Unpopular Opinion - Ty Lue has never been THAT good of a coach

[web123888]

Kawhi / Clippers signing has been a mega bust a la Durant / Nets.

Neither franchise got their money’s worth acquiring either superstar. That was the real problem.

[Roger Murdock]

I count 17 of those wins were in games that PG played in....

Ty Lue did a learn thing or two about defense along the way, though, and it's just a shame the Cavs had to be down 2-0 to the Warriors in the Finals before he realized the team was never going to figure out Mike Longabardi's defensive system and needed to go back to his own dumbed down system he ran for David Blatt.

That means he went 25-26 with a team led in minutes, scoring, and assists by Reggie Jackson - who hadn’t had a BPM over 1 in over 6 prior seasons. Remarkable.

The Clips were losing their minutes when Reggie was on the floor that season.

Some of the guys who should get credit include Hartenstein, Kennard, and Mann. Winslow and Covington didn't play much, but they did play well. So, some shooting, some defense ... play hard / play D and you can hang around .500 apparently.

They had the 8th ranked defense, but the 24th ranked offense, so definitely should be looking for answers on the end of the floor Reggie Jackson doesn't participate much on.

Its obvious you have an agenda here.

Covington and Winslow were 13th and 14th in minutes played for the team, with 20% of the minutes Reggie played. Combined they scored under 400 points for the team. They barely had anything to do with the Clippers record.

They won with defense? No kidding. When you have a roster that doesnt have a top 100 player in the NBA playing sizable minutes you aren't going to win by having a dynamic offense. I'm not arguing that Reggie Jackson is a good player - we are aligned there. I'm stating that Reggie Jackson had to carry the offense for a 42 win team (which actually happened) and that's absolutely ridiculous because Reggie Jackson isn't good anymore.

That team had such little talent and was a 500 team. Everyone on the roster stepped up. Thats called good coaching.

[Roger Murdock]

Lue has never been an above average coach IMO but yeah like others have said, I don't knock him for his time with the Clips. Most of their probs have been out of his control.

So do you consider him a bad coach for going to the finals and winning a title in his non clips years?

I'm one who believes he benefitted greatly from the team he was given. I give him credit for building positive relationships with players but IMO he's not a true difference maker like other great coaches.

How many wins do you think great coaches would get with this top 8 rotation?

1. Reggie Jackson
2. Terrance Mann
3. Luke Kennard
4. Ivica Zubac
5. Amir Coffee
6. Marcus Morris
7. Nic Batum
8. Eric Bledsoe

Because that was the top 8 in minutes for a 42 win Clippers team in the west 2 years ago. Absurd


Hes someone whos teams been a contender every year with health, and his teams have done well every year with horrible health.

I think hes the second best coach in the league. He was amazing for the Cavs

[MagicMatic]

Ty Lue was installed by Lebron when David Blatt was thrown under the bus by him after 41 games going 30-11. They then won the championship.

He owes his coaching career to Kyrie Irving and Lebron James. He then spent 1 total year out of coaching between Cleveland and Los Angeles before he was coaching KL and PG13.

Guy had 3 total years of coaching experience prior and is absolutely a fraud that had his post playing career gifted to him on a platter. He isn't a coach. He's a personality manager that players respect for some reason for getting stepped over by AI.

[og15]

I think Lue got a little overrated during that series comeback against the Mavs in 2021. Media/fans go crazy for visible adjustments that shift a series, and forget the original expectations. The Clippers went down 0-2 in part because Lue was getting out-coached. Carlisle had his less talented Mavs team better prepared, and it took Lue 2 games to catch up.

I think Lue is a solid coach, I just didn't go along with the reputation boost he got in 2021 as a "playoff tactictian". I do think he's a solid playoff coach that has done well to navigate talented teams deep into the playoffs. I have not enjoyed his work in the regular season, especially not during his Clipper years.

In terms of understanding coaching from a fan perspective, I think it's easier to learn about them when they're coaching a less talented team and have to come up with things to get a team to overachieve. Lue has only coached the Lebron Cavs and the Kawhi Clippers so we've never seen him in that context. Well I guess we saw him for 6 games after Lebron left. He went 0-6 and got fired but I'm not sure we learned much fron that.

