Magic Johnson:"Vince is not a star. Just a regular plyr

[Harry Heinous]

he's obviously still an all-star caliber player..LOL@ Michael Redd being better than him, what a joke..

I was only talking about this season, and it definitely could be argued. VC is on the decline, while Redd is in his prime.

And there's a good chance the Nets could be a little better this season with Redd instead of VC.

Both are all-star caliber 'stars' but not superstars.

[The_Believer]

Vince is a "super star" due to his fame and popularity, but not a superstar.

[tsherkin]

I think people are maybe getting hung on star vs. superstar.

Vince Carter is deserving of an All-Star berth; that means that he is definitively a star.

A second man on a team is still a star if he's of the caliber to be called so and Vince is there.

21/5/5 is an All-Star, people.

Need I remind you that he has only ONE season in his ENTIRE CAREER in which he scored more efficiently than he is doing now? Vince's posting a season TS% that is tied with one other season for the second best of his career. He's not drawing fouls as aggressively as he did when he was younger but everyone knows he doesn't do that anymore, hasn't for years. He's got injury issues, he loves his jumper, he fades on his jumper too much, he doesn't play good defense.

Whatever.

Vince Carter is still an efficient 20+ ppg scorer and a well-rounded wing player. He's still capable of exploding on any given night and he's still a guy who could be effective as a #2 on a team. If New Jersey wasn't riddled with injuries and one-dimensional roleplayers, then they might go somewhere.

He's a star, just not a superstar, not a franchise player.

But still a star.

[djtruebeliever]

I think people are maybe getting hung on star vs. superstar.


He's a star, just not a superstar, not a franchise player.

But still a star.

I think the quote from Magic was that he wasn't a super-star anymore, just a regular player. even Magic didn't claim that vc isn't a star.

[Hoops Pimp]

When I think of Stars in the NBA or Players I have to see when they come to town, Vince is not one of them. I think of Kobe, LeBron, Wade, KG, Nash, Duncan, Yao, Kidd and even Dwight.

I am not rushing out to buy tickets to see Vince play ball. Sorry it's not happening.

[bballcool34]

When I think of Stars in the NBA or Players I have to see when they come to town, Vince is not one of them. I think of Kobe, LeBron, Wade, KG, Nash, Duncan, Yao, Kidd and even Dwight.

I am not rushing out to buy tickets to see Vince play ball. Sorry it's not happening.

Hoops Pimp doesn't want to see Vince play, so he is not a star.

Nice logic.

[TDevilsG]

As a Nets fan, I don't know if I agree with Magic Johnson (although his credentials as a basketball player are obviously top-notch, and as such his comments are difficult to ignore).

Vince is a career 25 point, 5 rebound, 4 assists per game player, with a career 45% FG and 80% FT shot. Statistics only go so far in displaying the advantages and disadvantages of a player, as we all know, but those numbers are remarkably solid. Throughout my experience within the past several years of watching Carter on the Nets, I've noticed an above-average to good shot that goes in more often than not. However, when he drives towards the basket and creates plays deep inside, he becomes far more effective as well as efficient. He is almost always double-teamed, however, so his ability to drive inside as well as create shots is often limited. But that should be no excuse.

My problem with Vince Carter focuses upon his consistency. I don't question Carter's "heart" as other people do, although this is strictly in my experience of watching him as a Net. He was the only player to start every game for us last year, he's barely been injured in his four year tenure with the Nets, and he's never said a negative thing about anything concerning the organization or the team itself. But he also doesn't speak positive things about the organization and the team too often as well. In fact, he often seems to just "be here," to play basketball and perform his job, and I don't see anything wrong with that. Whereas Jason Kidd and Jefferson are often seen as the spokesmen for the team's current performance, Carter doesn't typically have a great deal to say after games and such. As previously mentioned, I don't have a huge problem with this.

I think Carter would be a better player under a different coach, or under a system that doesn't have him and Jefferson on the floor together all the time. He has enormous potential as a player, but he's on a team that struggles mightily on the defensive end (he's an average defender) and, generally speaking, lacks tenacity on multiple levels. Usually when a team is performing poorly, the people first blamed are the star players and the coach. Throughout Lawrence Frank's tenure, I've seen him draw up truly awful rotations and plays that make me cringe, and in this particular case I think firing Frank would be the most monumental step in the right direction towards making this team better-not trading Carter, who at this current point would be undervalued (although his "sub-par" performance this year is putting up 21 PPG, which is still better than a great deal of players in the league) and would consequently give us a return far less than his intrinsic worth. Carter is a star player and has the potential to be an all-star player, but there's so many different things wrong with the current Nets ballclub that's preventing this. This team has deteriorated from an Eastern Finals contender to an average eastern conference team that'll make the playoffs but not much more. If I were to place blame on the Nets current situation, it would go accordingly to lawrence frank's dismal coaching, followed by Krstic not playing, and finally marcus williams and bostjan nachbar underperforming this year. Vince wouldn't be even close to topping the list.

