The Official Leonard Miller Thread

[urinesane]

Saw a Siakam comp today that seems feasible

I prefer my Frankenstein method.

[Colbinii]

Saw a Siakam comp today that seems feasible

I prefer my Frankenstein method.

Frankenstein or Frankenstein's Monster?

[TimberKat]

It would be nice to get the extra year before RFA, especially if they are paying Miller like a late 1st round pick.

I don't think they are paying him like a late 1st. Here is what I read on canishoopus.com:
"He is likely signed using the new second round pick exception... This means that, like a first-round rookie scale contract, the money used on the deal does not have to come out of the mid-level exception or bi-annual exception pools. Where the second-round pick exception differs from the rookie scale contracts is that there is no scale involved based on draft position; all players signed by this method will make the veteran’s minimum salary in the first two years of the contract, while the third and fourth years are likely to not fully guaranteed and be at the minimum salary allowed by the NBA in a rookie deal."
Reading between the lines: I think his salary is 0 year vet minimum which is likely around 1.1M for 2023. He is likely signed for 4 years.

Under the new CBA a 4-year deal for a second-round pick starts at just over $2M (which is close to the rookie scale salary for the 30th pick).

If the second-round pick exception starts at $2M, why teams want to use it? Is it just they can spend the full MLE on other players plus the additional 2M? All of it still count towards the cap and tax level right (it's not "tax free" money)?

[Klomp]

I don't think they are paying him like a late 1st. Here is what I read on canishoopus.com:
"He is likely signed using the new second round pick exception... This means that, like a first-round rookie scale contract, the money used on the deal does not have to come out of the mid-level exception or bi-annual exception pools. Where the second-round pick exception differs from the rookie scale contracts is that there is no scale involved based on draft position; all players signed by this method will make the veteran’s minimum salary in the first two years of the contract, while the third and fourth years are likely to not fully guaranteed and be at the minimum salary allowed by the NBA in a rookie deal."
Reading between the lines: I think his salary is 0 year vet minimum which is likely around 1.1M for 2023. He is likely signed for 4 years.

Under the new CBA a 4-year deal for a second-round pick starts at just over $2M (which is close to the rookie scale salary for the 30th pick).

If the second-round pick exception starts at $2M, why teams want to use it? Is it just they can spend the full MLE on other players plus the additional 2M? All of it still count towards the cap and tax level right (it's not "tax free" money)?

Correct.

[Klomp]

Read on Twitter

[younggunsmn]

Under the new CBA a 4-year deal for a second-round pick starts at just over $2M (which is close to the rookie scale salary for the 30th pick).

If the second-round pick exception starts at $2M, why teams want to use it? Is it just they can spend the full MLE on other players plus the additional 2M? All of it still count towards the cap and tax level right (it's not "tax free" money)?

Correct.

Yes, it allows you to use the full value of your other exceptions and still offer a 2nd round pick more than 2 years at the minimum.

From my understanding, they don't HAVE to pay him the max 2.019 million to get the 4 years, it can start anywhere from the rookie min of 1.1 million, but the cap on the first year salary under the exception is 2.019 if you offer 4 years.

I wonder if a guy like Miller can leverage the full 2.019, being a guy who was picked 33rd and fell out of the 1st round, or if 2 fully guaranteed years would be enough.

It would be great to get clarification on if the player is a Restricted Free Agent at the end of the 4 years of a 2nd round pick exception contract, because that would swing a significant amount of value toward the team and away from the player.

Otherwise teams will all be declining the 4th year Team Option on guys that they want to keep so they can re-sign them while still having their RFA rights.

But my guess is that no, players will be UFA after that 4th year just like under the old CBA.

[Klomp]

Read on Twitter

Looks like it's a little under the max then (I believe the maximum would be around $8.77M from the numbers I found/posted earlier in thread)

[younggunsmn]

Read on Twitter

Looks like it's a little under the max then (I believe the maximum would be around $8.77M from the numbers I found/posted earlier in thread)

Can you summarize for those of us who don't want to create a twitter account?
They made it a closed system and don't really feel like being data harvested just so I can read sports tweets.

[Klomp]

Can you summarize for those of us who don't want to create a twitter account?
They made it a closed system and don't really feel like being data harvested just so I can read sports tweets.

The Minnesota Timberwolves signed No. 33 overall pick Leonard Miller to a four-year, $8.3 million deal, league sources told @hoopshype. The first two years of the deal are fully guaranteed, the third year is 50 percent guaranteed, and the fourth year is a team option.

[younggunsmn]

Can you summarize for those of us who don't want to create a twitter account?
They made it a closed system and don't really feel like being data harvested just so I can read sports tweets.

The Minnesota Timberwolves signed No. 33 overall pick Leonard Miller to a four-year, $8.3 million deal, league sources told @hoopshype. The first two years of the deal are fully guaranteed, the third year is 50 percent guaranteed, and the fourth year is a team option.

Thanks.
Judging from the details on the guarantees, that's probably solid info.
Here's a good breakdown I found:
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/07/hoops-rumors-glossary-second-round-pick-exception.html

Judging from the 8.3 number, I would guess Miller's contract starts at the 1 year vet salary (1.801 million), because it matches up exactly. If it started at 2.019, it would be 8.75 million.

2023/24 $1,801,769
2024/25 $1,891,857
2025/26 $2,221,677
2026/27 $2,406,205
Total: $8,321,508

One interesting point, the player only can get a big bump on year 1 and a slight bump on year 2 (only in a 4 year deal) over the absolute minimum offer. Years 3 and 4 are minimums no matter what.

[urinesane]

Saw a Siakam comp today that seems feasible

I prefer my Frankenstein method.

Frankenstein or Frankenstein's Monster?

Frankenstein made the monster, I made the comp.

Frankenstein.

[Klomp]

Really good Miller breakdown, starting at 9:28, from before the draft

Watch on YouTube

[Klomp]

As excited as we all are, I just want to caution us to not get ahead of ourselves. Leonard is still just 19 years old. I don't want to heap too much expectations on him too soon. I fear some have already done that with Minott, and now those people are growing unfairly frustrated with his lack of development.

[Klomp]

Read on Twitter

[thinktank]

He gives me mini-KG vibes. KG but 10% or whatever smaller.

[Klomp]

Watch on YouTube

[Klomp]

I haven't seen it pointed out yet how big his hands are. At the combine they measured 9.5" long and 10.5" wide.

Here are a few of the other biggest hands in the league.
Leonard Miller: 9.5" long and 10.5" wide
Kawhi Leonard: 9.75" long and 11.25" wide
Tacko Fall: 10.5" long and 10.5" wide
Jaren Jackson: 10" long and 10" wide
Pascal Siakam: 9.25" long and 10" wide
Rudy Gobert: 9.75" long and 10" wide
Giannis Antetokounmpo: 9.9" long and 12" wide

[Klomp]

Read on Twitter

[DoctaJ]

What I've heard is that Canada Basketball invited anyone that had previously played at any level to the camp that started earlier this week for the FIBA BWC - apparently Miller was the only non-commit that took them up on it. Got to love his commitment/desire to work.

[Folklore]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube