2024 NBA Playoffs - West 1st Round: #4 Los Angeles Clippers vs #5 Dallas Mavericks (DAL WINS 4-2)

[Texas Chuck]

It sounds like he's going to do it again in Game 6, if he gets exploited again are you going to still defend it? I just don't get the logic defending something that clearly isn't working. A Division II coach would have made an adjustment in Game 4.

I'm going to worry about game 5 first. I'm open to any and all adjustments. But I didn't overreact when Harden made all his 3's in game 1 either. Harden is too good to think I'm just going to take away one thing.

[ChipotleWest]

It sounds like he's going to do it again in Game 6, if he gets exploited again are you going to still defend it? I just don't get the logic defending something that clearly isn't working. A Division II coach would have made an adjustment in Game 4.

I'm going to worry about game 5 first. I'm open to any and all adjustments. But I didn't overreact when Harden made all his 3's in game 1 either. Harden is too good to think I'm just going to take away one thing.

I meant 5, but why do you think you can't have Maxi in as PF and Lively in as center? You absolutely can and they've done that before. Then you get perimeter protection and rim protection. You don't have to choose one or the other!

You just pretend that Harden would have gotten those floaters on Lively, but he literally didn't do that when LIvely was in there, at all. So your logic makes no sense.

Besides this argument with Maxi being a perimeter defender, ok fine, but he wasn't used as that in the 4th so again your logic doesn't work. He was clearly the rim protector. With Lively in guess what? You can put Maxi on the perimeter.

[Bob8]

so for all the Maxi haters --- Dallas is losing the minutes with any of the 3 centers on the court. They are losing them the least with Maxi. He's been good defensively in this series. Like he always is. He's a very good defensive player. He doesn't block shots out of bounds a lot so its not as visually impressive, but he's good.

The problem is Kidd has to put a 5th guy out there with Luka/Kyrie/PF/DJJ. They've all struggled. But as I look at that roster I think I'd trust Maxi more than anyone else too. I don't blame Kidd for that. When they went to the WCF, he was one of the 5 guys Kidd could trust that year. Kidd is going to remember that.

Stop worrying about his box scores, they will never impressive. Stop overreacting to the floaters in one quarter. Variance is a bitch, sorry.

Dude you're better than that, can't just use plus/minus for everything. Did you watch the 4th quarter? Harden exploited Maxi. It was very clear for the eyes to see.

Plus minus does not paint the entire picture, it only shows what the team did while you were in or not in the game. It doesn't mean that one player was responsible.

Well aware. I'm just providing the data that shows Kleber isn't getting abused more than the other centers. Gafford has been by far the worst of the trio.

And yes asking Maxi to guard Harden is a big ask. But Lively isn't going to do better. But this isn't 3 years ago when Kawhi stuffed Maxi in his locker over and over and over. That was abuse. This? Good on James for making the plays. I'm not benching Maxi for the series over it. They need him.

Problem in game 4 was not Kleber, but letting Harden do the same thing 5 times in a row, defending him in isolation 1 on 1. I doubt that's a good idea against any great player. When Harden hit his second floater some adjustments should be done. I don't remember someone shooting that many relatively easy floaters in last few minutes.

[Texas Chuck]

You just pretend that Harden would have gotten those floaters on Lively, but he literally didn't do that when LIvely was in there, at all. So your logic makes no sense.

Besides this argument with Maxi being a perimeter defender, ok fine, but he wasn't used as that in the 4th so again your logic doesn't work. He was clearly the rim protector. With Lively in guess what? You can put Maxi on the perimeter.

I didn't pretend anything. Harden might shoot step backs on Lively. He might take him all the way to the rim. Dallas might have to help more and he might hit shooters. I don't know and haven't claimed to know. I just think Maxi is a viable option.

But I don't want to play two of my centers when the core 4 has been the key. Washington and Jones at the forwards and the stars at the guards. I want to maximize that and certainly close games that way.