[Anticon]

HarlemHeat37 wrote
he just isn't one of those dudes that is just born to play basketball..he doesn't breathe basketball..BUT he was born with enough talent for us to say he could have been one of the greatest..

Vince Carter will ALWAYS be remembered..whether it may be about wasted potential(like Hill and Penny) or somebody seeing his top 100 video on youtube, he will never be forgotten..that's real talk..

[/quote]

The problem though, isn't just that Vince wasn't born to play basketball. It's that, for most of his career, except for his first few seasons or the first few months in NJ, he's been lazy, uninterested, dismissive, and not dedicated.

Nobody expects him to be insanely competitive like Jordan or work out from 4AM until noon all summer like Kobe, but they do expect him to have a positive attitude, care about the game, spend the necessary time in the off-season to stay in shape, struggle through adversity, not fake an injury when the defense is too tough, not laugh on the bench during a loss, etc. Breathing basketball is one thing; caring about the game, taking your job seriously, is another.

There are lots of guys in the league who weren't born to play basketball, but many of them still dedicate themselves to the game and work hard to improve their skills. They make themselves accountable and try to develop their game, be a positive force, and try to provide leadership. Vince has never really done that. He's always just bailed when things got too difficult, and never really took responsibility for much.

And yeah, I live in Toronto, so you know my biases.

[David Robinson]

Definitely starting to think Vince Carter is a puss !

- #50 The Admiral David Robinson

[basketball royalty]

First off, I am a Raps fan so I have a reason to hate on VC more than most but I totally disagreed with what Magic had to say.

Magic said that VC was no longer a superstar because of injury- I say VC only had two seasons where he could be considered a "superstar", both of which were on Toronto and nearly a decade ago 99-00, and 00-01. He is still an allstar calibre player though.

Magic said that VC couldn't adjust to not having the explosiveness- I disagree, he has adjusted pretty well, if you ask me, he could shoot it better than ever, and has a nice allround game going for him. He will not reach the levels he had in the beginning of the decade because he lacks the drive he used to have.

I think guys like Barkley and Magic and myself (heh) have always criticized Vince is because he showed what he was capable of on his way to getting recognition, but once he got it he has coasted his way to being an average allstar rather than a superstar like a Kobe.

[Raymond Felton]

take away the dunk contest wins and Vince has been washed up for a while. The consumate good player on average teams. He's never really done anything outstanding that would justify being noted in the class he was in the past. All star appearances? Cut those in half

[HarlemHeat37]

take away the dunk contest wins and Vince has been washed up for a while. The consumate good player on average teams. He's never really done anything outstanding that would justify being noted in the class he was in the past. All star appearances? Cut those in half

what a stupid comment..

did people really forget how good this guy was earlier in his career? everyone feared him..he led a mediocre team into the middle of the playoffs, 1 shot away from the conference finals..he was having a duel with AI during the series, and everyone considered Iverson to be one of the best in the NBA at the time..

he wasn't just a dunker..he was just a great player..did everyone forget that MANY people considered Vince to be better than Kobe at that point in time..

[JellosJigglin]

-= original quote snipped =-



Hoops Pimp doesn't want to see Vince play, so he is not a star.

Nice logic.

He has a point though. Vince Carter isn't going to sell out arenas across the country the way Kobe, Lebron, Duncan, Nash, and other true stars do.

When I watch Vince play, I know he's a good player, but there just isn't anything special about him. Kobe is electric and can make history on any given night. Lebron is a physical specimen. Duncan is arguably the greatest PF of all time. Nash runs an offense like very few can. Hell even Chis Paul is more fun to watch. Even when these players have BAD nights, they're exciting to watch. That's why people pay money to go see them. That's what a true star does. I think more people watch the Nets because of Jason Kidd, not Vince Carter.

[HarlemHeat37]

I wouldn't pay to watch anybody in the NBA, other than my favorite team..so it doesn't apply to me..I don't find Lebron exciting at all..nothing is exciting about the same dunk every game, and refs blowing a whistle..

I'd rather watch VC, only because he might do something exciting, like he has done in the past few years..the only guys I find more exciting than Carter are Kobe and Wade..

[kooldude]

Vinsanity is the best dunker ever; he'll be a star as long as he's playing because people still remember the old Vince of the past when we see a ball in his hands.