If you were the Raptors would you even want to keep this years pick?

[giberish]

Toronto is very unlikely to stay at #6. If they keep their pick it's almost certainly a top-4 pick. If they don't move up they'll almost certainly move back to 7 or 8 and give the pick to SA.

So it's not really #6 vs #10 or so next season, it's top-4 vs #10 or so next season.

[Johnny Bball]

1st choice - Top 4 pick (38%), lose 2025 pick
2nd choice - Convey 7th or 8th (9th, 10th very unlikely), keep 2025 pick
3rd choice - Stay at 6th (9%)
5th pick can't happen.

The 3rd choice would be just really unlucky.

1 and 2 are probably close enough that it doesn't matter much. But fans have some real severe FOMO about giving a pick up this year for some reason. Maybe they get ultra lucky and keep 2024 and 2025 and are better than the Pacers in 2026. Who knows.

The GMs interests are not aligned with the franchise. By tanking he's likely given a more valuable pick away the following year, even if he gives away pick #10 instead of pick #7. Should the Raps be praying to lose the pick this lottery?

And no, tanking was the right thing because at 6, the most likely outcome is 1 or 2.

[76thBearCub]

If people can't be bothered reading before they vote they deserve to throw their vote away.

People clicked the thread to answer your thread title. But your poll is the opposite. The other person also agreed with this.

I did the same damn thing.

Just use alphabetical order for voting. Saves time.

[baldur]

Read the title first and then the poll question you end up forgetting what to vote for. Haha.

[VanWest82]

1st choice - Top 4 pick (38%), lose 2025 pick
2nd choice - Convey 7th or 8th (9th, 10th very unlikely), keep 2025 pick
3rd choice - Stay at 6th (9%)

The 3rd choice would be just really unlucky.

1 and 2 are probably close enough that it doesn't matter much. But fans have some real severe FOMO about giving up this year. Maybe they get ultra lucky and keep 2024 and 2025 and are better than the Pacers in 2026. Who knows.

I don't understand why you'd rather convey it now than pick 6th. Presumably, we'd still get a good prospect at 6, or could use it as part of a trade where we select the player on behalf of another team. And like you said, that option doesn't rule out keeping it next year too though I'd prefer to not have to sit through another season like this.

[Johnny Bball]

1st choice - Top 4 pick (38%), lose 2025 pick
2nd choice - Convey 7th or 8th (9th, 10th very unlikely), keep 2025 pick
3rd choice - Stay at 6th (9%)

The 3rd choice would be just really unlucky.

1 and 2 are probably close enough that it doesn't matter much. But fans have some real severe FOMO about giving up this year. Maybe they get ultra lucky and keep 2024 and 2025 and are better than the Pacers in 2026. Who knows.

I don't understand why you'd rather convey it now than pick 6th. Presumably, we'd still get a good prospect at 6, or could use it as part of a trade where we select the player on behalf of another team. And like you said, that option doesn't rule out keeping it next year too though I'd prefer to not have to sit through another season like this.

Yes. I think you will find 6th-10th will equal late lottery next year, or possibly even later. 1-4 will likely equal mid lottery, weighted by how much closer to 1 it is.

They aren't tanking next year from the jump either way, you should know better than that. They may end up sucking and tank the end, but that's the way it goes.

[VanWest82]

1st choice - Top 4 pick (38%), lose 2025 pick
2nd choice - Convey 7th or 8th (9th, 10th very unlikely), keep 2025 pick
3rd choice - Stay at 6th (9%)

The 3rd choice would be just really unlucky.

1 and 2 are probably close enough that it doesn't matter much. But fans have some real severe FOMO about giving up this year. Maybe they get ultra lucky and keep 2024 and 2025 and are better than the Pacers in 2026. Who knows.

I don't understand why you'd rather convey it now than pick 6th. Presumably, we'd still get a good prospect at 6, or could use it as part of a trade where we select the player on behalf of another team. And like you said, that option doesn't rule out keeping it next year too though I'd prefer to not have to sit through another season like this.

Yes. I think you will find 6th-10th will equal late lottery next year, or possibly even later. 1-4 will likely equal mid lottery, weighted by how much closer to 1 it is.

They aren't tanking next year from the jump either way, you should know better than that. They may end up sucking and tank the end, but that's the way it goes.

