Do you now think Hedo Turkoglu should be an all star?

Wayland The Smith · Post #21 » by **Wayland The Smith** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:07 pm

i don't know he will make it or not, but i can't understand people who just say no!!. Certainly he's in the race, he deserves consideration.

CourtsideTV · Post #22 » by **CourtsideTV** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:27 pm

the game winner he just had should give him some 'street cred'.

and i tihnk he deserves to make it the way he's played tihs season..you dont looka t how they did last season..you look at this season and he's pretty much the go to guy in the 4th for the team..the team leader and carries the load..makes plays by passing amazing and sets up the offense..he's playing a point forward role for the team with nelson out and arroyo/dooling not true pgs.

he's had some crazy shots to help the team win at least 5 games this season and the toher games so far he's been very solid.

Pats19andO · Post #23 » by **Pats19andO** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:47 pm

Just as much as Eddie House does

Rick Rolled · Post #24 » by **Rick Rolled** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:30 pm

To put it bluntly, i'd rather him not make the allstar team, and keep shoving clutch shots up other teams asses on a regular basis during games that actually matter.

hermes · Post #25 » by **hermes** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:40 pm

he's had a good year
but not good enough to replace anyone

MagicFan3 · Post #26 » by **MagicFan3** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:39 am

He's been more valuable to his team than Jamison arguably. There are some people (who are likely insane) who think Hedo might be the most important player on the Magic.

HumbleBumbleBee · Post #27 » by **HumbleBumbleBee** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:43 am

Yes, him and Jose are two guys I would love to see make it...but its not happening. The NBA has nothing to gain with these two there :noway:

Post #28 » by **5DOM** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:53 am

HumbleBumbleBee wrote:Yes, him and Jose are two guys I would love to see make it...but its not happening. The NBA has nothing to gain with these two there

spaniards and turkish

Post #29 » by **miller31time** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:54 am

No preconceived notions here. I felt that Hedo was having a good season and putting up very nice numbers, but when you look at the guys ahead of him, he simply will not make it barring injuries to 1 or 2 of the Eastern forward locks.

GJense4181 · Post #30 » by **GJense4181** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 2:15 am

Even if his numbers/play deserved it, I still would not want to *watch* him play in the all-star game.
If we were to reward every borderline all-star's breakout season than we'd see more Hedo Turkoglu/Kevin Martin/Chris Kaman and less Vince Carter/Tracy McGrady/Amare Stoudemire, for example.
All things being equal, I'll give an all-star nod to the player that a) I would rather have on my team, and b) who I simply enjoy to watch more.

Idunkonyou2 · Post #31 » by **Idunkonyou2** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 2:18 am

Yes because he is one of the best 4th quarter performers in the league. He completely owned Pierce in the 2nd half today.

MagicFan3 · Post #32 » by **MagicFan3** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 2:23 am

GJense4181 wrote:Even if his numbers/play deserved it, I still would not want to *watch* him play in the all-star game.
If we were to reward every borderline all-star's breakout season than we'd see more Hedo Turkoglu/Kevin Martin/Chris Kaman and less Vince Carter/Tracy McGrady/Amare Stoudemire, for example.
All things being equal, I'll give an all-star nod to the player that a) I would rather have on my team, and b) who I simply enjoy to watch more.

That's a terrible attitude. The ASG is about the best players who deserve it the most, not about who will do something flashy. Everyone, no matter what name it is, will do flashy crap at the ASG.

HumbleBumbleBee · Post #33 » by **HumbleBumbleBee** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 2:36 am

GJense4181 wrote:Even if his numbers/play deserved it, I still would not want to *watch* him play in the all-star game.
If we were to reward every borderline all-star's breakout season than we'd see more Hedo Turkoglu/Kevin Martin/Chris Kaman and less Vince Carter/Tracy McGrady/Amare Stoudemire, for example.
All things being equal, I'll give an all-star nod to the player that a) I would rather have on my team, and b) who I simply enjoy to watch more.

this is whats wrong with fans voting and having the all star game in the middle of the season

ToffKobe · Post #34 » by **ToffKobe** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 3:01 am

GJense4181 wrote:Even if his numbers/play deserved it, I still would not want to *watch* him play in the all-star game.
If we were to reward every borderline all-star's breakout season than we'd see more Hedo Turkoglu/Kevin Martin/Chris Kaman and less Vince Carter/Tracy McGrady/Amare Stoudemire, for example.
All things being equal, I'll give an all-star nod to the player that a) I would rather have on my team, and b) who I simply enjoy to watch more.

WOW, thank God the coaches vote for the bench at least.

