The KD trade is what everyone thought the Gobert trade was

[shangrila]

Full disclosure, I saw this on reddit so not my idea but thought it was an interesting topic.

The general consensus surrounding the Gobert trade was that Minnesota had mortgaged their future to become a middling playoff team (at best). I can't recall exactly what the discourse was for the KD trade so feel free to correct me but IIRC it was generally seen as a slight overpay but ultimately worth it since it made them title contenders.

For reference, here is what each player was traded for:

Gobert - Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt, Leandro Bolmaro, Walker Kessler (#22 pick from that recent draft), '23 1st, '25 1st, '26 1st (swap), '27 1st, '29 1st (top 5 (?) protected)

Durant (and TJ Warren) - Mikal Bridges, Cam Johnson, Jae Crowder (flipped to Milwaukee for 2nds), '23 1st, '25 1st, '27 1st, '28 1st (swap), '29 1st

And interestingly, both teams made significant follow up trades shortly afterwards:

Minnesota - D'Angelo Russell for Mike Conley, Nickeil Alexander-Walker, '24 2nd (Lakers), '25 2nd (Jazz), '26 2nd (Jazz)
Suns - Chris Paul, Landry Shamet, 1st swaps ('24, '26, '28, '30), 2nd round picks ('24, '25, '26, '27, '28, '30) for Bradley Beal


Now I want to be clear, this isn't intended as a shot at Durant. He's an incredible player. Nor is it meant to crown the Wolves as a future dynasty. I just thought it was interesting how drastically wrong opinions were on both these deals in completely opposite ways.

Thoughts?

[iLLmatic860]

I agree Gobert trade looked bad

So did KD trade but i def expected Suns to atleast be a top 3 team in the west

The big popyl name isnt always a good thing. Its why we arent gms

[Capn'O]

I think the follow up trades are key here. Wolves acquired a steady veteran playmaker and the Suns got rid of theirs.

[Zeno]

I think the follow up trades are key here. Wolves acquired a steady veteran playmaker and the Suns got rid of theirs.

Yeah I agree but I feel like the Suns were kind of screwed once they matched that Ayton deal despite everyone on the team apparently desperately wanting him gone. Retaining a salary slot with a bad contract isn’t that useful. The new cba restrictions also screwed them and that was post trade too. As for the Gobert trade it is up to them to shed salary now with the best possible return, but for as you said all the follow up trades were great.

[Up-And-Coming]

The Gobert trade wasn't that bad in hindsight but I also don't think the Durant trade was that bad. Cam Johnson hasn't done anything special in Brooklyn and Mikal Bridges is good but he's not a #1 or #2 guy. He's a #3 or elite role player in the right situation. The Suns will certainly miss those picks but it was a good trade package and a "Hail Mary" for a Top 10 player at the time after they made a Finals birth.

Even the Beal trade wasn't bad in a vacuum but when you look at it given the context of his positional fit and the Suns financial restrictions with the new CBA it was the proverbial "straw that broke the camel's back". I'd say it was those two trades sequentially that set the Suns franchise back. Can't really pin it on the Durant trade by itself imo.

[MrBigShot]

So far there's only been a few players in the entire league who have been more impactful in the playoffs this year. He also gets very, very opportunities offensively but produces at an absurdly efficiently level. The trade definitely worked out for them. The Twolves are a contender (albeit not the favorites or even 2nd favorites imo) and will be for the foreseeable future.

KD is great but it's not 2013-2014 anymore. And more importantly, the suns roster is a complete mess. I'm not sure there is any team in the league that has a more redundant top 3 players.

[Revived]

Nets fans haven’t enjoyed the Cam Johnson experience much this season especially on that new contract they gave him. He may be reaching that Duncan Robinson level tier of players that can just shoot and basically do nothing else.

Mikal is a gem though and would be valued much more on a team where he can be a #3 not be #1 on a bad Nets team.

The Suns picks will likely all be out of lottery picks I think unless Suns choose to blow it out and trade KD/Beal/Booker.

If that was the case, the Suns would be getting back picks for those players anyway (including potential 3 way deals in which they possibly get back their own picks from the Nets) so the lack of picks shouldn’t hurt that much.

[art_tatum]

Suns messed up by trading all their depth for a redundant star who is oft injuried and doesn't move the needle. They should've stuck with booker and Durant+ depth and a real pg

[tmorgan]

Even the Beal trade wasn't bad in a vacuum but when you look at it given the context of his positional fit and the Suns financial restrictions with the new CBA it was the proverbial "straw that broke the camel's back". I'd say it was those two trades sequentially that set the Suns franchise back. Can't really pin it on the Durant trade by itself imo.

The Beal trade was bad in a vacuum, in a microwave, in a hatchback, or in an active volcano. It was dumb as all hell and anyone not named Ishiba either should have or did know instantly that it was incredibly, incredibly stupid.

[JustBuzzin]

The moment they traded for Beal is when I knew they fugged up.


They basically have 3 scorers and neither of them know how to get each other easy baskets.

I get they wanted to get younger, but CP3 was the best fit for Booker/KD. They should have just kept CP3 and trade Ayton for depth.

