beatles; "your main objective is not to create beautiful music but to sell records."

Al Davis couldn't have said it any better himself. Great sports franchises are led by smart businessmen like Marc Cuban, Theo Epstein, Daryl Morey, Sam Presti, etc. Not angry fanboys.

Z leaving makes sense from a financial point of view but it does not make sense from sports fans point of view.

It's not just money. It's playing time for our young bigs that we're trying to develop. It's chemistry that Z wouldn't help in any way since he doesn't want to be here.

Were or were you and Cleveland not rivals just a few years ago?

By letting Z goes, your franchise has admitted that the rivalry is dead. We lost. Cleveland can do whatever they want to us.

We WERE Cleveland's rivals a few years ago. They DID win multiple battles. Maybe we can become their rival again and overtake them. But holding on to Z out of spite is the ultimate bitch that would be ridiculed and noted by players and agents around the league.

Ask yourself this; why does the Sacramento Kings franchise continue to be successful even when they're losing. Why does Arco arena rocks like no other whenever the Lakers come to town?

The answer is pride.

No, dingus. The answer is that the Lakers sell out everywhere they go and that there isn't anything else to do in Sacramento other than cow-tip.

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:

Ruzious wrote:I always thought that kind of logic was assinine - "Don't help your team if it means helping a rival" - even when you're not really competing with the "rival".

Z would serve no purpose here. He'd take PT from the youngsters. And a vet like him near the end of his career deserves the opportunity to play in the playoffs. Meanwhile, he can choose to go to another team - if there's a better match - he doesn't have to go to Cleveland. Either way, I'll be rooting for a Cleveland/Dallas NBA finals.

Pride is not about logic. Pride is about putting up a fight when you're about an inch from dying even when logically giving up would be the less painful route. It's about saying to your fanbase "yes, this season has been a disaster but that doesn't mean we have to let other teams use our face as a stepping stone to championship."

Z has absolutely no purpose in Washington, I completely agree. It's the message your franchise is sending out to your fanbase by letting him go is what baffles me.

I was a Wizards fan afterall when MJ was playing. ( a bandwagon one, yes, but a fan nevertheless).

chubby_1_kenobi, first of all thanks for starting a thought-provoking thread.

I think the real message is from Ernie Grunfeld to Danny Ferry. It is that the Wizards honor their wink-wink arrangements. The Cavs gave up a first round pick, and in clearing near 12M of cap with Z's expiring deal, they took on a 33-34 year old player with multiple years remaining.

By letting Z go back to Cavs, everybody wins, chubby. Wiz get nominal cash in the buyout, but have a good relationship with Cleveland should future deals arise. Jamison will get to the playoffs and with little pressure if Z returns.

In the strangest of twists, if Washington renounces the team option on Howard, they can throw A TON OF MONEY at Wade, Bosh, even Lebron, etc. (Even though I'm sure he's gone there's plenty money to re-sign Brendan).

Letting the guys go to Dallas, all three of Butler, Haywood and Stevenson are happy. Dalllas obviously owes the Wizards now if a future deal goes down.

For the three teams and all the players, everybody won. And for the new Wizards and their fans, again, everybody's happy.

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:

montestewart wrote:Make him wear the Scarlet W! Screw Cleveland! Screw Ilguaskas! These colors (black, blue, sorta gold) don't run! On any given night, we might well be the most important NBA franchise in the most powerful city in the world! Death with dignity! Wizards pride!

You say that in jest but that's not far from the truth.

When Jordan played here, that was one of the lowest point of this franchise, as far as pride. The greatest ever, but long past his prime and on his second comeback. The entire point of the team was to cater to his game, which was just good enough (he was the greatest ever) to drag a lousy team on his back to not getting into the playoffs, while amassing a new scrapbook of individual exploits and new pockets of egotism. In his second year, he magnanimously went to the bench, and suddenly, his scoring nosedived, and he was back in the starting lineup. He reached 20 ppg (to the exact penny) in the last game of the season, a season that seemed devoted to him not falling below 20 ppg. It put fans in the seats, made money for the owner, delayed rebuilding, and let a non-Wizards ego run rampant over the team.

That's when you were a fan.

The reason you're so comical is that you're not informing anyone here of anything, so your message raises questions regarding your motivation. Hitler had some good points too, but they sounded better when they didn't come from a Nazi. Here, I blame the messeneger, not the message.

