RealGM

Iverson had his time and a team developed perfectly around his talents and it wasn't enough.

T-Mac never led any team past the first round.

I'd akin more to players that either never really got a shot with a legit team or at least have come close before [maybe ECF or WCF]

So that said, Elton Brand/Shawn marion (I like his game)/Carter/J'Oneal

Nash and Dirk I don't think are yet out of it and are still leading contending teams although that may be over as soon as next year. And I'm torn on Kidd. He was in teh Finals I think about 3 years seemingly in a row and never got it done but idk if his team was ever contender status worthy or if the East was just that bad.

Allen Iverson easily.

players i want to see win:
AI
Nash
Brand

and id be happy to see Kidd never win a damn thing

other-Gilbert Arenas

And Shawn Marion isn't a superstar.

Iverson definitely and Ason Kidd. Both have actually been to the finals too.

I like T-Mac but Iverson has done a lot more for the game. Yea. We're talking about the game. Not practice.

jason kidd

Allen Iverson then Vince Carter.

PPAW4Life wrote:I am basing that statement on the whole career that is Vince Carter.

Unbelievable talent....huge disappointment and massive underachievement.

Before those last 3 years he has only played in more than 70 games 3 of 8 seasons. What's the average of these 8 seasons you might wonder? 57.5 games...I will be generous and round up to 58 games.

Lets add in those 3 years since they are beyond the norms for this guy made of glass....and the average for his 11 year career is a whopping 63.364 and I will again be generous and round up to 64 games.

Now I don't know about you but if my star player doesn't play more than 70 games a season on average....I am bummed out. He is a max player-type AS talent who can't be productive because he is a low threshold of pain and brittle body...never a good match.

ur an idiot.. and basically..... that sums it up

First of all... ur a moron......

Secondly... he played in 10 seasons.... tell me how has he played in 11 years when he started in 98?? they squished a season in there somewhere?? a short summer season?? lol moron

Thirdly.... in order of years.... his games played per season....
50/50 games
82/82 games
75/82 games
60/82 games
43/82 games.. they shut him down because they wanted to tank for a high draft pick
73/82 games
77/82 games
79/82 games
82/82 games
76/82 games

so basically he played 70 or more games in 7 outta 9 full seasons.... and if u count percentages.. 8 outta 10 seasons because of the strike shorten season.

Lastly, u should get ur facts straight before u argue. i could tear u a new hole, but i'm done talking to kids.

Iverson, then T-Mac.

Naslund15 wrote:

PPAW4Life wrote:I am basing that statement on the whole career that is Vince Carter.

Unbelievable talent....huge disappointment and massive underachievement.

Before those last 3 years he has only played in more than 70 games 3 of 8 seasons. What's the average of these 8 seasons you might wonder? 57.5 games...I will be generous and round up to 58 games.

Lets add in those 3 years since they are beyond the norms for this guy made of glass....and the average for his 11 year career is a whopping 63.364 and I will again be generous and round up to 64 games.

Now I don't know about you but if my star player doesn't play more than 70 games a season on average....I am bummed out. He is a max player-type AS talent who can't be productive because he is a low threshold of pain and brittle body...never a good match.

ur an idiot.. and basically..... that sums it up

First of all... ur a moron......

Secondly... he played in 10 seasons.... tell me how has he played in 11 years when he started in 98?? they squished a season in there somewhere?? a short summer season?? lol moron

Thirdly.... in order of years.... his games played per season....
50/50 games
82/82 games
75/82 games
60/82 games
43/82 games.. they shut him down because they wanted to tank for a high draft pick
73/82 games
77/82 games
79/82 games
82/82 games
76/82 games

so basically he played 70 or more games in 7 outta 9 full seasons.... and if u count percentages.. 8 outta 10 seasons because of the strike shorten season.

Lastly, u should get ur facts straight before u argue. i could tear u a new hole, but i'm done talking to kids.

anybody who says things like "ur a moron" and "i could tear u a new hole" shows what type of person they really are, and u sir, are a moron

AI

superstar? Marion? at least put LeBron's name on the list, he looked like he's 30

I voted for Carter because he's my favourite out of the list but I will admit that hands down the player that deserves it the most is AI with Nash a close second.
Both dont have the classic NBA body (AI is quite short and Nash is an all around un-gifted guy) but both managed to get to an extremley high level and always just fell short of that overall goal (AI got spanked in the finals against the Kobe-Shaq Lakers in their prime and Nash was screwed by the league after the Horry incident).