Whenever there are coaching rankings, I don't have Lue in the top tier, but I have him in the next one. He is clearly a capable coach with an impressive resume.

Kawhi played 0 games in 20-21 and Paul George played 31 games, he did pretty well for what the team had.

[QPR]

Assessing coaches is always a weird discussion. Unless you get to that God-tier like Pop and Spo, people literally judge you on a single series or even single game basis.

Lue is obviously a good coach.

[Calinks]

I haven't looked at all of his games or anything but I have no idea why people act like this guy is so amazing just seeing what his teams do time and time again. Nothing stands out to me that seems at all to measure up how guys like the TNT crew reverie him. Its like when everyone was praising the crap out of Luke Walton when he took over the GSW warriors that season Kerr couldn't coach. I was like "...He has the Warriors..." Why did everyone act like he was this amazing generational coach because he coached an extremely good team to a really good record? Where is Luke Walton now?

[CS707]

People forget that he was a pretty highly regarded assistant coach prior to the LeBron experience. He may not be a Spo level coach but he’s good enough to be employed IMO. The Clippers are kind of weird in that they seem to better with scrappy over achiever types than supposed blue chip talent. I thought the same when Doc was there too. I’m just not sure how coachable any of these star players really are.

[cupcakesnake]

I think Lue got a little overrated during that series comeback against the Mavs in 2021. Media/fans go crazy for visible adjustments that shift a series, and forget the original expectations. The Clippers went down 0-2 in part because Lue was getting out-coached. Carlisle had his less talented Mavs team better prepared, and it took Lue 2 games to catch up.

I think Lue is a solid coach, I just didn't go along with the reputation boost he got in 2021 as a "playoff tactictian". I do think he's a solid playoff coach that has done well to navigate talented teams deep into the playoffs. I have not enjoyed his work in the regular season, especially not during his Clipper years.

In terms of understanding coaching from a fan perspective, I think it's easier to learn about them when they're coaching a less talented team and have to come up with things to get a team to overachieve. Lue has only coached the Lebron Cavs and the Kawhi Clippers so we've never seen him in that context. Well I guess we saw him for 6 games after Lebron left. He went 0-6 and got fired but I'm not sure we learned much fron that.

Whenever there are coaching rankings, I don't have Lue in the top tier, but I have him in the next one. He is clearly a capable coach with an impressive resume.

Kawhi played 0 games in 20-21 and Paul George played 31 games, he did pretty well for what the team had.

You're thinking of 21-22.

[JonFromVA]

That means he went 25-26 with a team led in minutes, scoring, and assists by Reggie Jackson - who hadn’t had a BPM over 1 in over 6 prior seasons. Remarkable.

The Clips were losing their minutes when Reggie was on the floor that season.

Some of the guys who should get credit include Hartenstein, Kennard, and Mann. Winslow and Covington didn't play much, but they did play well. So, some shooting, some defense ... play hard / play D and you can hang around .500 apparently.

They had the 8th ranked defense, but the 24th ranked offense, so definitely should be looking for answers on the end of the floor Reggie Jackson doesn't participate much on.

Its obvious you have an agenda here.

Covington and Winslow were 13th and 14th in minutes played for the team, with 20% of the minutes Reggie played. Combined they scored under 400 points for the team. They barely had anything to do with the Clippers record.

They won with defense? No kidding. When you have a roster that doesnt have a top 100 player in the NBA playing sizable minutes you aren't going to win by having a dynamic offense. I'm not arguing that Reggie Jackson is a good player - we are aligned there. I'm stating that Reggie Jackson had to carry the offense for a 42 win team (which actually happened) and that's absolutely ridiculous because Reggie Jackson isn't good anymore.

That team had such little talent and was a 500 team. Everyone on the roster stepped up. Thats called good coaching.

An agenda, really? These are just the facts, including the fact that the Clippers played like a below .500 team when Jackson was on the floor. If you thought it was misleading that I mentioned Winslow and Covington because they didn't play a ton of minutes, you're wrong because I did mention that.