I wasn't suggesting they'd tank from the start, just that keeping it this year doesn't rule out the possibility of keeping next year too.

I know what's being said generally about this year vs. next year draft, but I'll be surprised if it's that dramatic. There are no Cooper Flaggs this year, and so that part is very different, but claiming the 6th pick is worth something like the 13th pick next year is one hell of an indictment on this class (or perhaps a testament to the depth next year). We'll see.

I also think there's added value in getting someone in the door now vs. next year given our core young players are either into their second contracts already or are about to sign their extention.

[disoblige]

People clicked the thread to answer your thread title. But your poll is the opposite. The other person also agreed with this.

I did the same damn thing.

Just use alphabetical order for voting. Saves time.

Why ask a different question in the poll and thread title?
Example
Thread Title: Will Denver win this year?
Poll: Will Denver lose this year?

[Johnny Bball]

I don't understand why you'd rather convey it now than pick 6th. Presumably, we'd still get a good prospect at 6, or could use it as part of a trade where we select the player on behalf of another team. And like you said, that option doesn't rule out keeping it next year too though I'd prefer to not have to sit through another season like this.

Yes. I think you will find 6th-10th will equal late lottery next year, or possibly even later. 1-4 will likely equal mid lottery, weighted by how much closer to 1 it is.

They aren't tanking next year from the jump either way, you should know better than that. They may end up sucking and tank the end, but that's the way it goes.

I wasn't suggesting they'd tank from the start, just that keeping it this year doesn't rule out the possibility of keeping next year too.

I know what's being said generally about this year vs. next year draft, but I'll be surprised if it's that dramatic. There are no Cooper Flaggs this year, and so that part is very different, but claiming the 6th pick is worth something like the 13th pick next year is one hell of an indictment on this class (or perhaps a testament to the depth next year). We'll see.

I also think there's added value in getting someone in the door now vs. next year given our core young players are either into their second contracts already or are about to sign their extention.

This draft isn't good at the top. That's fact. You are going to have minimum 3-4 picks next year better than anyone in this draft from a scouting perspective. Its the double covid cohort year (they pushed back anyone 2020) so you have more seniors that can declare. It looks like in 2024, the middle lottery to past the lottery okay and a bit of a crap shoot with players of more similar quality than usual but some talent there. I don't see how the 2025 lottery is worse at the top and it should be deeper and not as flat as picks decline.

As for talent now, you will notice my first choice right?

https://www.nbadraft.net/nba-mock-drafts/?year-mock=2013

https://www.nbadraft.net/actual-draft/?year-mock=2013

https://www.nbadraft.net/actual-draft/?year-mock=2014

Just for comparison.

[Tor_Raps]

We suck and need all the young talent we can get as fast as possible. Our front office has proven to be pretty good at drafting so I will assume we will make the right pick.

[VanWest82]

Yes. I think you will find 6th-10th will equal late lottery next year, or possibly even later. 1-4 will likely equal mid lottery, weighted by how much closer to 1 it is.

They aren't tanking next year from the jump either way, you should know better than that. They may end up sucking and tank the end, but that's the way it goes.

I wasn't suggesting they'd tank from the start, just that keeping it this year doesn't rule out the possibility of keeping next year too.

I know what's being said generally about this year vs. next year draft, but I'll be surprised if it's that dramatic. There are no Cooper Flaggs this year, and so that part is very different, but claiming the 6th pick is worth something like the 13th pick next year is one hell of an indictment on this class (or perhaps a testament to the depth next year). We'll see.

I also think there's added value in getting someone in the door now vs. next year given our core young players are either into their second contracts already or are about to sign their extention.

This draft isn't good at the top. That's fact. You are going to have minimum 3-4 picks next year better than anyone in this draft from a scouting perspective. Its the double covid cohort year (they pushed back anyone 2020) so you have more seniors that can declare. It looks like in 2024, the middle lottery to past the lottery okay and a bit of a crap shoot with players of more similar quality than usual but some talent there. I don't see how the 2025 lottery is worse at the top and it should be deeper and not as flat as picks decline.

I agree we can probably count on guys like Flagg and Bailey being much better than anyone this year, but just looking at the ESPN top 100 rankings, the classes don't look that far apart exluding those two. Take that with a grain of salt.

