2nd Round: Detroit vs. Orlando - Series DET leads (1-0)

[triplet1984]

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That's an entirely different situation. That's a judgement call. Yes, refs make bad calls every game, everyone knows that. There's a difference between a bad judgement call and a call that is entirely against league rules. When a clock malfunctions, the game is stopped, the issue is fixed, and the play is restarted. I assume you watch a healthy amount of basketball, so you've seen them do that at least as many times as I have, I'm sure.

I actually agree with you they shoulda just redone the play and it was (Please Use More Appropriate Word) - but in a PRACTICAL sense, it's only 3 points. That's literally ONE or TWO bad foul calls - which happens multiple times every quarter in each game. So its (Please Use More Appropriate Word) to base the whole loss on those 3 points while ignoring every other **** which adds up to more than 3 points each way.

[Truth1210]

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I don't think anyone is blaming the Pistons. Everyone knows the home team does not employ the clock keepers -- the league does. And they rotate for every game, so it's not the same person. The Pistons have to abide by the call, just like the Magic do. No issue there.

But no one can argue that it was an unbelievably unprofessional call that never should have been made. To just take a stab at it? To guess blindly? Especially when every six year old who walks into an NBA game knows that a clock malfunction is an automatic game-stopper and as soon as the issue is resolved, they start the play over again.

And yes, I'm sorry, but three points affected this game. You bet it did. If those three points weren't tacked on, it's an entirely different ballgame and every intelligent basketball fan knows it. Three points make and break ballgames every freakin' night.

it is the rules until NBA changes the rules it won't change, just doing the play over isn't a solution either, basically the Pistons have to make another shot plus the Magic would have the advantage of setting their defense, the only fair thing would be to watch the replay with another clock

and again the refs made other bad calls last night in Orlando's favor that could have changed the game, you can't just isolate that one play, Orlando still could have won the game they a whole quarter to win the game, they failed to execute

[Gerhalt11]

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I actually agree with you they shoulda just redone the play and it was (Please Use More Appropriate Word) - but in a PRACTICAL sense, it's only 3 points. That's literally ONE or TWO bad foul calls - which happens multiple times every quarter in each game. So its (Please Use More Appropriate Word) to base the whole loss on those 3 points while ignoring every other **** which adds up to more than 3 points each way.

Oh no, I'm not blaming the entire loss on the call. We played like crap and didn't deserve to win, that's for sure. I just think it's time for a serious look at situations like this when we have the technology to get the calls right, but for some reason the rules don't exist to allow it.

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it is the rules until NBA changes the rules it won't change, just doing the play over isn't a solution either, basically the Pistons have to make another shot plus the Magic would have the advantage of setting their defense, the only fair thing would be to watch the replay with another clock

and again the refs made other bad calls last night in Orlando's favor that could have changed the game, you can't just isolate that one play, Orlando still could have won the game they a whole quarter to win the game, they failed to execute

I'm isolating that one play because it's different from just a regular old bad call that refs make every night. Plenty of calls and non-calls happen that can change the course of a game. Those are judgement calls. Allowing that play at the end of the third was not just a bad judgement call, it was a complete contradiction to the rules and prescedents of the NBA. Like I said before, when the clock malfunctions, the game stops, the problem is fixed, and the play is restarted. I've seen it at least a dozen times, as I'm sure you have, as well.

[Truth1210]

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I'm isolating that one play because it's different from just a regular old bad call that refs make every night. Plenty of calls and non-calls happen that can change the course of a game. Those are judgement calls. Allowing that play at the end of the third was not just a bad judgement call, it was a complete contradiction to the rules and prescedents of the NBA. Like I said before, when the clock malfunctions, the game stops, the problem is fixed, and the play is restarted. I've seen it at least a dozen times, as I'm sure you have, as well.

actually like they said on Mike and Mike in the Morning, who called the league office, the rule is if the refs don't notice the clock malfunction until after the play is over the bucket counts and then they estimate how much time is left on the clock afterwords, they only restart the play if the whistle is blown before the play develops

and as far as determining the outcome of the game, I am willing to bet that has less influence on the end of the game than the Technical foul called on Rasheed Wallace in the first game, when it should have been called on Antonio McDyess, one more tech and Rasheed is suspended for a game, refs make bad calls it is unfortunately part of the game

[Rick Rolled]

In Magic fans eyes......

Well, i'm still seeing that game tying three pointer from Chauncey earlier in the season when he made a 40 foot shot after taking 5 steps without a traveling call...

Do you guys see why some Magic fans in particular would think that Detroit usually gets the benefit of calls from the officials?

Not saying it's true, but it may seem like it at times.

[Cammo101]

The phantom 3 pointer did not cost us the game in and of itself. The crappy call on Dooling down the stretch and the (Please Use More Appropriate Word) nho call on the Hedo put back sure helped as well. Detroit can complain all they want about missed calls on Sheed or Dice, but those plays did not come in the final 2 minutes where refs are supposed to swallow their whistles.

