Top Gun Celts Shoot Down Mavericks! Victory Cigar vs DAL 3/1

[Fierce1]

Difference is Tatum is Bravo 1 on Seal Team 6 while Luka wants to be Rambo.

[Mr_Mojo_Risin]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Luka is offensively amazing but if you play only half the game (offense and not defense), then maybe halve the box score.

There’s also a reason they haven’t built around him, most players with any talent themselves don’t want to stand around on offense waiting for Luka then cover for him on defense.

Imagine having the talent of Brunson or KP and when Mavericks win it’s all thanks to Luka and when they lose it’s everyone else’s fault.

[Fierce1]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Luka is offensively amazing but if you play only half the game (offense and not defense), then maybe halve the box score.

There’s also a reason they haven’t built around him, most players with any talent themselves don’t want to stand around on offense waiting for Luka then cover for him on defense.

Imagine having the talent of Brunson or KP and when Mavericks win it’s all thanks to Luka and when they lose it’s everyone else’s fault.

That's accurate intelligence.

[JimmyFromNz]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Luka is offensively amazing but if you play only half the game (offense and not defense), then maybe halve the box score.

There’s also a reason they haven’t built around him, most players with any talent themselves don’t want to stand around on offense waiting for Luka then cover for him on defense.

Imagine having the talent of Brunson or KP and when Mavericks win it’s all thanks to Luka and when they lose it’s everyone else’s fault.

Sorry that's just not right.

He has the highest usage in the league or near and is about to break the nba record for most points produced for a team ever. Anyone that's played organized basketball to any respectable level knows how much of a toll that sort of offensive reliance takes on you.

It's not a choice, it's a necessity with that Dallas team, heliocentrism on offense is the only option they have whilst being completely inept defensively across the board besides their rookie starting centre - that should speak volumes to anyone looking at this objectively.

They have built around him, what else are we watching ? The fundamental issue is that they've built around him incredibly poorly and given up pretty much all future assets to bring guys like Kyrie and PJ washington in. That's not his fault, and it's not his fault the mavericks didn't pay Brunson the 65 million he asked for.

When they win yes it generally is all because of him, and when they lose its only by 10 rather than 30 yes its generally all because of him. He is 2nd in the league in EPM 5th in eRAPTOR that should obviously be the clear objective indicator of his impact, anything else is just baseless narrative, the same narrative we heard about Jokic until the supposed defensive criticism gave way to common sense.

I find this an incredibly odd conversation to arise out of a Celtics forum, when we are sitting in a position of an embarrassment of riches and talent (on both ends of the floor) and ironically should know better having (presumably) watched paul pierce struggle through the mid 2000s due to similar franchise ineptitude.

This league is more talented than ever, it's a good thing to be able to appreciate players on other teams. It should be the best of both worlds for us right now. But it does speak to Boston parochialism which is alive and well. I literally sat courtside at an OKC game last season to have a season ticket holder tell me that SGA is nothing more than an overrated borderline all star. Its nothing new, but it is a shame.

[Fierce1]

Top Gun?

Take the case of Pete "Maverick" Mitchell.

Luka is somewhat similar to Maverick.

One of the best, but still stuck on being a Captain and a test pilot.

His former rival Tom "Iceman" Kazansky became Admiral and the commander of the U.S. Pacific Fleet.

Tatum will become Admiral enroute to winning multiple championships while Luka will keep getting triple-doubles and get stuck as a Captain.

[Fierce1]

The Mavs had an embarrassment of riches and talent.

But apparently KP and Jalen Brunson didn't really feel like playing with Luka.

Not gonna be surprised if Brad trades JT for Luka and it results in KP and JB leaving the Celtics.

[He_Got_Game]

Jayson Tatum is a two-way superstar. Luka Doncic is a one-way superstar. If you want to actually win games you know which one to pick.

[Tyakack]

I'll never understand the need for some fans to trash the superstars on other teams at every opportunity. You'd think Luka called Boston a trash city or pissed in Tatum's fruit loops or something. If anything, Mavs fans should be the ones being salty and trashing Tatum because they are so upset over the fact we are so much better than them.

We are winning way too much for me to be so petty over a great player on another team that is no threat to us anyway. That's just me though. Y'all carry on.

