First Take: Embiid the only MVP to not reach the Conference Finals

[Chokic]

If I'm being honest, I felt like Joker deserved the MVP the year Embiid won it. They obviously both had incredible seasons, but just missing averaging a triple double for a big for the number 1 team in the west, which tends to be more competetive all around compared to the east. Oh and he also shot a ridiculous 63% from the field.

Embiid's stats had been done before many times over. I don't think you will find many (if any) seasons that match Joker's that year. Let's say you have Big O and Brodie averaging a triple double - they are shooting 10-15% less than 63. Only players you might see hitting 63% FG are dominant centers - but they won't be averaging 9.8 dimes.

Basketball is played on both ends. There's a reason why two way players from guards to bigs are rated higher than one way players. Ppl keep mentioning Perkins take on national television as reason for swaying the voters but conveniently forget denver slipping in the homestretch with jokic having poor performances.

[dhsilv2]

Embiid was dominant that year, it was 50/50 while Giannis was distant third. The narrative changed after the playoffs flameout. It was regular season award, while everyone was dumping on Embiid during post season and off season, everyone seemed to forget it, because before injury this season, he was favorite to win it again.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So, would we be pissed again this season if Embiid could have won his second?

doubt many voters has ever thought Embiid is better than Jokic, very few did, MVP does not necessary mean best player.

There's no form of MVP that I can see that would argue in favor of Embiid last year. This year, had Embiid played enough games. OK we could talk. Last year...just no. Denver was the 1 seed and philly the 3 seed. Jokic played more (minor difference but it wasn't a place to adjust in his favor). Jokic had better stats. And more importantly, some of the writers who voted for Embiid basically had said Jokic was running away with it before Perk did his whole race baiting crap along with Embiid's constant crying.

Does Perkins really have so much power? I haven't seen a single episode of Perkins show, whichever show that is, and altho I agree voters influence one another, don't get me started and Zach Lowe starting entire Roy Hibbert hype machine, but man, who gets influenced by Perkins, is he even moderately respected? Any time I hear of him is when people making fun of him.

I was not influenced by Perkins, I think Embiid was fine, I would have voted Jokic first, Embiid second, but it was pretty close. I agree that if Jokic doesnt have previous two, he probably wins, and thats what was wrong, human factor of fatigue played a factor, but it was not high way robbery like some claim, D Rose MVP was worse in my opinion, some other recent ones were also a bit suspect, every MVP is at least somewhat debatable, this is just that, but since people hate Embiid (he is pretty unlikable), they make it sound like it was a disaster vote. This is not even close to latest Messi Balan D'Or, Embiid was deserved, the problem we had other guy just as deserved, and that guy is the popular one. Embiid definitely pushed for that MVP, Jokic was domewhat coasting. We never have this debate if Embiid has a post season as good as his MVP season. Instead he has a flameout, a total whimper, while other guy wins a championship, so 50/50 pick looks terrible now. But all that happened post voting and post what award is about.

I just know what happened. Perk started this, then SAS started screaming. Meanwhile suddenly Simmons and Lowe two more level headed guys started making up these fake narratives about Jokic taking his foot off the gas and "you gotta finish the season strong"....ignoring that Embiid didn't start the season strong. Maybe it was all just harmless and they weren't influenced, but I'd never seen what sounded like a done deal by some of these guys change so fast before. And it wasn't like Embiid was amazing the last few weeks.

Embiid over the last 10 games, missed 2. Average 23.4 on 42.8% field goal shooting, 10.4 TRB, 2.5 assist, 4.1 TOV and the team went 2-0 without him and 4-4 with him.

Now I get it, Jokic stat out 5 of the last 10 going 2-3 without him and 3-2 with him. 21.4 PTS, 60% field goal, 11 TRB 8.8 asist and 4.0 TOV.

So while Jokic still had better stats down the stretch (and I know TS would help embiid maybe, I'm being lazy not dishonest), I get that he missed more games. But again...they had the 1 seed. I've never seen effectively team success held against someone and again Joel's numbers weren't somehow amazing down that stretch.

[dirkdiggler4177]

Remember Dirk?

[AleksandarN]

If I'm being honest, I felt like Joker deserved the MVP the year Embiid won it. They obviously both had incredible seasons, but just missing averaging a triple double for a big for the number 1 team in the west, which tends to be more competetive all around compared to the east. Oh and he also shot a ridiculous 63% from the field.

Embiid's stats had been done before many times over. I don't think you will find many (if any) seasons that match Joker's that year. Let's say you have Big O and Brodie averaging a triple double - they are shooting 10-15% less than 63. Only players you might see hitting 63% FG are dominant centers - but they won't be averaging 9.8 dimes.

Basketball is played on both ends. There's a reason why two way players from guards to bigs are rated higher than one way players. Ppl keep mentioning Perkins take on national television as reason for swaying the voters but conveniently forget denver slipping in the homestretch with jokic having poor performances.

Jokic last 20 games of the season jokic. averaged 30.0 points, 13.5 rebounds and 9.5 assists in 2022-23. Try again.

[AleksandarN]

If I'm being honest, I felt like Joker deserved the MVP the year Embiid won it. They obviously both had incredible seasons, but just missing averaging a triple double for a big for the number 1 team in the west, which tends to be more competetive all around compared to the east. Oh and he also shot a ridiculous 63% from the field.

