RealGM

Handlez wrote:Crazy talk.

Kobe would own this current league.

He really wouldn't. Kobe was a ball dominant iso ball scorer, a Kobe dominating this current league wouldn't be the Kobe we all saw.

One_and_Done wrote:

tsherkin wrote:

FluLikeSymptoms wrote:The “Kobe would be a better shooter now” arguments don’t hold any water, nobody practiced more more than Kobe did and if he’d have been a better shooter he would’ve made more. The guy made 12 threes in a game fairly early in his career, he knew what threese were, he was just a streaky shooter and overall just not as great of a shooter as from anywhere as some make him out to be.

It's less shooting ability, and more his shot selection at the time. That might change, given the era-specific emphasis on those shots.

Kobe during his career was probably the least flexible and adaptable star in the league. It's a big stretch to assume he'd be willing to play a different way.

I think the bigger stretch is you ever allowing yourself to have a positive thought about Kobe, to be honest.

One_and_Done wrote:Right now Ant's per 100 stats are 40.3p, 10.4r, 8.1a, 648 TS%, on a 128 Ortg, while playing good D. Tell me the playoffs Kobe had that I should compare that too. It's still early of course, but if he keeps this up it's clearly better than anything Kobe did.

The dude is killing it out there, and that more than any stat is notable. That reliable deep 3 is something Kobe never had, which would really hurt him today. He is just impacting games more than Kobe could.

Who would you build a team around in today's league?

What's with your agenda against Kobe?

D.Brasco wrote:

Handlez wrote:Crazy talk.

Kobe would own this current league.

He really wouldn't. Kobe was a ball dominant iso ball scorer, a Kobe dominating this current league wouldn't be the Kobe we all saw.

There are many far lesser players than Kobe dominating this league, Ant included.

You just be happy Ant isn’t playing with someone as dominant as Shaq otherwise the wc would be a wrap for the next 8 years.

LakerLegend wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

Handlez wrote:Crazy talk.

Kobe would own this current league.

He really wouldn't. Kobe was a ball dominant iso ball scorer, a Kobe dominating this current league wouldn't be the Kobe we all saw.

There are many far lesser players than Kobe dominating this league, Ant included.

22 year old Ant compared to 22 yo Kobe, I don't see him being any less than Kobe was at that age and arguably quite ahead tbh. I'm not comparing legacy or accolades but just viewing how both of them looked at the same age.

Prime Kobe in today's NBA with all his skill and athleticism intact would be a sight to behold.

D.Brasco wrote:

LakerLegend wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:
He really wouldn't. Kobe was a ball dominant iso ball scorer, a Kobe dominating this current league wouldn't be the Kobe we all saw.

There are many far lesser players than Kobe dominating this league, Ant included.

22 year old Ant compared to 22 yo Kobe, I don't see him being any less than Kobe was at that age and arguably quite ahead tbh. I'm not comparing legacy or accolades but just viewing how both of them looked at the same age.

Kobe at 22 at a lot of analysts/former players saying Kobe was better than Jordan at the same age. No one's saying that about Ant.

tsherkin wrote:

One_and_Done wrote:

tsherkin wrote:
It's less shooting ability, and more his shot selection at the time. That might change, given the era-specific emphasis on those shots.

Kobe during his career was probably the least flexible and adaptable star in the league. It's a big stretch to assume he'd be willing to play a different way.

I think the bigger stretch is you ever allowing yourself to have a positive thought about Kobe, to be honest.

Calling somebody "one of the top 25 players to ever play" is a pretty positive statement. Of the countless thousands to play ball, he is near the top. Only 20-24 guys are likely better.

One_and_Done wrote:

tsherkin wrote:

One_and_Done wrote:Kobe during his career was probably the least flexible and adaptable star in the league. It's a big stretch to assume he'd be willing to play a different way.

I think the bigger stretch is you ever allowing yourself to have a positive thought about Kobe, to be honest.

Calling somebody "one of the top 25 players to ever play" is a pretty positive statement. Of the countless thousands to play ball, he is near the top. Only 20-24 guys are likely better.

lol, name them.

There have been countless posters before you with this same shtick so we've seen it all.

One_and_Done wrote:Calling somebody "one of the top 25 players to ever play" is a pretty positive statement. Of the countless thousands to play ball, he is near the top. Only 20-24 guys are likely better.

You actively crap on him in every thread where you speak about him, so that rings a little hollow, to be honest.

In any case, Ant is quite young and showing out quite well. League-relative, Kobe was a more efficient scorer than Ant. That comes with the usual "can't be sure that translates" kind of argument you often make, to be sure. But Kobe also did it in 07, 08 and 2013, and there was a significant rise in league-average TS% during those periods compared to 2001, so there's that to consider.

