RealGM

Tyakack wrote:

KamikazeK wrote:Could start, but not on a team with champion aspirations imo.

Or a quality backup on a championship squad.

But that's his current floor because that's the level he's at now, yes? At least he's a quality backup on a team with serious championship aspirations.

I always liked the pick and he has been a solid role player. He could be a starter on a mediocre team and is a great 7/8 guy for us. He puts in the effort but he is undersized and that is an issue on D. I love him on this contract though considering Grayson Allen just got 4/70. At age 26 he has some room to improve. It would be interesting to see his numbers if he was a starting PG….but I think if he is your starter then you aren’t a contender.

Curmudgeon wrote:

Tyakack wrote:

KamikazeK wrote:Could start, but not on a team with champion aspirations imo.

Or a quality backup on a championship squad.

But that's his current floor because that's the level he's at now, yes? At least he's a quality backup on a team with serious championship aspirations.

The ceiling is the floor? Or maybe it’s a 1950s ranch style with 7 foot ceilings.

Curmudgeon wrote:

Tyakack wrote:

KamikazeK wrote:Could start, but not on a team with champion aspirations imo.

Or a quality backup on a championship squad.

But that's his current floor because that's the level he's at now, yes? At least he's a quality backup on a team with serious championship aspirations.

Yeah, I don't think his ceiling is much higher than what we are seeing right now. I think he could put up better numbers with more playing time on a much worse team.

I think for what he brings to our team specifically he is great. I wouldn't like him nearly as much if he was asked to play a much bigger role *starter mins* in the playoffs, I strongly suspect.

He looks about 6' Tall to me.

There were many times in past years when I posted in the game thread or post game thread that Pritchard beat everyone down the floor on offense, was open in the corner, and Smart looked him off and didn't make the pass. Which I said at the time can't be allowed to happen. Well, they solved part of it. But guys like JB and JT still need to whip him the ball on those types of plays ALL THE TIME. Including last 2 minute situations where Pritch gets open (if he's on the floor).

I don't think the last weeks output should be any surprise, neither should it be over valued.

The competition faced was closer to a G League run around, and he dominated accordingly.

Payton's game has always been very well rounded after the extended time at Oregon with that I don't think his ceiling is much higher. At 26 he's now essentially at the beginning of his prime. What does that look like?

- Above average perimeter shooting
- The ability to play extended minutes as the primary ball handler, with acceptable level of on ball playmaking.
- The ability to play off the ball very well.
- Footspeed to at least keep in front of opposing guards (not exactly limit though)
- Along with an intangible aspect of being able to make 'pesky' heads up plays under the basket from the weakside on defense.

His size will forever remain the limiting factor, and his defense as a whole is a notable liability. Larger players in pick n roll or on side clear outs feast in limited minutes against him. That would be exacerbated with extended starter type minutes (against starter level competition), and should he see extended time (over 15mpg) this playoffs that will be apparent.

I think Paytons effectiveness is still best suited to a 6th man type role at his peak, which is just around the corner. Its possible he could be a starter on a middling NBA team but with that would come some drawbacks.

Regardless, probably my second favourite player on this team.

playa-hater wrote:Some of these comments would have BostoncoachGM In an uproar... Where is he when I need him..

Did he leave or was he banned??

Show your face this thread is for you.

You have to say his name 3 times in a mirror in a room with the lights off. Then he shows up and ruins everything.

JimmyFromNz wrote:I don't think the last weeks output should be any surprise, neither should it be over valued.

The competition faced was closer to a G League run around, and he dominated accordingly.

Payton's game has always been very well rounded after the extended time at Oregon with that I don't think his ceiling is much higher. At 26 he's now essentially at the beginning of his prime. What does that look like?

- Above average perimeter shooting
- The ability to play extended minutes as the primary ball handler, with acceptable level of on ball playmaking.
- The ability to play off the ball very well.
- Footspeed to at least keep in front of opposing guards (not exactly limit though)
- Along with an intangible aspect of being able to make 'pesky' heads up plays under the basket from the weakside on defense.

His size will forever remain the limiting factor, and his defense as a whole is a notable liability. Larger players in pick n roll or on side clear outs feast in limited minutes against him. That would be exacerbated with extended starter type minutes (against starter level competition), and should he see extended time (over 15mpg) this playoffs that will be apparent.

I think Paytons effectiveness is still best suited to a 6th man type role at his peak, which is just around the corner. Its possible he could be a starter on a middling NBA team but with that would come some drawbacks.

Regardless, probably my second favourite player on this team.

I actually like the idea of seeing PP become an eventual six man.. Usually He comes in and provides great energy and a spark. And his offense can be on or off the ball as well..

PP can actually dominate a game when given a chance. He is very hard to stop when he has it going. I like the way he attacks inside, a little bump on the defender and rise up for a mid range. Its no fluke. They actually faced an actual starting 5 in charlotte minus lamelo, and he dominated that game. He will even be better next year, an injury insurance to white and jrue.

Curmudgeon wrote:

steefP2 wrote:One of the better backup guards in the NBA, ceiling is like starter on a decentish team but unlikely to reach that ceiling

They would have said the same about Steve Nash after is first few years in the league. Not saying Pritchard will ever be close to that, but it's really hard to predict with young guards.