[Fierce1]

If you want the most 30 or 40-point games then pick Luka.

Until Luka learns how to sacrifice, he will always end up watching the NBA finals at home or wherever he's at in June.

[Fierce1]

I'll never understand the need for some fans to trash the superstars on other teams at every opportunity. You'd think Luka called Boston a trash city or pissed in Tatum's fruit loops or something. If anything, Mavs fans should be the ones being salty and trashing Tatum because they are so upset over the fact we are so much better than them.

We are winning way too much for me to be so petty over a great player on another team that is no threat to us anyway. That's just me though. Y'all carry on.

It's not trashing the superstar of another team, it's the ignoring of the fact that in basketball you have to play offense and defense.

I've been accused of lacking intelligence because I insist that great players that win championships have to be great on offense and defense.

[Mr_Mojo_Risin]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Luka is offensively amazing but if you play only half the game (offense and not defense), then maybe halve the box score.

There’s also a reason they haven’t built around him, most players with any talent themselves don’t want to stand around on offense waiting for Luka then cover for him on defense.

Imagine having the talent of Brunson or KP and when Mavericks win it’s all thanks to Luka and when they lose it’s everyone else’s fault.

Sorry that's just not right.

He has the highest usage in the league or near and is about to break the nba record for most points produced for a team ever. Anyone that's played organized basketball to any respectable level knows how much of a toll that sort of offensive reliance takes on you.

It's not a choice, it's a necessity with that Dallas team, heliocentrism on offense is the only option they have whilst being completely inept defensively across the board besides their rookie starting centre - that should speak volumes to anyone looking at this objectively.

They have built around him, what else are we watching ? The fundamental issue is that they've built around him incredibly poorly and given up pretty much all future assets to bring guys like Kyrie and PJ washington in. That's not his fault, and it's not his fault the mavericks didn't pay Brunson the 65 million he asked for.

When they win yes it generally is all because of him, and when they lose its only by 10 rather than 30 yes its generally all because of him. He is 2nd in the league in EPM 5th in eRAPTOR that should obviously be the clear objective indicator of his impact, anything else is just baseless narrative, the same narrative we heard about Jokic until the supposed defensive criticism gave way to common sense.

I find this an incredibly odd conversation to arise out of a Celtics forum, when we are sitting in a position of an embarrassment of riches and talent (on both ends of the floor) and ironically should know better having (presumably) watched paul pierce struggle through the mid 2000s due to similar franchise ineptitude.

This league is more talented than ever, it's a good thing to be able to appreciate players on other teams. It should be the best of both worlds for us right now. But it does speak to Boston parochialism which is alive and well. I literally sat courtside at an OKC game last season to have a season ticket holder tell me that SGA is nothing more than an overrated borderline all star. Its nothing new, but it is a shame.

It’s not right in your opinion.

It’s a chicken and egg scenario, you need others around you to help but others of any quality won’t want to stay if you don’t share both the ball and the blame.

You’re welcome to disagree, but you’re wrong if you think I don’t appreciate Luka, he’s incredible to watch. I’m also happy Boston targets players who play both sides of the ball and are great team mates. Currently these are areas Luka has not demonstrated he is good at and therefore I’m fine appreciating watching him playing for a team other than Boston.

[Stan34]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Oh man jaylen is the best midrange shooter in the entire nba this season. He was shooting 54% before this game.

Inviato dal mio BAH2-W19 utilizzando Tapatalk

[JimmyFromNz]

Luka is offensively amazing but if you play only half the game (offense and not defense), then maybe halve the box score.

There’s also a reason they haven’t built around him, most players with any talent themselves don’t want to stand around on offense waiting for Luka then cover for him on defense.

Imagine having the talent of Brunson or KP and when Mavericks win it’s all thanks to Luka and when they lose it’s everyone else’s fault.

Sorry that's just not right.

He has the highest usage in the league or near and is about to break the nba record for most points produced for a team ever. Anyone that's played organized basketball to any respectable level knows how much of a toll that sort of offensive reliance takes on you.

It's not a choice, it's a necessity with that Dallas team, heliocentrism on offense is the only option they have whilst being completely inept defensively across the board besides their rookie starting centre - that should speak volumes to anyone looking at this objectively.