[PeteyPablo]

Clippers Roster :

Guards :

James Harden
Russell Westbrook
Norman Powell
Bones Hyland
Brandon Boston Jr



Forwards :

Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Terrance Mann
Daniel Theiss
Kobe Brown

Centers :

Ivica Zubac
Mason Plumlee
Kai Jones

[ChipotleWest]

You just pretend that Harden would have gotten those floaters on Lively, but he literally didn't do that when LIvely was in there, at all. So your logic makes no sense.

Besides this argument with Maxi being a perimeter defender, ok fine, but he wasn't used as that in the 4th so again your logic doesn't work. He was clearly the rim protector. With Lively in guess what? You can put Maxi on the perimeter.

I didn't pretend anything. Harden might shoot step backs on Lively. He might take him all the way to the rim. Dallas might have to help more and he might hit shooters. I don't know and haven't claimed to know. I just think Maxi is a viable option.

But I don't want to play two of my centers when the core 4 has been the key. Washington and Jones at the forwards and the stars at the guards. I want to maximize that and certainly close games that way.

We went 16-2 with Gafford as the starter, we went 1-6 before that when Kidd started Maxi. That should set off bells. I'm not worried about Maxi's feelings like you are, I sit him. That doesn't mean the entire game, but he's not playing the entire 4th as the only center. There's just no way. But it looks like he's going to do it again in Game 5 and we'll probably be down 2-3 in the series.

[ChipotleWest]

Still no Tim Hardaway Jr. in Game 5 for Dallas.

[ejftw]

With how Harden had it going, I'm not sure Lively or Gafford would've made much of a difference than Kleber. Instead of 5-6 on floaters, he probably goes 3-6 from three with step backs or whatever, equating to a one point difference.

The issue for Dallas in G4 was the early hole they dug themselves into, and the amount of energy exerted to get back into it. Esp considering that Mavs aren't necessarily a young team and are battling through injury concerns of their own.

It'll be interesting to see if Luka plays in G5, and if he does, being as hobbled as he is, if he'll accept a role as a 90% facilitator or will Dallas screw up the offense and be stagnant by trying to get him going the way Clips tried to force Kawhi's reintegration during G2&G3.

[Swish77]

You just pretend that Harden would have gotten those floaters on Lively, but he literally didn't do that when LIvely was in there, at all. So your logic makes no sense.

Besides this argument with Maxi being a perimeter defender, ok fine, but he wasn't used as that in the 4th so again your logic doesn't work. He was clearly the rim protector. With Lively in guess what? You can put Maxi on the perimeter.

I didn't pretend anything. Harden might shoot step backs on Lively. He might take him all the way to the rim. Dallas might have to help more and he might hit shooters. I don't know and haven't claimed to know. I just think Maxi is a viable option.

But I don't want to play two of my centers when the core 4 has been the key. Washington and Jones at the forwards and the stars at the guards. I want to maximize that and certainly close games that way.

We went 16-2 with Gafford as the starter, we went 1-6 before that when Kidd started Maxi. That should set off bells. I'm not worried about Maxi's feelings like you are, I sit him. That doesn't mean the entire game, but he's not playing the entire 4th as the only center. There's just no way. But it looks like he's going to do it again in Game 5 and we'll probably be down 2-3 in the series.

Maxi will play in the 4th and we will win. 16-2 and 1-6 means nothing in the playoffs. Playoffs is something completely different.Itrust Maxi we have to play small to win. When we play small we are really really good Kyrie said it himself. Reason why they came back from being down 31 is bc they out ran the Clippers. We will win the next 2 games. I believe in this team and HC.

[Swish77]

With how Harden had it going, I'm not sure Lively or Gafford would've made much of a difference than Kleber. Instead of 5-6 on floaters, he probably goes 3-6 from three with step backs or whatever, equating to a one point difference.

The issue for Dallas in G4 was the early hole they dug themselves into, and the amount of energy exerted to get back into it. Esp considering that Mavs aren't necessarily a young team and are battling through injury concerns of their own.