Alas, Ty Lue like most head coaches delegates to his assistants and while he has shown he's a competent defensive assistant, we've seen him hand his defense over to an incompetent defensive assistant before. It looks like like Brendan O'Connor had been successfully running the Clippers defense for years before Lue showed up and likely deserves much of the credit for their continued success.

A name to watch for if the Clippers decide to blow up their coaching staff top to bottom.

No, what's misleading is you NOT mentioning guys who contributed to those wins and just handing all the credit to Jackson.

[og15]

I think Lue got a little overrated during that series comeback against the Mavs in 2021. Media/fans go crazy for visible adjustments that shift a series, and forget the original expectations. The Clippers went down 0-2 in part because Lue was getting out-coached. Carlisle had his less talented Mavs team better prepared, and it took Lue 2 games to catch up.

I think Lue is a solid coach, I just didn't go along with the reputation boost he got in 2021 as a "playoff tactictian". I do think he's a solid playoff coach that has done well to navigate talented teams deep into the playoffs. I have not enjoyed his work in the regular season, especially not during his Clipper years.

In terms of understanding coaching from a fan perspective, I think it's easier to learn about them when they're coaching a less talented team and have to come up with things to get a team to overachieve. Lue has only coached the Lebron Cavs and the Kawhi Clippers so we've never seen him in that context. Well I guess we saw him for 6 games after Lebron left. He went 0-6 and got fired but I'm not sure we learned much fron that.

Whenever there are coaching rankings, I don't have Lue in the top tier, but I have him in the next one. He is clearly a capable coach with an impressive resume.

Kawhi played 0 games in 20-21 and Paul George played 31 games, he did pretty well for what the team had.

You're thinking of 21-22.

Yup, that's the one, they have all blurred together, the theme: injury.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Lue is like his mentor Doc. He’s extremely good as a floor raiser for scrappy, underdog, under talent teams. He’s God awful at getting teams with title expectations over the hump. Before people bring up 2016… one that was 8 years ago. Two, he had prime LeBron. Without LeBron being the guy zero chance that comeback happens.

[LaLover11]

Ham officially fired

[og15]

Lue is like his mentor Doc. He’s extremely good as a floor raiser for scrappy, underdog, under talent teams. He’s God awful at getting teams with title expectations over the hump. Before people bring up 2016… one that was 8 years ago. Two, he had prime LeBron. Without LeBron being the guy zero chance that comeback happens.

The question of course is how many teams with title expectations has he coached in LA? With the Clippers when the actual playoffs have rolled around he's coached zero for a whole playoffs. Doc coached the one healthy Kawhi year, and if not for the COVID break, would that even have been a healthy Kawhi year? Who knows.

Lue has had 52, 0, 52 and 68 games of Kawhi
Lue has had 54, 31, 56 and 74 games of George

He has had Kawhi out 2nd round, no playoffs, Kawhi out for playoffs, and Kawhi two injured games in the playoffs.

He's had George healthy, no playoffs, George out for playoffs, George healthy.

We don't even have the data from the Clippers to truly judge his ability to coach this team with title expectations in the playoffs. We have one series vs Dallas where he started off slow, then made adjustments and three games vs Utah.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Lue is like his mentor Doc. He’s extremely good as a floor raiser for scrappy, underdog, under talent teams. He’s God awful at getting teams with title expectations over the hump. Before people bring up 2016… one that was 8 years ago. Two, he had prime LeBron. Without LeBron being the guy zero chance that comeback happens.

The question of course is how many teams with title expectations has he coached in LA? With the Clippers when the actual playoffs have rolled around he's coached zero for a whole playoffs. Doc coached the one healthy Kawhi year, and if not for the COVID break, would that even have been a healthy Kawhi year? Who knows.

Lue has had 52, 0, 52 and 68 games of Kawhi
Lue has had 54, 31, 56 and 74 games of George

He has had Kawhi out 2nd round, no playoffs, Kawhi out for playoffs, and Kawhi two injured games in the playoffs.

