During Tyrese Haliburton's HoF speech, will we look at the Kings trade as one of the biggest blunders of all time?

[hardenASG13]

Wtf is this?

Sabas will finish as TOP5 player in Trp-Dbl in NBA history. With Siakam on the board, Hali a little bit lost in last games:

13G .464/.361/.765 2.6r 9.3a 16.2pts

Sabas in second half of season shows Jokic numbers:

27G .647/.519/.738 14.6r 9.7a 20.4pts

SAC is playing in stronger conf and has better record. Also Sabas is way healthier than Hali. SAC reached PO with Sabas after 16 years and has 46W per 82RS record on avg. What did Hali for Pacers? Where would be Pacers in WC? At the moment they are only better than CHI and ATL...Yea but Hali has great ast numbers...blunders of all time...

Pacers beat the 5th seed in the West last night. A big reason for it was 3 amazing assists by Hali to Siakam in the last 4 min.

Pacers have 34 wins to Sacramento’s 33

Sac also blew a 20 ish point lead last night.

The Pacers are JUST now getting healthy with Siakam integrated. They are going to surge.

Every team in the league has blown a 20 point lead this season, and this was your argument to prove what exactly?

Not to mention that same new Orleans team smacked indy last night when they weren't on the second of a road back to back (with Sacto winning in Minnesota to boot). Haliburton is too inconsistent of a scorer to annoint him to the level some here do. The trade was about even. Both need to win some playoff series to prove otherwise.

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

Pacers beat the 5th seed in the West last night. A big reason for it was 3 amazing assists by Hali to Siakam in the last 4 min.

Pacers have 34 wins to Sacramento’s 33

Sac also blew a 20 ish point lead last night.

The Pacers are JUST now getting healthy with Siakam integrated. They are going to surge.

Every team in the league has blown a 20 point lead this season, and this was your argument to prove what exactly?

Not to mention that same new Orleans team smacked indy last night when they weren't on the second of a road back to back (with Sacto winning in Minnesota to boot). Haliburton is too inconsistent of a scorer to annoint him to the level some here do. The trade was about even. Both need to win some playoff series to prove otherwise.

Too inconsistent of a scorer?

Dude was averaging like 27 PPG on nearly 50/40/90 before he hurt his hamstring.

He came back before it was fully healed to try and play for his contract(can criticize him for that if you want - but who wouldn’t want to fight for that contract?) He’s been more inconsistent since returning from the injury, but that is to he expected with anyone trying to play through an injury.

Dude has been consistently amazing when healthy.

[srhcan]

Imagine this, it's the year 2040. Tyrese Haliburton retired in 2036. He retired leading the Pacers all time in 3 pointers made above Reggie Miller, he demolished the Pacers all time assists record by an unreal margin. He's managed to get Indiana one championship. He has 6 assist titles, finished top 3 in MVP twice including a runner up, has made 6 All NBA 1st teams and 10 total All NBA selections. He is a lock for the greatest Pacer.

As Tyrese gets on the stage for his indictment ceremony The Athletic quietly releases an article "The most underrated trade in NBA history, how the Pacers turned Paul George into their greatest franchise player of all time" In this article it details the story of Haliburton, how the Pacers wound up with Sabonis, how Sabonis completely revitalized his career to become an All NBA 3rd team level player, how the Kings broke their historic streak of missing the playoffs with Sabonis, how the Kings had an era of 1st round exists during the Sabonis years, the inevitable firing of Mike Brown, the forced hiring of Doc Rivers which ultimately led to the best Kings season followed by a heart breaking 3-1 loss in the second round to the dynasty Clippers.

The article talks about how the Kings went all in on a poor 3 point shooting athletic guard after witnessing a history of franchises ruined by the likes of John Wall, Derrick Rose, etc. how they never managed to get it together defensively, how Sabonis turned into a liability for their team in the playoffs with less offensive upside compared to Jokic which in some ways made this era of Kings the equivalent to the Dame and CJ Trailblazers when the Warriors were winning.

