The Trae Young Dilemma
Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 1:12 am
The kid is struggling right now. With everything from shooting, passing, ballhandling, decision making.
What comes next?
What comes next?
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Jamaaliver wrote:The kid is struggling right now. With everything from shooting, passing, ballhandling, decision making.
What comes next?
The AthleticWhere’s the Trae Young from 2 years ago?
He hasn’t been seen in the playoffs since
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About Young: He hasn’t been good. This follows the playoff series against the Heat last season, when he also wasn’t good.
It has been a dramatic and ugly drop since the franchise’s centerpiece helped the Hawks engineer playoff upsets of the Knicks and Sixers two years ago and stretch the eventual champion Bucks to six games in the Eastern Conference finals.
Young is not oblivious to this, and he somewhat owns it.
“I can be better,” he said. “I didn’t shoot the ball very well. I had some turnovers when I was driving and (the ball) left my hands. But I’m going to be better at home.”
Young’s 24 points Tuesday came on 9-of-22 shooting, including 2-of-8 on 3-pointers. In the first two games of this series, he’s shooting 35 percent from the field and 23 percent from outside the arc. The Hawks have been outscored by 32 points in his minutes on the floor. Even worse, consider his averages in seven playoff games against Boston and Miami since 2022: 16.7 points, 33 percent shooting (36-of-109), 19.6 percent on 3s (10-of-51) and a pedestrian assist-to-turnover differential of 46-41.
Here’s the problem: He’s being paid to own these moments. Not every postseason run can replicate 2021, with glorious punctuations like a center-court bow in Madison Square Garden. But two years later, he looks distinctly off-Broadway.
“The ball hasn’t gone in for him the way that it can and will,” Hawks coach Quin Snyder said. “He’s no different than anyone else on the team, as far as finding a rhythm. Trae will be the first one on the plane watching the tape and trying to figure out ways he can play better.”
It starts with not repeating three-minute sequences like this late in the first quarter: turnover out of bounds, missed 3-pointer, turnover on a bad pass, 10-footer blocked, turnover lost ball, 11-footer blocked.
Three minutes. Three turnovers. Three misses.
The Hawks went from up seven (22-15) to down three (25-28) in that stretch, a 10-point swing, and never recovered.
The question is whether Young can ascend to somewhere close to the player he was before. Because if he doesn’t, that will give Snyder and the front office one more thing to think about in the offseason.
jayu70 wrote:Jamaaliver wrote:The kid is struggling right now. With everything from shooting, passing, ballhandling, decision making.
What comes next?
Trae is being subbed out in the middle of 1st quarters since Quin. Trae sits at the end of the bench during games, always. Last 6 game sub patterns:
Dallas- 7:06
Wizard - 6:33
Sixers 5:45
Miami - 5:40
Boston - 4:14
Boston - 6:45
Yes, he's struggling. He's been asking to change/modify the way he's played, less 3s (took 150 less this year, the Nate effect i think) , off ball, playing next to DJ, etc. - hopefully it's growing pains. Development doesn't always happen in a straight line up, there are sometimes peaks and valleys.
What's next - continued development under Quin.
76ciology wrote:He is struggling because his drives relies a lot from refs blowing their whistle, so now the defenders can slow him down from physicality which allows the defense to recover and challenge the shot. D-White length and athleticism also plays a big part.
The problem with Trae is he’s not that good of a shooter, if we’re being honest. And if he is, a guy he should watch is JJ Redick with the off ball movement, as a screener then popping and DHO, which would also take advantage of playing with Dejounte.
I also dont know how Trae will look with a big popping to the 3pt arc, the slight switch and with better spacing might allow him to be a better finisher. Another one is maybe as a screener for Dejounte where Dejounte can use his speed in attacking to the rim while the defender has to respect Trae from popping. Sixers use to do it for Ben where JJ would screen for Ben then popping for the 3pt arc while the defender switching allows Dejounte a slight advantage for the drive to the
Here’s the thing, in the playoffs they allow physicality for defense. Why not use it to your advantage and take advantage of how the league allows more physical and more effective screens?
76ciology wrote:The problem with Trae is he’s not that good of a shooter, if we’re being honest.
76ciology wrote:He is struggling because his drives relies a lot from refs blowing their whistle, so now the defenders can slow him down from physicality which allows the defense to recover and challenge the shot. D-White length and athleticism also plays a big part.
The problem with Trae is he’s not that good of a shooter, if we’re being honest. And if he is, a guy he should watch is JJ Redick with the off ball movement, as a screener then popping and DHO, which would also take advantage of playing with Dejounte.
I also dont know how Trae will look with a big popping to the 3pt arc, the slight switch and with better spacing might allow him to be a better finisher. Another one is maybe as a screener for Dejounte where Dejounte can use his speed in attacking to the rim while the defender has to respect Trae from popping. Sixers use to do it for Ben where JJ would screen for Ben then popping for the 3pt arc while the defender switching allows Dejounte a slight advantage for the drive to the rim.
Here’s the thing, in the playoffs they allow physicality for defense. Why not use it to your advantage and take advantage of how the league allows more physical and more effective screens?
Geaux_Hawks wrote:76ciology wrote:He is struggling because his drives relies a lot from refs blowing their whistle, so now the defenders can slow him down from physicality which allows the defense to recover and challenge the shot. D-White length and athleticism also plays a big part.