Al Davis couldn't have said it any better himself. Great sports franchises are led by smart businessmen like Marc Cuban, Theo Epstein, Daryl Morey, Sam Presti, etc. Not angry fanboys.

3
Yet, owners who put too much value on money and completely disregard the "spiritual" side of the game are also doomed to fail. Sarver and Sterling are 2 greatest examples of great cost cutters. Look at how their fanbase despise them.

It's not just money. It's playing time for our young bigs that we're trying to develop. It's chemistry that Z wouldn't help in any way since he doesn't want to be here.

Developing young talents doesn't contradict keeping Z. Do you think 15 minutes per game from an aging veteran who is good locker room presence will screw with Blatche and Mcgee's development?

We WERE Cleveland's rivals a few years ago. They DID win multiple battles. Maybe we can become their rival again and overtake them. But holding on to Z out of spite is the ultimate bitch that would be ridiculed and noted by players and agents around the league.

Call me a pop psychologists but you would be be singing a different tune had the Wizards refused to let Z go because they want to play him 15 mins/game plus mentor their young bigs. Spite or not, you must be blind if you can't see that Z can contribute positively the development of your young talent.

No, dingus. The answer is that the Lakers sell out everywhere they go and that there isn't anything else to do in Sacramento other than cow-tip.

I'm not talking about selling out. Staples Center sells out every game but it doesn't rock like Arco does. Selling out is a financial term which you so persistently insist the key to a successful NBA franchise. I'm talking about the the atmosphere you get when a team you want to lose so badly come into town.
After Z goes back to Cleveland, the Wizards fanbase will lose that feeling forever or at least for a very long time.

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:

Ruzious wrote:I always thought that kind of logic was assinine - "Don't help your team if it means helping a rival" - even when you're not really competing with the "rival".

Z would serve no purpose here. He'd take PT from the youngsters. And a vet like him near the end of his career deserves the opportunity to play in the playoffs. Meanwhile, he can choose to go to another team - if there's a better match - he doesn't have to go to Cleveland. Either way, I'll be rooting for a Cleveland/Dallas NBA finals.

Pride is not about logic. Pride is about putting up a fight when you're about an inch from dying even when logically giving up would be the less painful route. It's about saying to your fanbase "yes, this season has been a disaster but that doesn't mean we have to let other teams use our face as a stepping stone to championship."

Z has absolutely no purpose in Washington, I completely agree. It's the message your franchise is sending out to your fanbase by letting him go is what baffles me.

I was a Wizards fan afterall when MJ was playing. ( a bandwagon one, yes, but a fan nevertheless).

chubby_1_kenobi, first of all thanks for starting a thought-provoking thread.

I think the real message is from Ernie Grunfeld to Danny Ferry. It is that the Wizards honor their wink-wink arrangements. The Cavs gave up a first round pick, and in clearing near 12M of cap with Z's expiring deal, they took on a 33-34 year old player with multiple years remaining.

By letting Z go back to Cavs, everybody wins, chubby. Wiz get nominal cash in the buyout, but have a good relationship with Cleveland should future deals arise. Jamison will get to the playoffs and with little pressure if Z returns.

In the strangest of twists, if Washington renounces the team option on Howard, they can throw A TON OF MONEY at Wade, Bosh, even Lebron, etc. (Even though I'm sure he's gone there's plenty money to re-sign Brendan).

Letting the guys go to Dallas, all three of Butler, Haywood and Stevenson are happy. Dalllas obviously owes the Wizards now if a future deal goes down.

For the three teams and all the players, everybody won. And for the new Wizards and their fans, again, everybody's happy.

If your fanbase is so happy why is your signature so sarcastic?

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:If your fanbase is so happy why is your signature so sarcastic?

He's not being sarcastic.

JWizmentality wrote:

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:If your fanbase is so happy why is your signature so sarcastic?

He's not being sarcastic.

My bad. Well, if it's true that everyone here is happy about the deal I won't say anything more about it.
You can close this thread if you want.

chubby_1_kenobi wrote:You can close this thread if you want.

Oh, no. You don't get off that easy. This thread should now become the Official Anti-Lakers Troll thread. Go Mavs!

I'll tell you what franchise has no pride: the Grizzlies! Gasol for Kwame!

I'll tell you what franchise has no pride: the Hornets! Kobe for Divacs!

Imagine a franchise built on the shameful mistakes of teams that lack P-R-I-D-E!!!

Personally, I'd like to see Ilgauskas end up in Dallas.