Is Derrick White a max player?

reload141 · Post #61 » by **reload141** » Thu May 9, 2024 8:32 pm

basketballRob wrote:
reload141 wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Suggs is 22, and White is 29 and just had his best season. White was a little better this season, but I'd take Suggs for the next 5 years.

https://stathead.com/basketball/versus-finder.cgi?request=1&seasons_type=perchoice&player_id1=suggsja01&p1yrfrom=2024&p1yrto=2024&player_id2=whitede01&p2yrfrom=2024&p2yrto=2024

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Depends what kind of team you are, if you’re contending it’s White, if you’re building its Suggs
Suggs should pass White soon.

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Not for a championship contending team within the next 3-4 years

basketballRob · Post #62 » by **basketballRob** » Thu May 9, 2024 8:39 pm

reload141 wrote:
basketballRob wrote:
reload141 wrote:
Depends what kind of team you are, if you’re contending it’s White, if you’re building its Suggs
Suggs should pass White soon.

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Not for a championship contending team within the next 3-4 years

The Magic should be in the mix for the next 5 years or so. It depends on if Banchero, Franz, and Suggs continue to improve.

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brackdan70 · Post #63 » by **brackdan70** » Thu May 9, 2024 8:42 pm

basketballRob wrote:
brackdan70 wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Suggs is 22, and White is 29 and just had his best season. White was a little better this season, but I'd take Suggs for the next 5 years.

https://stathead.com/basketball/versus-finder.cgi?request=1&seasons_type=perchoice&player_id1=suggsja01&p1yrfrom=2024&p1yrto=2024&player_id2=whitede01&p2yrfrom=2024&p2yrto=2024

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That’s cool but that is not the argument you made.their seasons were nowhere nearly identical.
If we want to talk about who is the better investment over the next 5 years then that’s a different conversation. Suggs can definitely turn into a Derick White level player and White is probably at or near his peak.
For the Celtics they want to keep this window open for a few years so they would probably choose White because of fit, but I can see the argument for the upside of the younger player.
White played a few more minutes per game, so his raw stats are a little higher. Shooting wise, they were near identical.

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All actual impact stats White is quite a bit better.

basketballRob · Post #64 » by **basketballRob** » Thu May 9, 2024 9:14 pm

brackdan70 wrote:
basketballRob wrote:
brackdan70 wrote:That’s cool but that is not the argument you made.their seasons were nowhere nearly identical.
If we want to talk about who is the better investment over the next 5 years then that’s a different conversation. Suggs can definitely turn into a Derick White level player and White is probably at or near his peak.
For the Celtics they want to keep this window open for a few years so they would probably choose White because of fit, but I can see the argument for the upside of the younger player.
White played a few more minutes per game, so his raw stats are a little higher. Shooting wise, they were near identical.

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All actual impact stats White is quite a bit better.

Everyone on a 60+ win team will have good advanced stats. Hauser probably had good defensive numbers, but if you put him on Portland, they would be bad. White's shooting numbers jumped when he was on a team full of shooters. Suggs was on a team full of players that couldn't shoot.

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brackdan70 · Post #65 » by **brackdan70** » Thu May 9, 2024 9:18 pm

basketballRob wrote:
brackdan70 wrote:
basketballRob wrote:White played a few more minutes per game, so his raw stats are a little higher. Shooting wise, they were near identical.

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All actual impact stats White is quite a bit better.
Everyone on a 60+ win team will have good advanced stats. Hauser probably had good defensive numbers, but if you put him on Portland, they would be bad. White's shooting numbers jumped when he was on a team full of shooters. Suggs was on a team full of players that couldn't shoot.

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So you are doubling down that Suggs is as good as White now? I think we will have to disagree. You can look up adjusted stats if you want.

basketballRob · Post #66 » by **basketballRob** » Thu May 9, 2024 9:22 pm

brackdan70 wrote:
basketballRob wrote:
brackdan70 wrote:All actual impact stats White is quite a bit better.
Everyone on a 60+ win team will have good advanced stats. Hauser probably had good defensive numbers, but if you put him on Portland, they would be bad. White's shooting numbers jumped when he was on a team full of shooters. Suggs was on a team full of players that couldn't shoot.

