Is Jokic better than Kobe ever was? How long before he surpasses him all-time?

[Jta444]

I have Jokic 29th (I'm big on era-relative longevity) and Kobe 17th (really low on his peak). Give Jokic 5 years of average production, and I think he cracks the top 15. Give him 5 more years of elite production, and he's a Goat candidate.

Lol at kobe at 17. He is a lock at top 12 though ofc with Jokic and Curry closing in in the future he might be top 15. Name the 16 players ahead of Kobe. His peak seems low because the time he peaked - 05-08 he had the worst supporting cast of his career compared to say MJ Lebron Bird Magic those dudes always had stacked teams during their peak.

[One_and_Done]

Jokic already passed Kobe. Kobe's not even in the top 20 these days, too many better players exist now.

[mcmurphy]

jez... another comparison... stop with this f...ing comparison (I'm the fan number one of Jokic... but I'm really tired)

enjoy basketball, son

[sonic the laker]

Not gonna lie. As far as troll threads go...this one is an absolute chef kiss. Hilarious

[AleksandarN]

Jokic already passed Kobe. Kobe's not even in the top 20 these days, too many better players exist now.

[Gary Cokeman]

Kobe also won 2 as the best player on his team. If Kobe had the talent Jokic has had on his team the last couple years he most likely would have won more. Yes Jokic is great, not denying that..but he’s got an amazing supporting cast that complement each other very well.

Kobe won those 2 alongside another Hall of famer , while Jokic has yet to play with an All-Star. No way are you comparing team talent.

Hall of famer only because winning with Kobe got him to that level. That and his international play, which doesn’t factor into this argument. Before Kobe, Pau had gone to the playoffs once and was swept in the first round and had one all star appearance. Meanwhile Jokic doesn’t have another all star but Murray sure plays like one looking at his numbers in the playoffs. Add Gordon and MPJ to that mix and it far out-talents any roster Kobe has played in.

Current Nuggets are more talented than the 01 Lakers? ooooookay.

[Rishkar]

I have Jokic 29th (I'm big on era-relative longevity) and Kobe 17th (really low on his peak). Give Jokic 5 years of average production, and I think he cracks the top 15. Give him 5 more years of elite production, and he's a Goat candidate.

Lol at kobe at 17. He is a lock at top 12 though ofc with Jokic and Curry closing in in the future he might be top 15. Name the 16 players ahead of Kobe. His peak seems low because the time he peaked - 05-08 he had the worst supporting cast of his career compared to say MJ Lebron Bird Magic those dudes always had stacked teams during their peak.

Russell
Lebron
Jordan
Kareem

Duncan
Wilt

Hakeem
Shaq
KG
Mikan

Oscar
Magic
West
Bird
Robinson
Curry
Kobe

[uncleduck13]

Not gonna lie. As far as troll threads go...this one is an absolute chef kiss. Hilarious

What makes you think we’re trolling?

[JasonStern]

Grew up idolizing Kobe’s game and his jersey was the first one I’ve ever gotten. Kobe was a truly amazing player. Jokic is on another level though. Guy seems unbeatable which I never felt watching Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Bron or Steph… if he catches Shaq in rings, he’s a top 5 player of all time

Duncan was just consistent. And he had a great team and great coach to surround himself with.
Prime Shaq was unstoppable. But Prime Shaq had a small window, and played in a different era. Peak versus career argument.
Kobe had moments, but he was high usage. Different positions, different eras, so it's hard to do a head-to-head comparison.
LeBron has arguably the greatest career body of work (Kareem fans can argue). There's a lot to say about longevity.
Steph is the greatest shooter the NBA has seen, but he played on stacked teams.

If Jokic wins a 'chip this year, he's top ten. And he's only 29, so he has plenty of time to ascent even higher in the all-time list. Imagine winning one 'chip, let alone multiple, with Jamal Murray being the best player you played with in an era of super-teams. He still realistically has a 4 year window to win MVPs or 'chips, and a 6 year window to make all-star games and all-NBA teams.

[hagredionis]

5 rings > 1 ring

[JasonStern]

Hall of famer only because winning with Kobe got him to that level. That and his international play, which doesn’t factor into this argument. Before Kobe, Pau had gone to the playoffs once and was swept in the first round and had one all star appearance. Meanwhile Jokic doesn’t have another all star but Murray sure plays like one looking at his numbers in the playoffs. Add Gordon and MPJ to that mix and it far out-talents any roster Kobe has played in.

Agree to disagree. Prime Shaq, Glen Rice, Robert Horry, Rick Fox, Derek Fisher, Brian Shaw, Ron Harper, A.C Green, Tryone Lue, John Salley, etc. Kobe's supporting cast was far more stacked than anything Jokic has played with. And Denver is a pretty well stacked and balanced team.

[sp6r=underrated]

I haven't done a list in a long time but I do know the only thing Kobe has over Jokic at this point is longevity. And I think people don't appreciate how quickly Jokic is closing the gap as a franchise cornerstone. The Lakers won 12 playoff series after Shaq left in the Kobe era. Once Denver completes the knockout of LA, Denver will have 9 playoff series wins in the Jokic era.

No he’s not and he won’t unless he gets more rings. This board has serious Kobe Derangement Syndrome.

Kobe only has 2 FMVPs and 1 MVP while also just straight up not peaking as high as a player in general. If rings is your only argument in the debate you're cooked.

Yea, it's not that difficult to surpass Kobe, relatively speaking. In terms of fame and popularity, however, Joker will never come close.

This is correct. I have Kobe as the 4th best player of his era, 5th if you consider Shaq part of it. But as an icon of the sport he's on a tier well above a lot of guys who were better at playing basketball.

[jazzfan1971]

Scoring
Kobe 10 joker 10
Passing
Kobe 6 joker 10
Rebounding
Kobe 6 joker 9
Douchebaggery
Kobe 11 joker 1

Total
Kobe 33 joker 30

Kobe by 3!

[theforumblue]

The most surprising thing about this thread wasn't the question but who started it.

One more ring and can't say jokic being ranked above kobe all time is ridiculous.

[Raps in 4]

His peak is much higher than Kobe's.

[Chokic]

The way realgm talks about kobe you would think he was a more hyped up ricky davis.

[One_and_Done]

There's multiple threads like this that seem to answer your question:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2368400#p112184816
It's Jokic easy.

[LakerLegend]

The way realgm talks about kobe you would think he was a more hyped up ricky davis.

Yeah, the takes are hilarious.

I could average 20 ppg with the soft rules today.

[NbaAllDay]

Sustained excellence absolutely means something. There is value to peak/Prime years and Kobe has plenty more.

However Jokic is a better player and peaked higher.

As for all time ranking Jokic needs some more years under his belt. I think the whole x rings and MVPs is a little nonsense, especially Rings but I imagine he gets a few more anyhow.