Orlando got hosed multiple times over, and so often that Detroit did not even need to make a shot in the last 5 minutes because they were walked to the free throw line the whole time, but then Hedo is fouled with 30 seconds left and suddenly we aren't calling fouls any more. And then Chauncey dives on a non foul by Dooling and suddenly we are calling fouls again. Convienant.

Everyone knows the Magic got hosed. Magic fans know it, TNT said it, Barkley said it, Kenny smith said it, Legler said it, other team fans said it, and Piston fans don't see it. Amusing.

[Truth1210]

The phantom 3 pointer did not cost us the game in and of itself. The crappy call on Dooling down the stretch and the (Please Use More Appropriate Word) nho call on the Hedo put back sure helped as well. Detroit can complain all they want about missed calls on Sheed or Dice, but those plays did not come in the final 2 minutes where refs are supposed to swallow their whistles.

Orlando got hosed multiple times over, and so often that Detroit did not even need to make a shot in the last 5 minutes because they were walked to the free throw line the whole time, but then Hedo is fouled with 30 seconds left and suddenly we aren't calling fouls any more. And then Chauncey dives on a non foul by Dooling and suddenly we are calling fouls again. Convienant.

Everyone knows the Magic got hosed. Magic fans know it, TNT said it, Barkley said it, Kenny smith said it, Legler said it, other team fans said it, and Piston fans don't see it. Amusing.

how about the fact that Rashard Lewis hacked Rip Hamilton, or that Hedo went over the back to get the rebound or that Dwight Howard pushed off against Maxiell to get a basket........fact is the officiating bad on both sides

the truth is that the league never gives the Pistons anything we don't have what the NBA considers a superstar star so we don't get any special treatment

[Cammo101]

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how about the fact that Rashard Lewis hacked Rip Hamilton, or that Hedo went over the back to get the rebound or that Dwight Howard pushed off against Maxiell to get a basket........fact is the officiating bad on both sides

the truth is that the league never gives the Pistons anything we don't have what the NBA considers a superstar star so we don't get any special treatment

It was clearly bad both ways, but the huge calls went against Orlando. The Dooling foul on Biullups ended the game essentially on a play that is never called. The Billups 3 was huge and the Hedo no call was huge. The Pistons had their share of bad calls, but the real big ones went against Orlando and it decided the game. The refs decided the game, not the players. Which is a shame because it was a good game until then,

[Truth1210]

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It was clearly bad both ways, but the huge calls went against Orlando. The Dooling foul on Biullups ended the game essentially on a play that is never called. The Billups 3 was huge and the Hedo no call was huge. The Pistons had their share of bad calls, but the real big ones went against Orlando and it decided the game. The refs decided the game, not the players. Which is a shame because it was a good game until then,

to say the bad calls against the Magic were somehow more important than the ones against the Pistons is silly bad calls are bad calls difference is that the Pistons overcame their bad calls

[Cammo101]

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to say the bad calls against the Magic were somehow more important than the ones against the Pistons is silly bad calls are bad calls difference is that the Pistons overcame their bad calls

Are you kidding me? Bad calls are not all created equal.

[Gerhalt11]

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actually like they said on Mike and Mike in the Morning, who called the league office, the rule is if the refs don't notice the clock malfunction until after the play is over the bucket counts and then they estimate how much time is left on the clock afterwords, they only restart the play if the whistle is blown before the play develops

and as far as determining the outcome of the game, I am willing to bet that has less influence on the end of the game than the Technical foul called on Rasheed Wallace in the first game, when it should have been called on Antonio McDyess, one more tech and Rasheed is suspended for a game, refs make bad calls it is unfortunately part of the game

Well then maybe the clockkeeper should have been screaming at the refs to stop the game when he realized the clock hadn't started. I mean, his sole job is to monitor the clock. Surely it didn't take HIM 5.23 seconds to realize that it hadn't started.

I think that the refs made the best call they could under the confines of the rules, but if that's the case, then the rules should be changed. Give coaches challenges, allow official reviews of clock-related controversies, do something! The technology is there, the need is there, what the hell is Stern waiting for?

[Cammo101]

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Well then maybe the clockkeeper should have been screaming at the refs to stop the game when he realized the clock hadn't started. I mean, his sole job is to monitor the clock. Surely it didn't take HIM 5.23 seconds to realize that it hadn't started.

I think that the refs made the best call they could under the confines of the rules, but if that's the case, then the rules should be changed. Give coaches challenges, allow official reviews of clock-related controversies, do something! The technology is there, the need is there, what the hell is Stern waiting for?

The refs made a bad call as everyone but them could tell the shot was not off in time, you did not need a stop watch to tell. That said, they were in a tough spot. The fact that the NBA has nothing in place for this and could not even get them a stop watch is IMO an embarrassment to the league.

