You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence.

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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#101 » by coastalmarker99 » Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:25 am

MyUniBroDavis wrote:
coastalmarker99 wrote:The Spurs scored 68 points in total tonight in their win against the Nuggets.

Despite having an average night from jump shots, they made up for it by dominating the paint.

In fact 53% of their points came from the paint tonight and they shot 62% from two.


They attacked Jokic and profited.

Two back to back losses to sub 500 teams with the same strategy.

Just put Jokic in a pick and roll and it's easy money.


I will eat my words if Jokic wins a title.

But I don't think this Denver core can truly cover his weakness on defence.


As having a five who is basically a free lay up line in the playoffs is extremely hard to win with.


Damn they only scored 68 points?


Damn my bad lol I didn't realise that as I meant to say they scored 68 total points in the paint.

Nice catch through.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#102 » by Homer38 » Sat Mar 11, 2023 3:46 pm

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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#103 » by bigboi » Sun Mar 12, 2023 10:00 pm

Jokic is by far the worst superstar big man defender ever. Yes, even worse than Barkley
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#104 » by rim213221 » Mon Mar 13, 2023 12:06 am

You can… you’d just need a better team around him with a legitimate all-star or even better a co-superstar and top 5 player like other players have needed in the past to win titles.

If Doncic and Jokic teamed up for example they would win a lot of titles.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#105 » by IdolW0rm » Mon Mar 13, 2023 1:59 am

Is peak Kirilenko playing next him? If not, then you can't.
But in all seriousness, it comes down to the pieces around him. Of course you can win with a center like Jokic if you provide him with the right supporting cast to mask his debilitating weaknesses on defense. The Nuggets currently have not.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#106 » by Jaivl » Mon Mar 13, 2023 8:28 am

bigboi wrote:Jokic is by far the worst superstar big man defender ever. Yes, even worse than Barkley

Overreaction after the Spurs game huh.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#107 » by G35 » Mon Mar 13, 2023 4:21 pm

I am not impressed with Jokic's all around game. This is another one of those "you can do it, but should you do it" questions. I have the same questions about KG with all of his passing ability. Great you can pass as a big man, rah rah rah. But I would rather you block shots and intimidating people around the basket and being a defensive anchor.....
I'm so tired of the typical......
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#108 » by parsnips33 » Mon Mar 13, 2023 4:49 pm

Don't know anything for sure, but if the line were at 0.5 championships for Jokic by the end of his career I would take the over and not really think twice about it.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#109 » by bigboi » Mon Mar 13, 2023 8:27 pm

Jaivl wrote:
bigboi wrote:Jokic is by far the worst superstar big man defender ever. Yes, even worse than Barkley

Overreaction after the Spurs game huh.


No, you can literally look through my posts. I’ve been saying Jokic is an awful defender. There’s multiple defensive lowlight reels of Jokic
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#110 » by FuShengTHEGreat » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:06 am

coastalmarker99 wrote:After allowing a league-worst 68.5% in 2021 and another league-worst 68.9% in 2022, the 2023 Nuggets are again allowing a league-worst 70.9% in the restricted area.

This would be the worst mark since the NBA’s tracking data started in 1997.

The Nuggets are currently 26th in overall defensive rating.


A big man that can’t really anchor a defence won't you win a title as teams will keep exposing Jokic's poor defence in the playoffs.


it's been 3 straight years where Jokic on the court in the playoffs = a worse defence than the worst regular-season defence in NBA history.

2019: 117.2 on, 105.1 off

2020: 123.5 on, 114.5 off

2021: 137.3 on, 108.6 off

We're talking over 31 playoff games.

That's over a 3rd of a season playing defense that, again, is far worse than any team in NBA history has ever played.


Furthermore.

You know it's really bad when guards are doing this against the nuggets every time they play.











Yeah ummm ok.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#111 » by Colbinii » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:12 am

FuShengTHEGreat wrote:
coastalmarker99 wrote:After allowing a league-worst 68.5% in 2021 and another league-worst 68.9% in 2022, the 2023 Nuggets are again allowing a league-worst 70.9% in the restricted area.

This would be the worst mark since the NBA’s tracking data started in 1997.

The Nuggets are currently 26th in overall defensive rating.


A big man that can’t really anchor a defence won't you win a title as teams will keep exposing Jokic's poor defence in the playoffs.


it's been 3 straight years where Jokic on the court in the playoffs = a worse defence than the worst regular-season defence in NBA history.

2019: 117.2 on, 105.1 off

2020: 123.5 on, 114.5 off

2021: 137.3 on, 108.6 off

We're talking over 31 playoff games.

That's over a 3rd of a season playing defense that, again, is far worse than any team in NBA history has ever played.


Furthermore.