[THE J0KER]

Gobert is overpaid, and the current Minnesota success story is more connected with Ant's rise, KAT's maturity, Conley's longevity, and undrafted Reid as 6th player.

Durant's trade was fair. KD won two rings as the world's TOP3 player playing with another TOP3 player at the time and two other all-stars. Now 35y old KD is not TOP5 player anymore and his best teammate is not TOP10 player while 3rd best Suns player was a former all-star who is not TOP30 player anymore, so the Suns underperformed this season on the stacked West but less than people complain.

[One_and_Done]

And next year the KD trade might look better too.

[Warriorfan]

Bridges was valued as 3 1sts by one team.
Suns got Beale cheaply IMO because 2nds could be bought.
Ayton Nurkic was addiction by subtraction.

Better depth play in level talent in Beale Booker Nurkic and depth is good retool.

I still think Gobert is overpay on that small ball made makes him less relevant

[Chuck Everett]

The Gobert trade was brilliant for Minnesota. This is a franchise whose best season was in 2004. They have no prolonged regular season success outside of the KG seasons. Gobert raises a team's floor. We're talking about one of the worst 5 franchises in the league.

The KD trade was Phoenix panicking for no damn reason. Sure they lost to Luka the year before, but they blew up a 64 win team from the prior season for a mid 30's superstar who says he's not a leader. Just really dumb.

[JustBuzzin]

They had a decent fit already with CP3 at pg with 2 scorers Booker/KD.

They decided CP3 was old and washed so they tried to add another scorer just because. Fit matters.

[Up-And-Coming]

Even the Beal trade wasn't bad in a vacuum but when you look at it given the context of his positional fit and the Suns financial restrictions with the new CBA it was the proverbial "straw that broke the camel's back". I'd say it was those two trades sequentially that set the Suns franchise back. Can't really pin it on the Durant trade by itself imo.

The Beal trade was bad in a vacuum, in a microwave, in a hatchback, or in an active volcano. It was dumb as all hell and anyone not named Ishiba either should have or did know instantly that it was incredibly, incredibly stupid.

"In a vacuum" in terms of value for value alone. I get the sentiment but I know if the Lakers only traded 37 year old Chris Paul, Landry Shamet and a bunch of 2nd round picks for 29 year old Bradley Beal the General Board, X, etc would be trending with the NBA's rigged posts, reddit threads calling for boycotts and in-depth Youtube videos analyzing how Adam Silver coerced the Washington front office to trade him to their cash cow

[slicedbread2]

Quite frankly if the rumour was true that the Nets were willing to take Ayton+draft capital and Cam Johnson for Durant and chose not to exercise that option, that was a dumb move. Realistically, Durant only wanted Miami and Phoenix and the Suns had the leverage of knowing that Miami's only option was to flip Bam's deal to make the trade viable(wouldn't be allowed because Bam and Simmons are signed to the same deal and the CBA would forbid those 2 being on the same team due to being signed to 5 year maxes by the teams that drafted them).

Where they dropped the ball was trading for Beal. CP3 had to be moved due to getting older and let's face it his health wasn't getting any better while Ayton's repeated meltdowns in the playoffs not to mention being mentally checked out resulted in him needing to be moved as well. Where I'd be livid if I were a Suns fan was that they didn't get more depth to make better use of Durant+Booker as off ball weapons. I would've done a deal with the Wizards centred around nabbing Morris+Jones and Gafford in the following deal:

Washington: CP3, Cam Payne, draft capital(whatever they gave up for Beal minus the swaps preferably)
Phoenix: Tyus Jones, Monte Morris, Daniel Gafford

Suns would've not only had a more stable backup C/spot starter to help Nurkic for 48mins, but on top of this you'd have a steady starting pg in Jones not to mention a backup pg in Morris(he was injured most of the year but alas). Worse case scenario, you still have a decent salary cap not to mention not having to worry about the 2nd apron and having Beal's elephant sized cap hit on your books. They could've flipped Shamet for O'Neale afterwards or whatever they ultimately did.

In the end, Ishbia is an arrogant clown who learned nothing from the follies of previous NBA owners who were penny wise and pound foolish when they were newly minted owners (Prohkorov, Vivek, Tsai, Tillman before he finally got out of the way). The moves ultimately made have set them back by a decade though Sarver's arrogance in letting his Arizona Wildcat fandom get in the way by taking Ayton over Luka will really be a big time blunder.

Sadly for Suns fans, the only logical moves I could see coming is to get what you can for Durant before he breaks down completely and if possible flip Booker to the highest bidder for picks. Maybe getting back those 1sts+additional draft capital from Brooklyn could really help should it go down that route.

[Dominator83]

When are GMs ever gonna learn to stop trading 5 years of picks for guys that are or soon to be over the hill? They don't even get 1 championship out of it to make it worth their while

[Marrrcuss]

Injuries skew things

[CobraCommander]

I think the follow up trades are key here. Wolves acquired a steady veteran playmaker and the Suns got rid of theirs.

Well they got Beal who is definitely a veteran…. lol

Oh vet playmaker - my bad