An NBA playoff game was decided by a ref counting on his fingers because the NBA can't get him a stop watch. Say that out loud and try not to laugh.

[Gerhalt11]

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The refs made a bad call as everyone but them could tell the shot was not off in time, you did not need a stop watch to tell. That said, they were in a tough spot. The fact that the NBA has nothing in place for this and could not even get them a stop watch is IMO an embarrassment to the league.

An NBA playoff game was decided by a ref counting on his fingers because the NBA can't get him a stop watch. Say that out loud and try not to laugh.

Totally agree. As I was watching those refs huddle and come up with a completely arbitrary number, I couldn't help but think that s**t like this is why the NBA is the least popular of the big three pro leagues. When you have a rule system in place that forces refs to do stuff like this, there are some MAJOR changes that need to take place.

I want to make it clear to Pistons fans that I'm not blaming this loss on this one play. We played like crap and deserved in no way to win that game. When Turk launched the "shot" with a full shot clock, I almost lost it. This is just me ranting about general league regulations that need to be changed in order to avoid embarassing incidents like this in the future.

Refs are going to make bad calls on their own. They certainly don't need the league's horrible rule system to help them out.

[triplet1984]

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An NBA playoff game was decided by a ref counting on his fingers because the NBA can't get him a stop watch. Say that out loud and try not to laugh.

No, sorry. That happened at the end of the 3rd quarter, not the 4th. What happened in the 4th quarter decided the game. In other words, Hedo and Rashard Lewis acting like dumbasses.

Gerhaldt has it right, you're just acting like an idiot, by constnatly insisting that a 3rd quarter bad call decided the game. it was the 3rd freakin quarter.

[Cammo101]

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No, sorry. That happened at the end of the 3rd quarter, not the 4th. What happened in the 4th quarter decided the game. In other words, Hedo and Rashard Lewis acting like dumbasses.

Gerhaldt has it right, you're just acting like an idiot, by constnatly insisting that a 3rd quarter bad call decided the game. it was the 3rd freakin quarter.

Orlando had the ball down 2 with 12 seconds left. That would have been up 1 with a good call there. So, yes, it clearly did decide who won the game.

Surely Orlando could and should have played better down the stretch to win the game, but to say that call did not decide the outcome is blinding yourself to the facts of the game. A 3 point swing has Orlando shooting free throws late, not Detroit.

[Cammo101]

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If the refs called the 3 times Rip got hacked driving the line, the Pistons would be up 5 at that point.

Seriously? It was not enough that the walked you to the line so often in the last 5 minutes that you did not even need to make a shot? Let me guess, you were totally fine with the phantom call on Dooling that gave you the game late, because it made up for some random foul in the 2nd quarter that you got screwqed out of?

[triplet1984]

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Orlando had the ball down 2 with 12 seconds left. That would have been up 1 with a good call there. So, yes, it clearly did decide who won the game.

Surely Orlando could and should have played better down the stretch to win the game, but to say that call did not decide the outcome is blinding yourself to the facts of the game. A 3 point swing has Orlando shooting free throws late, not Detroit.

If the refs called the 3 times Rip got hacked driving the line, the Pistons would be up 5 at that point.

[triplet1984]

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Seriously? It was not enough that the walked you to the line so often in the last 5 minutes that you did not even need to make a shot? Let me guess, you were totally fine with the phantom call on Dooling that gave you the game late, because it made up for some random foul in the 2nd quarter that you got screwqed out of?

Hey, you're the one who started extended bad calls from earlier in the game.... ALL THE WAY TO THE END OF THE GAME with your "we woulda been up by xx" comments. I'm just doing the same thing.

I'm just using your impeccable and unbreakable logic.

[TheKingOfVa360]

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I don't think anyone is blaming the Pistons. Everyone knows the home team does not employ the clock keepers -- the league does. And they rotate for every game, so it's not the same person. The Pistons have to abide by the call, just like the Magic do. No issue there.

But no one can argue that it was an unbelievably unprofessional call that never should have been made. To just take a stab at it? To guess blindly? Especially when every six year old who walks into an NBA game knows that a clock malfunction is an automatic game-stopper and as soon as the issue is resolved, they start the play over again.

And yes, I'm sorry, but three points affected this game. You bet it did. If those three points weren't tacked on, it's an entirely different ballgame and every intelligent basketball fan knows it. Three points make and break ballgames every freakin' night.

I agree 100 percent. that play did affect the game not sure how anyone can say otherwise.

[Muzzleshot]

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Seriously? It was not enough that the walked you to the line so often in the last 5 minutes that you did not even need to make a shot? Let me guess, you were totally fine with the phantom call on Dooling that gave you the game late, because it made up for some random foul in the 2nd quarter that you got screwqed out of?

All those foul shots except for 2 shot by Maxiell were taken by Billups and Hamilton. Is it just a coincidence that those foul shots were taken by the two players that the Magic simply can't defend?