I understand what you're saying but Pritchard is 26. Nash at 26 just won mip after being a starter, averaging 15 and 7.5 on like 5% higher true shooting than league average, his next 2 seasons he would make all NBA teams.

Pritchard to me is sort of like a talent tweener. Really thrives when getting a lot of minutes consistently, but on a per minute basis isn’t usually that consistent when getting under 22-23 minutes a game.

Could play a lot on lesser teams and do well and will have a moment or two here off the bench but I don’t really view him a a great bench player like your Lou Wills of the world

His ceiling could maybe be slightly higher than the level he's at right now.

He's 26 yrs old. At age 26, most of the development has been done. He's just about a finished product at this point. There's typically a little more development/improvement that can hap[pen after age 26 but it's usually not much. The vast majority of the development is between age 18-26.

Right now he'a a good 7th/8th man on a really good team. He could probably be a 6th man on some decent teams and 5th starter on some bad teams.

But if he has a little bit more development left that he could do, than that would mean the ceiling is like 6th man on a really good team, 5th starter on a play-in team and 4th starter on a bad team..

lon3lytoaster wrote:Pritchard to me is sort of like a talent tweener. Really thrives when getting a lot of minutes consistently, but on a per minute basis isn’t usually that consistent when getting under 22-23 minutes a game.

Could play a lot on lesser teams and do well and will have a moment or two here off the bench but I don’t really view him a a great bench player like your Lou Wills of the world

Good post. And gets to why talking about his ceiling is somewhat missing the point.

Pritchard's ceiling isn't in question. He can be an NBA sixth man, and we already knew that.

The challenge Payton faces to reach that is consistency. Can he get primed to score on fewer shots (and in fewer minutes)?

Steve Nash won both MVP's at around 30 and after shot an incredible 40-50-90 3X all after the age of 30.

PP's skillz are set just like Nash's was. It was Nash getting more and more comfortable with age and experience. I have no problem with anyone's choices on here since no one really knows. But I do believe almost everyone is selling PP's ceiling a little short.

As for the "his defense". PP's defense is = or > than Trae Young, J Brunson. But that doesn't stop them from being a Major factor for their teams. Not saying PP will reach that level but they are at times MVP level players. My vote remains a quality starter as a Ceiling.

I think I noted when he was drafted, parallels to Fred VanVleet. Running a search, someone else did and I concurred. Similar size. Storied four year college career, starting PG for teams that did really well. No true standout skills, just a gamer and a winner. Jamal Shead btw fits the same category to a T and deserves consideration in the upcoming draft. Anyways...

I'd say his ceiling is a bit below FVV because, quoting myself from 2020

FVV's draftexpress page, from 2014, "Though the small guard isn't a freak athlete, he does possess impressive quickness and can be a pest when opposing guards are loose with their handle away from the rim." Pritchard's nbadraft.net capsule: "Foot speed limits his defensive ability at the next level to some degree."

I do not at all mean this as a knock on Pritch, FVV has long been one of the league's most underrated players IMO

Hal14 wrote:He's 26 yrs old. At age 26, most of the development has been done. He's just about a finished product at this point. There's typically a little more development/improvement that can hap[pen after age 26 but it's usually not much. The vast majority of the development is between age 18-26.

I'm not so sure about this. Players tend to peak between 26-31, probably 27-28 on average. But part of this is simply because this is when they peak athletically.

For players who remain able to contribute into their 30s, their game can continue to mature in their 30s. PGs in particular take longer to develop relative to other positions, and it is also not uncommon for them to play well into their 30s.

When Steph turned 26? He was barely removed from his first all star appearance. Steve Nash was averaging 9 points per game, mostly off the bench. Avery Johnson was a minimum salary pickup for the Spurs after he was waived. Chauncey was making the MLE. Lowry was about to be traded for a future first + Gary Forbes.

Not saying I expect Pritch to become a perennial all star, just saying.

Starting this year, Al was thought of as the Celtics' "6th starter."
Give it another year or two (as Al ages out of that role/designation) and I don't see why Pritchard couldn't be viewed that way.

threrf23 wrote:

Hal14 wrote:He's 26 yrs old. At age 26, most of the development has been done. He's just about a finished product at this point. There's typically a little more development/improvement that can hap[pen after age 26 but it's usually not much. The vast majority of the development is between age 18-26.

I'm not so sure about this. Players tend to peak between 26-31, probably 27-28 on average. But part of this is simply because this is when they peak athletically.

For players who remain able to contribute into their 30s, their game can continue to mature in their 30s. PGs in particular take longer to develop relative to other positions, and it is also not uncommon for them to play well into their 30s.

When Steph turned 26? He was barely removed from his first all star appearance. Steve Nash was averaging 9 points per game, mostly off the bench. Avery Johnson was a minimum salary pickup for the Spurs after he was waived. Chauncey was making the MLE. Lowry was about to be traded for a future first + Gary Forbes.

Not saying I expect Pritch to become a perennial all star, just saying.

FVV is an excellent comp. And a starting championship PG.

I do believe PP's ceiling can be that and a bit more..

31to6 wrote:Starting this year, Al was thought of as the Celtics' "6th starter."
Give it another year or two (as Al ages out of that role/designation) and I don't see why Pritchard couldn't be viewed that way.

agree. But also if Brown is traded (Big If) PP would be needed to spark the offense more so yeah.