Kidd though is the one guy that clearly DOESNT deserve a championship that guy went from one franchise to another forcing deals,throwing those franchises under the bus and getting coaches fired over nothing just so he can play for a team that he thinks will be able to get him his ring that's far from a class act or a good person.
KG,Pierce and Allan all deserved that ring because they waited for their chance to be on a contending team and had to endure some pretty tough years but NEVER threw their franchises under the bus.

PPAW4Life wrote:He has played 79, 82 and 76 games the last 3 years. How is he injury prone?

I am basing that statement on the whole career that is Vince Carter.

Unbelievable talent....huge disappointment and massive underachievement.

Before those last 3 years he has only played in more than 70 games 3 of 8 seasons. What's the average of these 8 seasons you might wonder? 57.5 games...I will be generous and round up to 58 games.

Lets add in those 3 years since they are beyond the norms for this guy made of glass....and the average for his 11 year career is a whopping 63.364 and I will again be generous and round up to 64 games.

Now I don't know about you but if my star player doesn't play more than 70 games a season on average....I am bummed out. He is a max player-type AS talent who can't be productive because he is a low threshold of pain and brittle body...never a good match.

You're arguement is laughable considering that you didn't take into context that VC played 50 of 50 games in 1998-1999 and not 50 of 82.

He's played less than 73 games only twice(excluding lock season) in his 10 career. Those two years came in his 4th and 5th seasons and he just completed his 10th. Clearly, he's not the injury prone guy he is in your world. He's played in 85% of the games in his entire career, so no, you're wrong, you twisted facts, please stop trying.

Raps4evr wrote:Why are people choosing TMac? Lol, he first needs to worry about getting out of the FIRST round, before he can start aiming so high.

If he can lead a team to a 22-win-streak he can also win the championship the first time he make the second round, there are special players, and "mediocre" players.

AI

Easily AI, followed by Nash and then JON but only because he is a Raptor and that would mean the Raptors won.

Naslund15 wrote:ur an idiot.. and basically..... that sums it up

First of all... ur a moron......

Secondly... he played in 10 seasons.... tell me how has he played in 11 years when he started in 98?? they squished a season in there somewhere?? a short summer season?? lol moron

Hmmm good question....guess it was late and I didn't look carefully at the dates. I just counted down the lines and counted the '04-'05 season twice....honest mistake, my bad!

Naslund15 wrote:Thirdly.... in order of years.... his games played per season....
50/50 games
82/82 games
75/82 games
60/82 games
43/82 games.. they shut him down because they wanted to tank for a high draft pick
73/82 games
77/82 games
79/82 games
82/82 games
76/82 games

so basically he played 70 or more games in 7 outta 9 full seasons.... and if u count percentages.. 8 outta 10 seasons because of the strike shorten season.

Lastly, u should get ur facts straight before u argue. i could tear u a new hole, but i'm done talking to kids.

Well damn....I guess I was more tired than I thought and completely forgot the strike-shortened season.

My apologies and I stand corrected.

Yet I still don't see why people want to see him win a championship....the guy quit on his teammates, the Raptors organization, and their fans forcing a trade in which they got nothing of significant value. He still doesn't play defense, is soft/relies on his jumper way too much, and shouldn't be a center piece of championship team.

PapooseKN wrote:

PPAW4Life wrote:He has played 79, 82 and 76 games the last 3 years. How is he injury prone?

I am basing that statement on the whole career that is Vince Carter.

Unbelievable talent....huge disappointment and massive underachievement.

Before those last 3 years he has only played in more than 70 games 3 of 8 seasons. What's the average of these 8 seasons you might wonder? 57.5 games...I will be generous and round up to 58 games.

Lets add in those 3 years since they are beyond the norms for this guy made of glass....and the average for his 11 year career is a whopping 63.364 and I will again be generous and round up to 64 games.

Now I don't know about you but if my star player doesn't play more than 70 games a season on average....I am bummed out. He is a max player-type AS talent who can't be productive because he is a low threshold of pain and brittle body...never a good match.

You're arguement is laughable considering that you didn't take into context that VC played 50 of 50 games in 1998-1999 and not 50 of 82.

He's played less than 73 games only twice(excluding lock season) in his 10 career. Those two years came in his 4th and 5th seasons and he just completed his 10th. Clearly, he's not the injury prone guy he is in your world. He's played in 85% of the games in his entire career, so no, you're wrong, you twisted facts, please stop trying.

My apologies, strike-shortened season slipped my mind...my bad, I was wrong....won't be the last!

Actually with the 50 game season he's played in 88% of his games which actually comes out to 72 games per 82 games....which doesn't look all that horrific anymore but it's not very good either.

I wouldn't want my number 1 option or one of my star players missing 10 games a year....that's very risky.

For a comparison we can look at Tmac....most people consider him to be injury-prone and his game attendance is at an 86% clip (749/870 games).