And then there comes the praise of Haliburton. How he has surpassed CP3 easily for one of the greatest point guards of all time, how he's up there with Zeke, Oscar Robertson, Jerry West for one of the all time greats behind Curry/Magic. How he completely saved the city of Indianapolis and it's championship drought and became the face of all their sports and a face of North American basketball. How he was a crucial floor general that knocked out a legendary France team in the Olympics en route to a gold model win. A France team headlined by multiple DPOY Rudy Gobert, multiple MVP and NBA champion Joel Embiid, and multiple MVP AND NBA Champion Victor Wembanyama, and Haliburton led a rag tag group of tiny guards out hustle and speed past the size of France coached by the legendary Erik Spoelstra.

All of this was created when the Kings decided to go all in on the guy that was harder to trade at the time, DeAaron Fox. A FO that was so desperate for a crumb of success they were willing to take a shortcut to bootsrap their franchise to at the bare minimum a treadmill state. What came to follow was greater than anyone could have expected, and yet the signs were there during Tyrese's tenure in a Kings uniform for those that were paying attention and boy were the Pacers paying attention.

Wake up. Siakam has played better than Haliburton after the trade.

[stillgotgame]

tyrese haliburton 0 points last night….

might be a jinx thread

He was terrible against the Raptor the other night too. I watched that game, he was a statue on defense.
He's obviously hurt but Pacers' management is letting him squeeze in his 65 games. Weak on their part.

[MrBigShot]

Sabonis is averaging 20ppg, 13 rebounds and 8 assists a game. With a 65 TS%. Hali doesn't become current hali on the kings.

[hardenASG13]

Every team in the league has blown a 20 point lead this season, and this was your argument to prove what exactly?

Not to mention that same new Orleans team smacked indy last night when they weren't on the second of a road back to back (with Sacto winning in Minnesota to boot). Haliburton is too inconsistent of a scorer to annoint him to the level some here do. The trade was about even. Both need to win some playoff series to prove otherwise.

Too inconsistent of a scorer?

Dude was averaging like 27 PPG on nearly 50/40/90 before he hurt his hamstring.

He came back before it was fully healed to try and play for his contract(can criticize him for that if you want - but who wouldn’t want to fight for that contract?) He’s been more inconsistent since returning from the injury, but that is to he expected with anyone trying to play through an injury.

Dude has been consistently amazing when healthy.

He's on a very similar level as sabonis as a scorer. He had one month where he averaged 28. None of the others have been close. Nagging injuries have been an issue for him, he's never played more than 58 games, this will likely be his healthiest season ever. He's averaging a career high 21ppg in his 5th year. That's not a superstar scorer.

What has he done to separate himself from a guy like Sabonis?

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

Not to mention that same new Orleans team smacked indy last night when they weren't on the second of a road back to back (with Sacto winning in Minnesota to boot). Haliburton is too inconsistent of a scorer to annoint him to the level some here do. The trade was about even. Both need to win some playoff series to prove otherwise.

Too inconsistent of a scorer?

Dude was averaging like 27 PPG on nearly 50/40/90 before he hurt his hamstring.

He came back before it was fully healed to try and play for his contract(can criticize him for that if you want - but who wouldn’t want to fight for that contract?) He’s been more inconsistent since returning from the injury, but that is to he expected with anyone trying to play through an injury.

Dude has been consistently amazing when healthy.

He's on a very similar level as sabonis as a scorer. He had one month where he averaged 28. None of the others have been close. Nagging injuries have been an issue for him, he's never played more than 58 games, this will likely be his healthiest season ever. He's averaging a career high 21ppg in his 5th year. That's not a superstar scorer.

What has he done to separate himself from a guy like Sabonis?

So I was a bit off:

Read on Twitter

?s=20

His numbers have gone down because of his injury, trying to play through a hamstring injury is just tough.