They have built around him, what else are we watching ? The fundamental issue is that they've built around him incredibly poorly and given up pretty much all future assets to bring guys like Kyrie and PJ washington in. That's not his fault, and it's not his fault the mavericks didn't pay Brunson the 65 million he asked for.

When they win yes it generally is all because of him, and when they lose its only by 10 rather than 30 yes its generally all because of him. He is 2nd in the league in EPM 5th in eRAPTOR that should obviously be the clear objective indicator of his impact, anything else is just baseless narrative, the same narrative we heard about Jokic until the supposed defensive criticism gave way to common sense.

I find this an incredibly odd conversation to arise out of a Celtics forum, when we are sitting in a position of an embarrassment of riches and talent (on both ends of the floor) and ironically should know better having (presumably) watched paul pierce struggle through the mid 2000s due to similar franchise ineptitude.

This league is more talented than ever, it's a good thing to be able to appreciate players on other teams. It should be the best of both worlds for us right now. But it does speak to Boston parochialism which is alive and well. I literally sat courtside at an OKC game last season to have a season ticket holder tell me that SGA is nothing more than an overrated borderline all star. Its nothing new, but it is a shame.

It’s not right in your opinion.

It’s a chicken and egg scenario, you need others around you to help but others of any quality won’t want to stay if you don’t share both the ball and the blame.

You’re welcome to disagree, but you’re wrong if you think I don’t appreciate Luka, he’s incredible to watch. I’m also happy Boston targets players who play both sides of the ball and are great team mates. Currently these are areas Luka has not demonstrated he is good at and therefore I’m fine appreciating watching him playing for a team other than Boston.

Well sorry to be clear it isn't really just my opinion, you're incorrect insinuating that players choose not to play with him when there's clear evidence to the contrary e.g. the Brunson situation (wanting to stay for less) and fundamental issues with asset management within the franchise. Pushing the idea he's not a good team mate is not founded on anything.

You only have to look at Jokics borderline tampering or Durants recent comments about Doncic as the most recent example. Its just narrative and unless anyone can speak in actual detail to it, I'll remain completely cynical of it.

I also love the fact we've been fortunate enough to attract 2 way talent, the difference is acknowledging how mutually beneficial that is for everyone on our team, and not projecting that on to players not fortunate enough to be in a similar position. Once he's surrounded with actual talent the story changes immediately, we see it over and over.

[doogie_hauser]

Luka is out of Dallas once his current contract expires (unless something dramatic happens) but I cannot fathom he getting meaningful team success soon, unless be adapts and becomes a more assist giving teammate and more importantly, stronger defensively

Tatum really has improved his defensive prowess I. The last 18 months/2 years, has a strong work ethic and willingness to better himself that Luka lacks (so far)

It's insult for Mavs fans (or even their melonheld of a coach) to suggest Luka is better than Dirk at this point.

Dirk won a chip with a much less talented supporting cast than what Luka has now.

[JimmyFromNz]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Oh man jaylen is the best midrange shooter in the entire nba this season. He was shooting 54% before this game.

Inviato dal mio BAH2-W19 utilizzando Tapatalk

I guess you're referring to only within 16 ft? Which is he's excellent at - but not leading the league in.Regardless I'm not suggesting otherwise, yes he can be an excellent pull up mid range shooter in 1 - 1 coverage.

I am suggesting his shot selection can be dire at points in the game and act as momentum killers. I don't think that's highly contentious, and thought was on display today.

[GrandTheftRondo]

Luka is out of Dallas once his current contract expires (unless something dramatic happens) but I cannot fathom he getting meaningful team success soon, unless be adapts and becomes a more assist giving teammate and more importantly, stronger defensively

Tatum really has improved his defensive prowess I. The last 18 months/2 years, has a strong work ethic and willingness to better himself that Luka lacks (so far)

It's insult for Mavs fans (or even their melonheld of a coach) to suggest Luka is better than Dirk at this point.

Dirk won a chip with a much less talented supporting cast than what Luka has now.

The 2011 Mavs had an elite rim protector in Chandler and a great bunch of role players that fitted together around Dirk.