You know it's really bad when guards are doing this against the nuggets every time they play.











Yeah ummm ok.


Jokic never faced a perimeter player as good as Lillard.

Anthony Edwards, at 21 years of age, feasted on the Denver Defense.

In 5 games, he averaged 32/5/5/2/2 [less than 2 turnover/game] on 49/35/85 shooting.

His On-Court rating was just -3.2 in a 5 game, series loss while his On/Off was +30.5. He scored on a blistering 1.39 PPP in the Pick and Roll against Denver.

This isn't to take anything away from Denver, but the best perimeter force they faced in the playoffs was either a 21-year old Anthony Edwards or a Phoenix Team with Devin Booker who had Jock Londale at Center and didn't space out Jokic to the 3P line [Booker primarily attacking in the mid-range, same for KD].
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#112 » by No-more-rings » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:25 am

70sFan wrote:I think you can, you just need a specialized roster around him. His defense give me a pause though, because otherwise his offense is just incredible.

Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordan, Bruce Brown and Porter Jr are a “specialized roster” aye? :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#113 » by Blame Rasho » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:29 am

Blame Rasho wrote:This seems like a thread that will be bumped the min if Jokic wins a title


Well…
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#114 » by NO-KG-AI » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:30 am

No-more-rings wrote:
70sFan wrote:I think you can, you just need a specialized roster around him. His defense give me a pause though, because otherwise his offense is just incredible.

Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordan, Bruce Brown and Porter Jr are a “specialized roster” aye? :lol: :lol: :lol:


There are so many more offensive and downright trash takes in this thread you should be calling out, lol.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#115 » by FuShengTHEGreat » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:32 am

Colbinii wrote:
FuShengTHEGreat wrote:
coastalmarker99 wrote:After allowing a league-worst 68.5% in 2021 and another league-worst 68.9% in 2022, the 2023 Nuggets are again allowing a league-worst 70.9% in the restricted area.

This would be the worst mark since the NBA’s tracking data started in 1997.

The Nuggets are currently 26th in overall defensive rating.


A big man that can’t really anchor a defence won't you win a title as teams will keep exposing Jokic's poor defence in the playoffs.


it's been 3 straight years where Jokic on the court in the playoffs = a worse defence than the worst regular-season defence in NBA history.

2019: 117.2 on, 105.1 off

2020: 123.5 on, 114.5 off

2021: 137.3 on, 108.6 off

We're talking over 31 playoff games.

That's over a 3rd of a season playing defense that, again, is far worse than any team in NBA history has ever played.


Furthermore.

You know it's really bad when guards are doing this against the nuggets every time they play.











Yeah ummm ok.


Jokic never faced a perimeter player
as good as Lillard.

Anthony Edwards, at 21 years of age, feasted on the Denver Defense.

In 5 games, he averaged 32/5/5/2/2 [less than 2 turnover/game] on 49/35/85 shooting.

His On-Court rating was just -3.2 in a 5 game, series loss while his On/Off was +30.5. He scored on a blistering 1.39 PPP in the Pick and Roll against Denver.

This isn't to take anything away from Denver, but the best perimeter force they faced in the playoffs was either a 21-year old Anthony Edwards or a Phoenix Team with Devin Booker who had Jock Londale at Center and didn't space out Jokic to the 3P line [Booker primarily attacking in the mid-range, same for KD].


Yeah too bad Magic Johnson and Michael Jordan were absent from this title run as well.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#116 » by 1993Playoffs » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:34 am

Yeah gotta just straight up admit I was wrong here I said multiple times Jokic didn’t play championship level defense. That’s not true. He played more than well enough to win a title in dominant fashion.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#117 » by No-more-rings » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:35 am

NO-KG-AI wrote:
No-more-rings wrote:
70sFan wrote:I think you can, you just need a specialized roster around him. His defense give me a pause though, because otherwise his offense is just incredible.

Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordan, Bruce Brown and Porter Jr are a “specialized roster” aye? :lol: :lol: :lol:


There are so many more offensive and downright trash takes in this thread you should be calling out, lol.

It’s a large thread, give it time 8-).
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#118 » by TroubleS0me » Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:38 am

wow good bump lol
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#119 » by TheGOATRises007 » Tue Jun 13, 2023 4:01 am

What a really bad take that was quickly proven wrong.
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Re: You can not win a title with a center such as Jokic if he can't play defence. 

Post#120 » by oaktownwarriors87 » Tue Jun 13, 2023 4:08 am

oaktownwarriors87 wrote:Most great offensive players are hidden on defense, even if they're great defenders. You just don't want that guy putting in the effort or getting the fouls.

Center is the hardest guy on the floor to hide and Point Guard is the easiest. You can still win with Jokic, he just needs teammates that can defend in a way that allow him to hide/rest more.



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