A lot of it is the eye test. When I watch Haliburton, I see a guy who is a superstar, who was taking a team void of any serious talent, and leading them to a winning record. Last season, the Pacers were hovering around 5 in the standings before his injury and they decided to tank. That is freaking absurd when he's playing with career role players and rookies. I love Sabonis, was a big fan of his when on the Pacers, but I never viewed him as someone who would carry us to post season success. If Nuntius pops in this thread he can confirm that has always been my opnion. Doesn't mean I'm right, its worth noting that nearly everyone outside of Kings fans and a few select others feel the same way, of course - doesn't mean they are right either.

I can understand concerns over injuries, but he's never had anything severe(with the Pacers). It's always small, freak accident nagging injuries. The fact that his injury wasn't worse is maybe even a good sign considering how bad it looked when it happened. I'm not as worried about those things. He needs to be able to stay healthy, but its not like Jason Verrett where his body is just broken.

[SNPA]

My opinion hasn’t moved much. Sabonis is awesome. You do everything you can to get a guy like him except trade a guy like Hali. It’s worked out for both.

I’m also in the camp that thinks just because Fox/Hali didn’t work under Walton doesn’t mean it couldn’t have worked. That assumption is found a lot and we just don’t know it’s true. A real coach might have been able to have it work.

[mako]

18% of the people who voted don't know anything about basketball

[jkvonny]

18% of the people who voted don't know anything about basketball

True

[Godymas]

genuinely concerned for Sacramento as they will likely miss the playoffs

[boomershadow]

genuinely concerned for Sacramento as they will likely miss the playoffs

They were such a feel good team last year, it sucks. The NBA won't let Lebron miss the playoffs though.

[Dan Z]

genuinely concerned for Sacramento as they will likely miss the playoffs

They have 5 games left and the team behind them (GSW) are 2 games behind them. They'll at least get into the play-in.

I also thought they'd have a better season, but not by a big amount.

[Wargreymon]

Well the guy he was traded for, Sabonis, might be on a HoF trajectory himself. May come close to the the most double doubles and triple doubles by a center when it's all said and done and he's only 27 entering his prime years now.

[Godymas]

Well the guy he was traded for, Sabonis, might be on a HoF trajectory himself. May come close to the the most double doubles and triple doubles by a center when it's all said and done and he's only 27 entering his prime years now.

Andre Drummond was on a similar trajectory when he was age 27, including making an All NBA team.

[MrBigShot]

Well the guy he was traded for, Sabonis, might be on a HoF trajectory himself. May come close to the the most double doubles and triple doubles by a center when it's all said and done and he's only 27 entering his prime years now.

Andre Drummond was on a similar trajectory when he was age 27, including making an All NBA team.

That was because he entered the league at perfect time for people to not realize he was a mediocre empty stats guy.

[PD28]

Well the guy he was traded for, Sabonis, might be on a HoF trajectory himself. May come close to the the most double doubles and triple doubles by a center when it's all said and done and he's only 27 entering his prime years now.

Andre Drummond was on a similar trajectory when he was age 27, including making an All NBA team.

Ya people fall for those projections too much. Look at the projections some had for Haliburton from his hot start, now he's back down to earth.

[Godymas]

Well the guy he was traded for, Sabonis, might be on a HoF trajectory himself. May come close to the the most double doubles and triple doubles by a center when it's all said and done and he's only 27 entering his prime years now.

Andre Drummond was on a similar trajectory when he was age 27, including making an All NBA team.

Ya people fall for those projections too much. Look at the projections some had for Haliburton from his hot start, now he's back down to earth.

? who said Drummond doesn't have a shot anymore

[msmoore66]

So many red flags in the title, why oh why did I click on the thread.

[Godymas]

i just think it's interesting how the Sabonis is at home watching Tyrese Haliburton take the Pacers to heights he was never able to achieve