The double covid cohort year is interesting. I remember when a version of that was going to happen with the age change that never materialized in the last CBA negotiation. OTOH seniors don't typically get taken in the lottery, and if there was really this big discrepancy some of those upper classmen would just declare a year early to get picked higher and get a better contract.

Edit:

As for talent now, you will notice my first choice right?

Yes, I'm quibbling with our minor difference in opinion here because it's a message board and that's what we do. It was just an interesting take to want top 1-4 but not 6.

https://www.nbadraft.net/nba-mock-drafts/?year-mock=2013

https://www.nbadraft.net/actual-draft/?year-mock=2013

https://www.nbadraft.net/actual-draft/?year-mock=2014

Just for comparison.

Yes this is a good illustration that there can be big differences in class quality beyond just the top guys.

[76thBearCub]

I did the same damn thing.

Just use alphabetical order for voting. Saves time.

Why ask a different question in the poll and thread title?
Example
Thread Title: Will Denver win this year?
Poll: Will Denver lose this year?

Use eenie meenie miney moe if it makes you more comfortable.

[One_and_Done]

We suck and need all the young talent we can get as fast as possible. Our front office has proven to be pretty good at drafting so I will assume we will make the right pick.

Assumedly your front office would make an even better pick if they had a more valuable draft pick then.

[rapsfanz420]

I hate it when the poll asks the complete opposite of what the thread title's asking.

Also fell victim to this

Want to convey this year, so we have all our first round picks going forward.

[louc1970]

This years draft looks terrible. Masai tanking seems to have been a classic example of moral hazard. The GMs interests are not aligned with the franchise. By tanking he's likely given a more valuable pick away the following year, even if he gives away pick #10 instead of pick #7. Should the Raps be praying to lose the pick this lottery?

I get the thought process. Get the trade over or potentially lose a better player next year.
I think it all depends on who is available. If it is Clingan or Sarr, you probably want to keep the pick. Anyone else duplicates current players and diminishes the value.

[SFour]

If it's a top 4 pick you have to take it (odds are Raptors either jump into top 4 or lose the pick).....you don't just pass on that even in a weak draft.

[One_and_Done]

If it's a top 4 pick you have to take it (odds are Raptors either jump into top 4 or lose the pick).....you don't just pass on that even in a weak draft.

The thread is about whether you want to convey #7.

[Raps in 4]

I absolutely want to keep the pick this year.

This team is going to be fighting for a play-in spot next year. This is our last chance at a high lotto pick for a while.

I'd rather have a top-6 pick in a "weak" draft (there is no way to accurately predict the strength of a draft) than an 11-15 pick next year.

[The Servant]

They got Jacob Poetl and Immanuel Quickly. cRaps are in a great place and Masai can do no wrong.

[BlzMwt]

This years draft looks terrible. Masai tanking seems to have been a classic example of moral hazard. The GMs interests are not aligned with the franchise. By tanking he's likely given a more valuable pick away the following year, even if he gives away pick #10 instead of pick #7. Should the Raps be praying to lose the pick this lottery?

You seem to be claiming that Ujiri somehow intentionally tanked this season. They flipped their big names at the deadline which was a move pretty much everyone agreed should happen but obviously made their team worse in the short term. Then Barnes broke his hand, Poeltl underwent surgery, and both Quickly and Barret missed significant time with injuries and deaths in the family.

All that coupled with a team that had little depth before the injuries led to lots of ugly losses. Had Barnes and Poeltl stayed healthy I highly doubt they finish behind Memphis.

As for the draft, I've watched this game long enough to know that supposed "experts" who label drafts weak usually don't have a damned clue what they're talking about. I expect that if the raptors retain the pick they'll come out with a useful player. The hope being that with a healthy lineup next year and the infusion of depth with their 3 picks this year and any other off-season moves will result in them conveying a pick outside the lottery next year.

Masai, is that you?

Bro, you clearly tanked.

the guy gives you a very thoughtful response and that's your rebuttal? And you're the OP who is asking for discussion on the matter

Why wouldn't the Raptors have traded OG for more of a draft pick heavy deal than taking back Barrett and Quickley?

Are you thinking that Barnes broken hand was intentional...? What about Barrett missing time for the death in his family?