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So you are doubling down that Suggs is as good as White now? I think we will have to disagree. You can look up adjusted stats if you want.

I said White was a little better, but if they swapped teams, Suggs would've been better.

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Post #67 » by **bisme37** » Thu May 9, 2024 9:53 pm

I haven't gotten the impression that a lot of people are watching Celtics playoff games so far but he's been dynamite if you missed it.

Read on Twitter

Not to mention that man just got votes for DPOY. He's a two way monster.

Curmudgeon · Post #68 » by **Curmudgeon** » Thu May 9, 2024 9:57 pm

He's a better player than Jaylen Brown, who just got the bag.

Post #69 » by **G R E Y** » Thu May 9, 2024 11:27 pm

Even though Derrick is not the #1 guy a team builds around, he's indispensable to helping said #1 reach the ultimate goal.

Derrick is both elite in his role and his role has grown so he has a case for a unique contribution which is worthy of a commensurate payday.

Godymas · Post #70 » by **Godymas** » Thu May 9, 2024 11:32 pm

no but his next contract is going to be in the $100M+ 4 year type of deal

srhcan · Post #71 » by **srhcan** » Thu May 9, 2024 11:47 pm

basketballRob wrote:Suggs had a near identical season that White had, and we're talking about an extension starting off at $20m for him.

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where Suggs comes from in this discussion? I like him but he currently is in way below tier than White

basketballRob · Post #72 » by **basketballRob** » Thu May 9, 2024 11:53 pm

srhcan wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Suggs had a near identical season that White had, and we're talking about an extension starting off at $20m for him.

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where Suggs comes from in this discussion? I like him but he currently is in way below tier than White

He's not. Suggs is on the same level.

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srhcan · Post #73 » by **srhcan** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:05 am

basketballRob wrote:
srhcan wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Suggs had a near identical season that White had, and we're talking about an extension starting off at $20m for him.

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where Suggs comes from in this discussion? I like him but he currently is in way below tier than White
He's not. Suggs is on the same level.

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thats a homer take. White is arguably 2nd best player on the best team of NBA. Suggs is nowhere near him.

The Hypnotoad · Post #74 » by **The Hypnotoad** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:05 am

Chuck Everett wrote:No, but if his agent is smart, he will let him get to UFA. Signing an extension too early would be silly considering the Celtics' cap situation. He's one of the few plug-n-play players we have in this league.

Every Celtics player drinks the Kool-aid and signs early.

basketballRob · Post #75 » by **basketballRob** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:06 am

srhcan wrote:
basketballRob wrote:
srhcan wrote:where Suggs comes from in this discussion? I like him but he currently is in way below tier than White
He's not. Suggs is on the same level.

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thats a homer take. White is arguably 2nd best player on the best team of NBA. Suggs is nowhere near him.

The stats say otherwise. The per 36 mpg and shooting percentages are the same, so I wouldn't say White is several tiers above him.

https://stathead.com//basketball/versus-finder.cgi?request=1&seasons_type=perchoice&player_id1=suggsja01&p1yrfrom=2024&p1yrto=2024&player_id2=whitede01&p2yrfrom=2024&p2yrto=2024

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DrModesty · Post #76 » by **DrModesty** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:29 am

Even if Suggs just treads water next year, Orlando isn't keeping him at $20m. Suggs is looking at 30m plus.

AleksandarN · Post #77 » by **AleksandarN** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:30 am

I hope he gets close to the max. Like FVV deal. Squeeze that cap of the Celtics lol

donkki · Post #78 » by **donkki** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:41 am

This would mean all important role players would be max players, and that does not sound like a recipe for success. White is a good role player, but still just a role player, nothing more.

DaPessimist · Post #79 » by **DaPessimist** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:43 am

I'd love to have him on my team, but he's a borderline All-Star guard, and should be paid like a borderline All-Star guard. I'm not going to get overly excited about his current statistical run where the Celtics are clearly smashing tomato cans out there.

NYKnickerbocker · Post #80 » by **NYKnickerbocker** » Fri May 10, 2024 12:44 am

Love when a role player finds his perfect role on a great team then gets highly overrated lol. Derrick white is not the second best player on the Celtics. He’s damn good tho. If he got more defensive attention or more shots, he’d go back to the same decent player he was on the spurs