The problem with Trae is he’s not that good of a shooter, if we’re being honest. And if he is, a guy he should watch is JJ Redick with the off ball movement, as a screener then popping and DHO, which would also take advantage of playing with Dejounte.
I also dont know how Trae will look with a big popping to the 3pt arc, the slight switch and with better spacing might allow him to be a better finisher. Another one is maybe as a screener for Dejounte where Dejounte can use his speed in attacking to the rim while the defender has to respect Trae from popping. Sixers use to do it for Ben where JJ would screen for Ben then popping for the 3pt arc while the defender switching allows Dejounte a slight advantage for the drive to the rim.
Here’s the thing, in the playoffs they allow physicality for defense. Why not use it to your advantage and take advantage of how the league allows more physical and more effective screens?
We've lacked a system of any sort on offense, and that's the main driving force behind it all. The screening and creativity has never been here since Pierce left. Mcmillan just ran a pick-up game style offense and although Trae can thrive at times when he's hot, a system in general would drastically improve his efficiency.
Sure he does struggle with length at times and he tries to make defenders respect his range by shooting logo 3's because of that, but he needs to stop trying to hunt for whistles and just get into the lane. Attacking and getting to his floater range will start to open the floor up the way Quinn wants it, and allow for more ball movement.
His drives don't rely on the refs whistle. He will hunt for it, and that's what he needs to stop doing less of. In the past he got away with it because the refs were giving it to him, but he's always had the ability to get past his man without the refs input. Since Quinn has arrived, i've noticed Trae arguing less with the refs and he's hunting less to boot. Quinn will eventually get that nasty habit out of him.
McMillan was never the right coach for Trae to begin with(or anybody really). The team in general is in the midst of learning an actual system and what's required. This is evident when you see Quinn next to Trae discussing things during his time on the bench, and it's exactly what he needs. We might not do much else in these playoffs, but i'm personally okay with that due to the fact that this off-season will be a reshaping of not only the culture and style of play, but the roster as well.
76ciology wrote:On the ball, I think he should hunt 5s on defense.
If the 5 switches, he can hunt the big out and use his speed to get to the lane. And if the big is capable, Hawks can run screen plays on the weakside that might open up cutters to the paint (with the rim protector on Trae)
And if the 5 plays drop on defense, he should just take those mid range or floaters all day.
For the Celts series, I think Quin has figured out how to beat the Celts or atleast give them a hard time. Its a similar formula Sixers does. Which is hunt Al Horford and Grant Williams they give up 1.00++ ppp on ISO.
Then defensively, the rim protector should not stick too much on Al Horford like they are Steph Curry. Every drives to the rim there should be a rim protector (Capela? Collins? Johnson?) sending help. Hawks can also shade the ball handler and force them to kick it out.
CBS SportsTrae Young believes Quin Snyder will lead Hawks to a championship, but is the feeling mutual?
Atlanta trading Young is not off the table, even as Young has glowed about his new coach
In the aftermath of the Hawks' elimination at the hands of the Celtics, attention has turned to the future in Atlanta. Who does Snyder want to move forward with? The biggest name in question is Trae Young, who, as has been pretty well chronicled, clashed with former coach Nate McMillan.
Most teams are set at point guard, and the ones that aren't would likely have trouble putting together the kind of package that would represent an immediate upgrade for the Hawks, who aren't going to get in the business of a rebuild. Urgency is high with this ownership group. Quin came to win.
Chances are, Young is staying put. And for his part, he couldn't sound more excited to continue working with Snyder, whom Young tabbed as "the future" of Hawks basketball in his postgame press conference Thursday night.
"I believe with [Snyder] here, this city's going to win a championship," Young said.
He brings something special to our team. I really enjoy playing for him."
But is the feeling mutual? Is Young the kind of star to which Snyder feels comfortable pinning his Atlanta fate? Snyder likely wouldn't have taken the job if he wasn't prepared to move forward with Young; again, trading him is probably a long shot. When he gets it going, he can take over any game and/or playoff series. Talent like that is tantalizing, but it can also be deceiving. You see the offensive outbursts and think this guy must be helping us win, but that hasn't consistently proven to be the case. Young remains a crippling defensive liability, and he's never had any interest in off-ball movement, which would open up Atlanta's offense in significant ways.
"Our backcourt is fun to coach," Snyder said of Young and Murray following the Game 6 loss. "They've both been really committed to what we're doing."
Under Synder, the Hawks played faster and the offense figures to prioritize more motion moving into next season. Young is saying the right things now about following Snyder's lead. But he has to put those words into action. He has to be willing to get a little uncomfortable.
Perhaps some more off-ball work will be on Young's summer to-do list. Conditioning, so he can stay in more constant motion. Catching and shooting on the move, rather than just spot-ups as a floor spacer, which is what he mostly defaults to when he isn't initiating at this point in his career.
"There's a lot of things I can get better at," Young said with the giddy smile of a guy who can't wait to get to work. "I don't want to get into too much specifics with what we're going to work on, but I'm just excited for this summer."
...in the end, this comes [down] to Young. Right now, he's the franchise. But winning with a small defensive target/ball-dominant point guard as your best player in the playoffs is extremely challenging. We know Trae thinks he can win with Snyder. But again, is the feeling mutual? We may find out this summer.