Sorry, but I’m not sure what is meant to be impressive about this collection of talent?

Good to see Kyrie Irving continues to be one of the most overrated players of all time.

[Stan34]

VC for Tatums second half performance.

Brown had some good moments and stepped up on Luka (despite getting cooked) at the right time. What i struggle with is the 55% shooting which is great, but the 45% shots missed each one of them are soul snatching, rushed iso turnaround nonsense or pull ups out of the flow of the offense despite the stats its hard to unsee those.

The Luka criticism is laughable, as if we didn't watch a one man band tonight cook every single one of our premier defenders, 'empty stat' crash the offensive boards on our bigs, run some beautiful fast breaks to get guys like his rookie centre easy lobs and defer to kyrie even when it meant watching him spin into traffic for contested shots whilst Pritchard was marking him on the perimeter. Yeah defensively that might take a toll on you, maybe.

The difference couldnt be more stark than watching JT sleep walk through the 1st half with the rest of our guys picking up the slack to lead, and then see him have the benefit of playing himself into a rhythm in the 2nd with 1 v 1 coverage against kyrie or open 3 point heaves where Dallas had no option to help due to our other threats. It's a completely different playing field.

Regardless, great win havent felt as good about the team in a long time,biggest challenge going forward is maintaining this through the dog days of the season, coming up soon.

Oh man jaylen is the best midrange shooter in the entire nba this season. He was shooting 54% before this game.

Inviato dal mio BAH2-W19 utilizzando Tapatalk

I guess you're referring to only within 16 ft? Which is he's excellent at - but not leading the league in.Regardless I'm not suggesting otherwise, yes he can be an excellent pull up mid range shooter in 1 - 1 coverage.

I am suggesting his shot selection can be dire at points in the game and act as momentum killers. I don't think that's highly contentious, and thought was on display today.

Yes he is. They told on TV and on some podcast few days ago. Listen to HOOPS TONIGHT, the Volume. Killer momentum cause he missed a pair of jump shots up 15?
Jaylen things are always good to point finger on

Inviato dal mio BAH2-W19 utilizzando Tapatalk

[doogie_hauser]

Luka is out of Dallas once his current contract expires (unless something dramatic happens) but I cannot fathom he getting meaningful team success soon, unless be adapts and becomes a more assist giving teammate and more importantly, stronger defensively

Tatum really has improved his defensive prowess I. The last 18 months/2 years, has a strong work ethic and willingness to better himself that Luka lacks (so far)

It's insult for Mavs fans (or even their melonheld of a coach) to suggest Luka is better than Dirk at this point.

Dirk won a chip with a much less talented supporting cast than what Luka has now.

The 2011 Mavs had an elite rim protector in Chandler and a great bunch of role players that fitted together around Dirk.

Sorry, but I’m not sure what is meant to be impressive about this collection of talent?

Good to see Kyrie Irving continues to be one of the most overrated players of all time.

Lively is a serious talent, but I think maybe you are right..

Dirk seems more selfless/less egocentric/more of a team player then Luka though.

[GrandTheftRondo]

Luka is out of Dallas once his current contract expires (unless something dramatic happens) but I cannot fathom he getting meaningful team success soon, unless be adapts and becomes a more assist giving teammate and more importantly, stronger defensively

Tatum really has improved his defensive prowess I. The last 18 months/2 years, has a strong work ethic and willingness to better himself that Luka lacks (so far)

It's insult for Mavs fans (or even their melonheld of a coach) to suggest Luka is better than Dirk at this point.

Dirk won a chip with a much less talented supporting cast than what Luka has now.

The 2011 Mavs had an elite rim protector in Chandler and a great bunch of role players that fitted together around Dirk.

Sorry, but I’m not sure what is meant to be impressive about this collection of talent?

Good to see Kyrie Irving continues to be one of the most overrated players of all time.

Lively is a serious talent, but I think maybe you are right..

Dirk seems more selfless/less egocentric/more of a team player then Luka though.

Lively is a talent yeah but probably 2-3 years away minimum from being able to really impact games.

He’s the sort of player they need though.

[Froob]

Dallas badly needs a big body in the paint. It was way too easy to score on them in the post.