He's had George healthy, no playoffs, George out for playoffs, George healthy.

We don't even have the data from the Clippers to truly judge his ability to coach this team with title expectations in the playoffs. We have one series vs Dallas where he started off slow, then made adjustments and three games vs Utah.

Well let’s nuke the FO and team then and start over. Give him a chance with more reliable players. I’ll make a thread on how easily I could rebuild the Clippers in 5 minutes.

[Roger Murdock]

The Clips were losing their minutes when Reggie was on the floor that season.

Some of the guys who should get credit include Hartenstein, Kennard, and Mann. Winslow and Covington didn't play much, but they did play well. So, some shooting, some defense ... play hard / play D and you can hang around .500 apparently.

They had the 8th ranked defense, but the 24th ranked offense, so definitely should be looking for answers on the end of the floor Reggie Jackson doesn't participate much on.

Its obvious you have an agenda here.

Covington and Winslow were 13th and 14th in minutes played for the team, with 20% of the minutes Reggie played. Combined they scored under 400 points for the team. They barely had anything to do with the Clippers record.

They won with defense? No kidding. When you have a roster that doesnt have a top 100 player in the NBA playing sizable minutes you aren't going to win by having a dynamic offense. I'm not arguing that Reggie Jackson is a good player - we are aligned there. I'm stating that Reggie Jackson had to carry the offense for a 42 win team (which actually happened) and that's absolutely ridiculous because Reggie Jackson isn't good anymore.

That team had such little talent and was a 500 team. Everyone on the roster stepped up. Thats called good coaching.

An agenda, really? These are just the facts, including the fact that the Clippers played like a below .500 team when Jackson was on the floor. If you thought it was misleading that I mentioned Winslow and Covington because they didn't play a ton of minutes, you're wrong because I did mention that.

Alas, Ty Lue like most head coaches delegates to his assistants and while he has shown he's a competent defensive assistant, we've seen him hand his defense over to an incompetent defensive assistant before. It looks like like Brendan O'Connor had been successfully running the Clippers defense for years before Lue showed up and likely deserves much of the credit for their continued success.

A name to watch for if the Clippers decide to blow up their coaching staff top to bottom.

No, what's misleading is you NOT mentioning guys who contributed to those wins and just handing all the credit to Jackson.

I'm not handing any credit to Jackson at all which just shows you arent following. I'm contextualizing that Lue had a garbage roster with no Kawhi, no Powell, and barely any PG. He had to rely on bad players like Jackson to play huge minutes and produce. The team had a winning record playing a scrub like Jackson the most minutes and having him carry the most offensive workload on the team. They were a 42 win team and their top 9 players in minutes played were guys who should be 5th - 7th men on quality teams.

I'm using Jackson and the other 8 guys on that team that actually played significant minutes to show that there was no quality players to be relied on. The team had no business winning 30 games, let alone 42.

[og15]

Lue is like his mentor Doc. He’s extremely good as a floor raiser for scrappy, underdog, under talent teams. He’s God awful at getting teams with title expectations over the hump. Before people bring up 2016… one that was 8 years ago. Two, he had prime LeBron. Without LeBron being the guy zero chance that comeback happens.

The question of course is how many teams with title expectations has he coached in LA? With the Clippers when the actual playoffs have rolled around he's coached zero for a whole playoffs. Doc coached the one healthy Kawhi year, and if not for the COVID break, would that even have been a healthy Kawhi year? Who knows.

Lue has had 52, 0, 52 and 68 games of Kawhi
Lue has had 54, 31, 56 and 74 games of George

He has had Kawhi out 2nd round, no playoffs, Kawhi out for playoffs, and Kawhi two injured games in the playoffs.

He's had George healthy, no playoffs, George out for playoffs, George healthy.

We don't even have the data from the Clippers to truly judge his ability to coach this team with title expectations in the playoffs. We have one series vs Dallas where he started off slow, then made adjustments and three games vs Utah.

Well let’s nuke the FO and team then and start over. Give him a chance with more reliable players. I’ll make a thread on how easily I could rebuild the Clippers in 5 minutes.

I don't doubt that you could.