It'll be interesting to see if Luka plays in G5, and if he does, being as hobbled as he is, if he'll accept a role as a 90% facilitator or will Dallas screw up the offense and be stagnant by trying to get him going the way Clips tried to force Kawhi's reintegration during G2&G3.

Luka will play zero chance he doesn't.

[ChipotleWest]

With how Harden had it going, I'm not sure Lively or Gafford would've made much of a difference than Kleber. Instead of 5-6 on floaters, he probably goes 3-6 from three with step backs or whatever, equating to a one point difference.

The issue for Dallas in G4 was the early hole they dug themselves into, and the amount of energy exerted to get back into it. Esp considering that Mavs aren't necessarily a young team and are battling through injury concerns of their own.

It'll be interesting to see if Luka plays in G5, and if he does, being as hobbled as he is, if he'll accept a role as a 90% facilitator or will Dallas screw up the offense and be stagnant by trying to get him going the way Clips tried to force Kawhi's reintegration during G2&G3.

Can't just award someone 3 3 pointers, they're a lot harder to make than floaters when literally no one is in front of you. That doesn't mean he wouldn't, but he would have had to earn them. And yes Clippers were about the hottest I've ever seen for a playoff team through 3 quarters, they ended up with 62%. But that doesn't automatically mean they would have kept making them. In the 4th quarter I think they got the 1 from PG and they didn't need to make any others thanks to the defensive liability that Jason Kidd caused.

[ejftw]

With how Harden had it going, I'm not sure Lively or Gafford would've made much of a difference than Kleber. Instead of 5-6 on floaters, he probably goes 3-6 from three with step backs or whatever, equating to a one point difference.

The issue for Dallas in G4 was the early hole they dug themselves into, and the amount of energy exerted to get back into it. Esp considering that Mavs aren't necessarily a young team and are battling through injury concerns of their own.

It'll be interesting to see if Luka plays in G5, and if he does, being as hobbled as he is, if he'll accept a role as a 90% facilitator or will Dallas screw up the offense and be stagnant by trying to get him going the way Clips tried to force Kawhi's reintegration during G2&G3.

Luka will play zero chance he doesn't.

Definitely agree, not really buying the doubtful or questionable listing.

With how Harden had it going, I'm not sure Lively or Gafford would've made much of a difference than Kleber. Instead of 5-6 on floaters, he probably goes 3-6 from three with step backs or whatever, equating to a one point difference.

The issue for Dallas in G4 was the early hole they dug themselves into, and the amount of energy exerted to get back into it. Esp considering that Mavs aren't necessarily a young team and are battling through injury concerns of their own.

It'll be interesting to see if Luka plays in G5, and if he does, being as hobbled as he is, if he'll accept a role as a 90% facilitator or will Dallas screw up the offense and be stagnant by trying to get him going the way Clips tried to force Kawhi's reintegration during G2&G3.

Can't just award someone 3 3 pointers, they're a lot harder to make than floaters when literally no one is in front of you. That doesn't mean he wouldn't, but he would have had to earn them.

I mean, I'd assume of the six looks, four would be nearly wide open and I'd give Harden the benefit of the doubt.

Of course, could be totally wrong and Lovely/Gafford would close out, but then, one could assume Harden would dump those to Zu on an easy roll.

Either way, in spite of Kidd's coaching, or lackthereof, I'm still gonna die on the hill of the energy exertion to get back into it being what did Dallas in.

[ChipotleWest]

I was thinking Game 5 was tonight but it's tomorrow. Damn.

[ChipotleWest]

I mean, I'd assume of the six looks, four would be nearly wide open and I'd give Harden the benefit of the doubt.

Of course, could be totally wrong and Lovely/Gafford would close out, but then, one could assume Harden would dump those to Zu on an easy roll.

I know you just don't want to think that it could have been something Dallas did as to why you're team won I get that, but the scenario you're describing wasn't happening when Lively/Gafford was in the game.

[ejftw]

I mean, I'd assume of the six looks, four would be nearly wide open and I'd give Harden the benefit of the doubt.