Embiid's stats had been done before many times over. I don't think you will find many (if any) seasons that match Joker's that year. Let's say you have Big O and Brodie averaging a triple double - they are shooting 10-15% less than 63. Only players you might see hitting 63% FG are dominant centers - but they won't be averaging 9.8 dimes.

Basketball is played on both ends. There's a reason why two way players from guards to bigs are rated higher than one way players. Ppl keep mentioning Perkins take on national television as reason for swaying the voters but conveniently forget denver slipping in the homestretch with jokic having poor performances.

Also change your handle. It is embarrassing at this point

[___Rand___]

Embiid last year

"People have been talking about who has the most pressure to win. People want to mention me," Embiid said. "I'm not at the top of that list. I'm not a two-time MVP, I've never made first team All-NBA, I've never won anything. So why is there pressure on me to do something when there are guys that have won two MVPs, a bunch of MVPs and haven't done anything either?

Embiid winning the MVP over Jokic wasn't historically bad. Many of his backers sincerely believed, and many still do believe, he is a better player than Jokic. That isn't the case for Derrick Rose winning the MVP in 2011 or AI in 2001. But the 2023 MVP race was one of the uglier races for MVP. And Embiid actively played a role in it.

Yeah they made it about "race" not merits. Which was BS honestly.

[yannisk]

Low i.q, loser and a dirty player

and a flopper if i may add

[___Rand___]

he still has time. problem with embid is he is not built for an 82 game season. Philly needs to take the fines and limit him to 40 games next year. He played 39 this year due to injury.

More than missing games, I think that he needs to:

A) Condition himself better and lose some weight
B) Sixers should figure out how to play him fewer minutes within games.

From what I've seen, he tires out by the 4th and overplaying in game makes him susceptible to injury imo.

Embiid would be incredible if he got into better shape honestly, and we'd hate-like him more. And he won't have to resort to dirty plays so much in order to win.

BUT he won't! Because the problem with Embiid is his EMOTIONAL MATURITY.

[Frank Dux]

Pretty damning to his legacy that he hasn’t been able to make a ECF run in an absolutely terrible conference. Meanwhile we’ve seen the Trae led Hawks make an ECF run.

Lebron made it to the finals 8 straight years. What’s Embiid’s excuse?

[Alatan]

Embiid last year

"People have been talking about who has the most pressure to win. People want to mention me," Embiid said. "I'm not at the top of that list. I'm not a two-time MVP, I've never made first team All-NBA, I've never won anything. So why is there pressure on me to do something when there are guys that have won two MVPs, a bunch of MVPs and haven't done anything either?

I dont know what the fuss is about. He clearly states that he wants at least two MVPs before he starts doing something.

[dhsilv2]

Deceiving stat. How many of those players reached the CF before winning the award? I know Westbrook did and ever since he won it, he has never been to the CFs since.

lol why is it deceiving? Embiid hasn't done it before or after winning the MVP.

Without looking, I think nearly every single one had made or did make it in the year they won it. It's an outlier for the MVP to not make it that season.

[Alatan]

he still has time. problem with embid is he is not built for an 82 game season. Philly needs to take the fines and limit him to 40 games next year. He played 39 this year due to injury.

Better break his leg or something to make sure he is healed up for the playoffs...

[AleksandarN]

Embiid last year

"People have been talking about who has the most pressure to win. People want to mention me," Embiid said. "I'm not at the top of that list. I'm not a two-time MVP, I've never made first team All-NBA, I've never won anything. So why is there pressure on me to do something when there are guys that have won two MVPs, a bunch of MVPs and haven't done anything either?

I dont know what the fuss is about. He clearly states that he wants at least two MVPs before he starts doing something.

He took at a shot at Jokic that’s why. Show any quote Jokic took any shots at Embiid

[Alatan]

Embiid last year

I dont know what the fuss is about. He clearly states that he wants at least two MVPs before he starts doing something.

He took at a shot at Jokic that’s why. Show any quote Jokic took any shots at Embiid

I was joking about him fishing for another MVP.

[Johnny Firpo]

Basketball is played on both ends. There's a reason why two way players from guards to bigs are rated higher than one way players.

That's cool and all, however, literally no one in the world rates Embiid higher than Joker, other than Philly fans.

[doogie_hauser]

The thing is, the MVP (rightly or wrongly) has never been about playoff performances. Only regular season.

Having said that, Joker was robbed last season, Hendricks Perkins and his toxic agenda played a big part of it no doubt.

Really I am more annoyed at Perk than Embiid for actively rooting to be MVP last season. Not only did he disrespect Jokic, but also Dirk and a lesser extent Steve Nash (a legit argument can be made Nash didn't deserve one of his MVPs)
Joker deserved to be upon that rare pantheon of all time greats who won 3 MVPs in a row.

[Big Joke Line]

The only one? Even better than generational.

[yellowknifer]

Heard it on First Take. Joel Embiid is the ONLY MVP to have never been to a conference final.

Just a remarkable record.

I'm far from an Embiid fan but he was not the problem in that series. He was the Sixers best player by a large margin against the Knicks.

Maxey IMO.

[Deivork]

Joel's very good and circumstance and all but this too talks about the sad growing gap between that thing called regular season and real basketball.

[CoP]

That is something, wow. I guess the only thing is that 1) his career isn't over yet; and 2) the 2nd round of the playoffs used to be the conference finals, and then after that the 1st round was best of 5 for many years, so you could argue that the path the CF was shorter before for those MVPs