El Turco · Post #35 » by **El Turco** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 3:16 am

GJense4181 wrote:Even if his numbers/play deserved it, I still would not want to *watch* him play in the all-star game.
If we were to reward every borderline all-star's breakout season than we'd see more Hedo Turkoglu/Kevin Martin/Chris Kaman and less Vince Carter/Tracy McGrady/Amare Stoudemire, for example.
All things being equal, I'll give an all-star nod to the player that a) I would rather have on my team, and b) who I simply enjoy to watch more.

dumb people like this make vince carter all-star starter.

GJense4181 · Post #36 » by **GJense4181** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 3:16 am

No, MVPs and all post-season awards, such as MVPs, MIP, ROY, DPOY, and All-NBA teams is about the players that *deserve it the most*.
The All-Star game, to more of a degree than any other recognition, spotlights individuals. Three point contest. Dunk contest. Skills challenge. and so forth.

and you literature majors did not comprehend my "All things being equal" disclaimer. If Vince Carter and Hedo Turkoglu, after factoring in team success/statistics, are near-equals, I will choose Vince Carter SIMPLY BECAUSE I enjoy watching him more. and would rather have him on the Pistons than Hedo Turkoglu (salaries aside).
If you've ever watched a Cleveland game SIMPLY to watch Lebron James play, you are guilty of this as well, and can stop being self-righteous.

ToffKobe · Post #37 » by **ToffKobe** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 3:45 am

GJense4181 wrote:No, MVPs and all post-season awards, such as MVPs, MIP, ROY, DPOY, and All-NBA teams is about the players that *deserve it the most*.
The All-Star game, to more of a degree than any other recognition, spotlights individuals. Three point contest. Dunk contest. Skills challenge. and so forth.

and you literature majors did not comprehend my "All things being equal" disclaimer. If Vince Carter and Hedo Turkoglu, after factoring in team success/statistics, are near-equals, I will choose Vince Carter SIMPLY BECAUSE I enjoy watching him more. and would rather have him on the Pistons than Hedo Turkoglu (salaries aside).
If you've ever watched a Cleveland game SIMPLY to watch Lebron James play, you are guilty of this as well, and can stop being self-righteous.

Being voted by the fans as a starter is relegated to popularity, while being voted by the coaches as a reserve is all about the players that deserve it the most, so what you're saying has no merit.

Obviously Vince Carter is the better talent so your example of having him on your team over Turkoglu was pretty bad. The whole point of being chosen as an all star reserve is being worthy of it. Vince has not been worthy of it this season and Turkoglu has simply outplayed him this year. You can't really make an argument for Vince.

Derekman · Post #38 » by **Derekman** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 3:51 am

Reserves: Pierce,Bosh,Caron,Jamison,Billups,Rip,Calderon

HM: Turkoglu and Josh Smith

GJense4181 · Post #39 » by **GJense4181** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 4:09 am

ToffBosh wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Being voted by the fans as a starter is relegated to popularity, while being voted by the coaches as a reserve is all about the players that deserve it the most, so what you're saying has no merit.

Obviously Vince Carter is the better talent so your example of having him on your team over Turkoglu was pretty bad. The whole point of being chosen as an all star reserve is being worthy of it. Vince has not been worthy of it this season and Turkoglu has simply outplayed him this year. You can't really make an argument for Vince.

Right. and when nincompoops vote injured players (Grant Hill, for example) into the starting lineup, we have a problem.
But when it's a tossup between two players for a reserve spot any coach--or I, if I were voting--can use whatever criteria they wish to discern between the two. It is entirely subjective, and those polled (coaches, media, fans, or ME, in this instance) are allowed to use their best judgment.
So. Please. Tell me my opinion has no merit based on some standard that you've conveniently created for your argument's sake (where does it say/who says that starters are a popularity free-for-fall and reserves are *merit-based*?).

Turkoglu has not outplayed Vince Carter. Orlando has performed better than New Jersey. Vince Carter is the superior talent (as you have said) and has a style of play that caters to relaxed all-star contests. Vince's argument is Josh Boone missing 8 games, Nenad Krstic struggling to return from injury and only playing 12/44 contests, Jason , Richard Jefferson stealing his shots, Jason Kidd's poor-shooting, Jamaal Magloire being an effective FA bust, Collins PLAYING in 39, and mediocre Antoine Wright playing 28 minutes a game... Address all of those issues and Vince Carter's 21/5.5/5 looks a LOT better.

This isn't about Hedo Turkoglu or Vince Carter specifically, though. It's downright foolish to dismiss a suggestion or point of view that would make entertainment more enjoyable to watch.

ToffKobe · Post #40 » by **ToffKobe** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 4:23 am

[quote="GJense4181"][/quote]

Man there's so much wrong with your post I don't know where to begin, and I don't feel like writing too much. So I'll simply say that despite all the marquee players the past 2/3 years, the allstar game hasn't been competitive nor has it been fun to watch. If that's your cup of tea then sure, so be it.