LakerLegend wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

LakerLegend wrote:
There are many far lesser players than Kobe dominating this league, Ant included.

22 year old Ant compared to 22 yo Kobe, I don't see him being any less than Kobe was at that age and arguably quite ahead tbh. I'm not comparing legacy or accolades but just viewing how both of them looked at the same age.

Kobe at 22 at a lot of analysts/former players saying Kobe was better than Jordan at the same age. No one's saying that about Ant.

I remember that time and it more so about Kobe being only 22 and already having 2 rings (by fortune of playing with Shaq), while Jordan famously didn't win his first until he was 28. When Kobe was 23 with 3 rings and the Lakers dynasty was at its zenith, you did have people predicting Kobe would pass Jordan in ring count before he was 30. It wasn't so much a 1 to 1 skill comparison between him and MJ.

D.Brasco wrote:

LakerLegend wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:
22 year old Ant compared to 22 yo Kobe, I don't see him being any less than Kobe was at that age and arguably quite ahead tbh. I'm not comparing legacy or accolades but just viewing how both of them looked at the same age.

Kobe at 22 at a lot of analysts/former players saying Kobe was better than Jordan at the same age. No one's saying that about Ant.

I remember that time and it more so about Kobe being only 22 and already having 2 rings (by fortune of playing with Shaq), while Jordan famously didn't win his first until he was 28. When Kobe was 23 with 3 rings and the Lakers dynasty was at its zenith, you did have people predicting Kobe would pass Jordan in ring count before he was 30. It wasn't so much a 1 to 1 skill comparison between him and MJ.

They were talking about it because of his performances in those 2001 playoffs.

LakerLegend wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

LakerLegend wrote:
Kobe at 22 at a lot of analysts/former players saying Kobe was better than Jordan at the same age. No one's saying that about Ant.

I remember that time and it more so about Kobe being only 22 and already having 2 rings (by fortune of playing with Shaq), while Jordan famously didn't win his first until he was 28. When Kobe was 23 with 3 rings and the Lakers dynasty was at its zenith, you did have people predicting Kobe would pass Jordan in ring count before he was 30. It wasn't so much a 1 to 1 skill comparison between him and MJ.

They were talking about it because of his performances in those 2001 playoffs.

He did get the Jordan comparisons then, VC got them as well, I don't recall them saying he was better than Jordan. Jordan's rookie season at 21 holds up statistically to Kobe's MVP season, so he wasn't doing anything then that seemed beyond Jordan but yes, he had much greater team success early in his career.

LakerLegend wrote:

One_and_Done wrote:

tsherkin wrote:
I think the bigger stretch is you ever allowing yourself to have a positive thought about Kobe, to be honest.

Calling somebody "one of the top 25 players to ever play" is a pretty positive statement. Of the countless thousands to play ball, he is near the top. Only 20-24 guys are likely better.

lol, name them.

Sure.

Well, to start with I'd say he's got no argument whatever over Lebron, Kareem, Duncan, Jordan, Shaq, Magic, Hakeem, Curry, KG, Jokic, Bird, Giannis, KD, etc. That's 13, so only 7 to go, which is good because there are at least 7 guys left I'd definitely take over him including Dirk, D.Rob, CP3, K.Malone, S.Nash, Luka is on pace, etc. I'd also strongly consider Harden, Wade, Tatum, Butler, and depending on how they finish longevity wise Embiid & Kawhi. Ant is on track to surpass him if he keeps this up for sure.

D.Brasco wrote:

LakerLegend wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:
I remember that time and it more so about Kobe being only 22 and already having 2 rings (by fortune of playing with Shaq), while Jordan famously didn't win his first until he was 28. When Kobe was 23 with 3 rings and the Lakers dynasty was at its zenith, you did have people predicting Kobe would pass Jordan in ring count before he was 30. It wasn't so much a 1 to 1 skill comparison between him and MJ.

They were talking about it because of his performances in those 2001 playoffs.

He did get the Jordan comparisons then, VC got them as well, I don't recall them saying he was better than Jordan. Jordan's rookie season at 21 holds up statistically to Kobe's MVP season, so he wasn't doing anything then that seemed beyond Jordan but yes, he had much greater team success early in his career.

The 80's were run and gun, so to compare the stats on a 1 to 1 basis from their eras is disingenuous (but you already know that).

Vince was never compared to Jordan to the degree Kobe was. Vince was compared because he was about the same size and athletic, and a star player. Kobe was based on skills and impact.

Jordan himself said at the time he would take Kobe over VC.

Give me KOBE

This is the issue with the present. We watch someone amazing and then forget that players in the past were another level of amazing. Ant has the potential though.

How about instead of comparing their platitudes we compare their impact, starting with Ant killing Kobe on stats this playoffs.