I do doubt Ballmer wants to go to the new arena he built with a rebuild. If it was a rebuild where the team has a hyped generational guy, okay, but a bottom out bad team without any hope yet and just possible future, that doesn't seem likely at all.

[JonFromVA]

Its obvious you have an agenda here.

Covington and Winslow were 13th and 14th in minutes played for the team, with 20% of the minutes Reggie played. Combined they scored under 400 points for the team. They barely had anything to do with the Clippers record.

They won with defense? No kidding. When you have a roster that doesnt have a top 100 player in the NBA playing sizable minutes you aren't going to win by having a dynamic offense. I'm not arguing that Reggie Jackson is a good player - we are aligned there. I'm stating that Reggie Jackson had to carry the offense for a 42 win team (which actually happened) and that's absolutely ridiculous because Reggie Jackson isn't good anymore.

That team had such little talent and was a 500 team. Everyone on the roster stepped up. Thats called good coaching.

An agenda, really? These are just the facts, including the fact that the Clippers played like a below .500 team when Jackson was on the floor. If you thought it was misleading that I mentioned Winslow and Covington because they didn't play a ton of minutes, you're wrong because I did mention that.

Alas, Ty Lue like most head coaches delegates to his assistants and while he has shown he's a competent defensive assistant, we've seen him hand his defense over to an incompetent defensive assistant before. It looks like like Brendan O'Connor had been successfully running the Clippers defense for years before Lue showed up and likely deserves much of the credit for their continued success.

A name to watch for if the Clippers decide to blow up their coaching staff top to bottom.

No, what's misleading is you NOT mentioning guys who contributed to those wins and just handing all the credit to Jackson.

I'm not handing any credit to Jackson at all which just shows you arent following. I'm contextualizing that Lue had a garbage roster with no Kawhi, no Powell, and barely any PG. He had to rely on bad players like Jackson to play huge minutes and produce. The team had a winning record playing a scrub like Jackson the most minutes and having him carry the most offensive workload on the team. They were a 42 win team and their top 9 players in minutes played were guys who should be 5th - 7th men on quality teams.

I'm using Jackson and the other 8 guys on that team that actually played significant minutes to show that there was no quality players to be relied on. The team had no business winning 30 games, let alone 42.

Alas, defense is half the game and that team was as good on defense as they were bad on offense and that will get you a .500 record.

The key to their modicum of success were the guys putting in work on defense and the guy coaching that defense.

[OkcSinceSGA]

The question of course is how many teams with title expectations has he coached in LA? With the Clippers when the actual playoffs have rolled around he's coached zero for a whole playoffs. Doc coached the one healthy Kawhi year, and if not for the COVID break, would that even have been a healthy Kawhi year? Who knows.

Lue has had 52, 0, 52 and 68 games of Kawhi
Lue has had 54, 31, 56 and 74 games of George

He has had Kawhi out 2nd round, no playoffs, Kawhi out for playoffs, and Kawhi two injured games in the playoffs.

He's had George healthy, no playoffs, George out for playoffs, George healthy.

We don't even have the data from the Clippers to truly judge his ability to coach this team with title expectations in the playoffs. We have one series vs Dallas where he started off slow, then made adjustments and three games vs Utah.

Well let’s nuke the FO and team then and start over. Give him a chance with more reliable players. I’ll make a thread on how easily I could rebuild the Clippers in 5 minutes.

I don't doubt that you could.

I do doubt Ballmer wants to go to the new arena he built with a rebuild. If it was a rebuild where the team has a hyped generational guy, okay, but a bottom out bad team without any hope yet and just possible future, that doesn't seem likely at all.

I agree that the most likely scenario is just run it back 3 more years. But it’s going to lead to constant disappointment and a team that’s miserable to watch and constantly underachieves. How is that good for fans or the new arena? The crowd is mostly lifeless as it is. Lob City playoff crowds were much better, more engaged.

[FarBeyondDriven]

all of these coaches including Lue are absolute frauds. You either have elite players or you don't. There's a reason they all look so ordinary once they no longer have an overwhelming talent advantage.