JimmyFromNz wrote:Mr_Mojo_Risin wrote:JimmyFromNz wrote:
Sorry that's just not right.
He has the highest usage in the league or near and is about to break the nba record for most points produced for a team ever. Anyone that's played organized basketball to any respectable level knows how much of a toll that sort of offensive reliance takes on you.
It's not a choice, it's a necessity with that Dallas team, heliocentrism on offense is the only option they have whilst being completely inept defensively across the board besides their rookie starting centre - that should speak volumes to anyone looking at this objectively.
They have built around him, what else are we watching ? The fundamental issue is that they've built around him incredibly poorly and given up pretty much all future assets to bring guys like Kyrie and PJ washington in. That's not his fault, and it's not his fault the mavericks didn't pay Brunson the 65 million he asked for.
When they win yes it generally is all because of him, and when they lose its only by 10 rather than 30 yes its generally all because of him. He is 2nd in the league in EPM 5th in eRAPTOR that should obviously be the clear objective indicator of his impact, anything else is just baseless narrative, the same narrative we heard about Jokic until the supposed defensive criticism gave way to common sense.
I find this an incredibly odd conversation to arise out of a Celtics forum, when we are sitting in a position of an embarrassment of riches and talent (on both ends of the floor) and ironically should know better having (presumably) watched paul pierce struggle through the mid 2000s due to similar franchise ineptitude.
This league is more talented than ever, it's a good thing to be able to appreciate players on other teams. It should be the best of both worlds for us right now. But it does speak to Boston parochialism which is alive and well. I literally sat courtside at an OKC game last season to have a season ticket holder tell me that SGA is nothing more than an overrated borderline all star. Its nothing new, but it is a shame.
It’s not right in your opinion.
It’s a chicken and egg scenario, you need others around you to help but others of any quality won’t want to stay if you don’t share both the ball and the blame.
You’re welcome to disagree, but you’re wrong if you think I don’t appreciate Luka, he’s incredible to watch. I’m also happy Boston targets players who play both sides of the ball and are great team mates. Currently these are areas Luka has not demonstrated he is good at and therefore I’m fine appreciating watching him playing for a team other than Boston.
Well sorry to be clear it isn't really just my opinion, you're incorrect insinuating that players choose not to play with him when there's clear evidence to the contrary e.g. the Brunson situation (wanting to stay for less) and fundamental issues with asset management within the franchise. Pushing the idea he's not a good team mate is not founded on anything.
You only have to look at Jokics borderline tampering or Durants recent comments about Doncic as the most recent example. Its just narrative and unless anyone can speak in actual detail to it, I'll remain completely cynical of it.
I also love the fact we've been fortunate enough to attract 2 way talent, the difference is acknowledging how mutually beneficial that is for everyone on our team, and not projecting that on to players not fortunate enough to be in a similar position. Once he's surrounded with actual talent the story changes immediately, we see it over and over.
Because a player who was drafted by Dallas was trying to negotiate a contract to stay is not exactly evidence of players wanting to come and play with him.
Nor is Jokic being polite answering a question saying Luka is welcome to come and join him in Denver. That is Luka joining Jokic on his terms, not the other way around.
Luka is not a locker room cancer, but I’ve heard podcasts and players joke and insinuate about it not being easy. Regardless, that aside, I don’t rate players highly if they only play one side, even if they are amazing to watch offensively.