Of course, could be totally wrong and Lovely/Gafford would close out, but then, one could assume Harden would dump those to Zu on an easy roll.

I know you just don't want to think that it could have been something Dallas did as to why you're team won I get that, but the scenario you're describing wasn't happening when Lively/Gafford was in the game.

Not my mindset on it at all. I've just seen my teams, in various sports, dig themselves in a hole, fight to get back in just to fall short way too many times. Same with those I've coached.

Obviously it isn't always the case, but just what I took out of Sundays game. And yeah, maybe Harden doesn't get those floaters with those two, but, instead, he gets a pair of step back threes and Zu gets a pair of bunnies as those two close out and James and leave Ivica open in the paint. Just as likely a scenario imo.

Think the key is, for Dallas, to not allow the Clippers to get good looks early. The more mucked up it is to start, the better the Mavs odds as they have the best closer in the series imo

[ChipotleWest]

I mean, I'd assume of the six looks, four would be nearly wide open and I'd give Harden the benefit of the doubt.

Of course, could be totally wrong and Lovely/Gafford would close out, but then, one could assume Harden would dump those to Zu on an easy roll.

I know you just don't want to think that it could have been something Dallas did as to why you're team won I get that, but the scenario you're describing wasn't happening when Lively/Gafford was in the game.

Not my mindset on it at all. I've just seen my teams, in various sports, dig themselves in a hole, fight to get back in just to fall short way too many times. Same with those I've coached.

Obviously it isn't always the case, but just what I took out of Sundays game. And yeah, maybe Harden doesn't get those floaters with those two, but, instead, he gets a pair of step back threes and Zu gets a pair of bunnies as those two close out and James and leave Ivica open in the paint. Just as likely a scenario imo.

Think the key is, for Dallas, to not allow the Clippers to get good looks early. The more mucked up it is to start, the better the Mavs odds as they have the best closer in the series imo

All I know is when we came back from 31 in the 3rd we had Lively or Gafford in the game. In the 4th we got the lead with Maxi in there, but it evaporated quickly and we never got it back. We don't have a good coach like you do that will see something isn't working and make changes quickly. Kidd wants to do the same thing in Game 5 it sounds like. I predict if Maxi plays the entire 4th quarter and we bench both of our bigs again it'll be the same results, unless your team just can't hit 3's all game or we just get a massive lead before that.

[ejftw]

Agreed on the coach part. Rest is just going to be a circular discussion on hypotheticals I understand your pov on, just not 100% agree.

G5 for Dallas will come down too, assuming Luka still struggles on shots, if he's willing to focus on facilitating.

[Bob8]

Agreed on the coach part. Rest is just going to be a circular discussion on hypotheticals I understand your pov on, just not 100% agree.

G5 for Dallas will come down too, assuming Luka still struggles on shots, if he's willing to focus on facilitating.

I don't understand what means focus on facilitating? Do you watch Mavs playing? They play exactly the same every time, the only difference is how much Isos will Kyrie play. Luka can't stop attacking in this system. More shots he makes, more open shots will others get.

[Sofia]

Bit weird that Maxi is blamed for not stopping the Harden floaters. If he steps high he opens up the Harden/Zubac lob every time, which is generally a higher percentage than a 10 foot floater.

The clippers were able to put Maxi in that situation because Luka was a traffic cone in game 4. Clippers hunted Luka for an easy dribble by to create the 2 on 1 pressure on Maxi

[Bob8]

Bit weird that Maxi is blamed for not stopping the Harden floaters. If he steps high he opens up the Harden/Zubac lob every time, which is generally a higher percentage than a 10 foot floater.

The clippers were able to put Maxi in that situation because Luka was a traffic cone in game 4. Clippers hunted Luka for an easy dribble by to create the 2 on 1 pressure on Maxi

You might watch his last 3 floaters.

It was Kidd decision to take the risk, and unfortunately it didn't ended well. I seriously doubt that any other coach would allow that 1 player plays 6th similar possessions in crunch time.