King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock)

Moderators: Marcus, Duke4life831

King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#1 » by King Ken » Fri Mar 8, 2019 2:21 am

Welcome to my Big board thread. I have a pre conference play big board from Dec 31, midseason Big Board from Jan 31st, Post-season Conference Play which is the one I currently have up from 3/7. We have the Final Four and National Championship Big Board with little movement. The pre-draft big board once the playoff lottery ends, that will also include a mock draft. We have the combine big board and one last mock draft.

After the NBA Combine rankings.

Update: 5/31/2019

Tier 1: Superstar potential
1. Zion - Elite floor, Elite but NOT a HOF ceiling, fit will play a role if he becomes an superstar level player. As special as they come. Even if others may have potential, no one should pass up on him for any reason whatsoever.

Tier 2: All Star potential

2t. R.J. Barrett - High floor, very high ceiling, could be one of the best players in the league in the right situation. Like this entire in this class, fit is important for Barrett long term.

2t. Ja Morant - One of the best talents in this class but one has to seriously question his floor. A bad fit could limit his impact. Best to put him around shooters. Special PG talent.

Tier 3.5: Decent Role player potential with All Star possibilities down the road. I do see these guys as Day 1 contributors.

4t. Reddish - Semi low floor, very high ceiling. System based player.

4t. Brandon Clarke - Mid high floor, very high ceiling, I strongly believe he can be the next DeMarre Carroll with Shawn Marion level athleticism. System based player. Will need time to translate into a SF.

4t. Darius Garland - Low mid floor, high ceiling.

4t. Bol - High floor and very high ceiling? System based player. Extremely bad flaws. Extremely good strengths.

4t. Coby White - Semi-Mid floor and high ceiling, System based player

Tier 4: Decent Role player potential or raw with AS possibilities. Deep Tier 4 class. One of the best in years. Of course, some of these guys could return.

9t. Jaxson Hayes - Low floor with high ceiling, Hayes has a blend of J. Noah, Capela and Robin Lopez in him. He is so far from ready to play, anyone who takes him will likely send him to the G-League for a season. System based player

9t. DeAndre Hunter - Very high floor with mid ceiling, you are looking at a Otto Porter Jr/Ron Artest type who can help you right away. He can fit any system to a degree and he fits the modern NBA. 4
9t. Romeo Langford - Low floor/High ceiling, low end All Star potential but he has a lot of work to do. Work ethic will be critical with this one.

9t. Nassir Little – Big mover with Romeo, at the end of the day, even with a lower end floor, his ceiling I low end All Star and that matters.

9t. Rui - Teams will underrate him but he is a critical piece to a PnR team looking for a high end PnR finisher who can switch. May never be a superstar but in the right fit, you got someone who can really play. High floor, high mid ceiling. System based player. – Rui moved up a level as he has shown me he is a legit prospect of the tier 4.

9t. Mfiondu Kabengele - Low floor, mid high ceiling and not a system based player. He will generate a lot of attention in the mid 1st to late 1st range. To me, he is a prospect that you must look at due to his ability to fit the modern game. – Great workouts, moved up.

9t. Goga Bitadze - Mid floor, mid high ceiling who is a system based player. The right team will have to draft him but in the right system, he could be more than valuable. – Great 2nd half of the season, moved up.

9t. Jarrett Culver - mid high floor with a lower-mid ceiling who would be at his best in a PG based role. Jalen Rose type. – Move up as he is better than I previously stated, I still have my doubts.

9t. Sekou - low floor with high ceiling who has tremendous smallball four potential. Not the next Siakam but he can be very good down the road. – Great 2nd half of the season, moved up.

18. Bruno Fernando - mid floor with mid potential who has play in numerous systems but could be very good in the right one. Good pickup in this range.

19t. Tyler Herro - Low Floor, semi high ceiling with tremendous work ethic. Will need to adjust to the NBA game but has potential.

19t. P.J. Washington - Mid Floor, Mid potential who has a projectable jumper. David West type.

19t. Nickeil Alexander-Walker - mid floor with mid potential who can be a good role player for most teams in time. Gary Harris type

19t. Talen Horton-Tucker - Lower low floor with a semi high ceiling. His projectability is everything. Teams love him, moving on up.

19t. KZ Okpala - Low floor/High ceiling who is a system based player. System/culture/and fit will be critical. His ceiling is one of the highest in this class.

24t. Keldon Johnson - mid floor with mid potential who is a system player. Needs to be protected.

24t. Grant Williams - High floor/Low ceiling. High quality late 1st round pick, wouldn't risk taking him 20 or better.

24t. Matisse Thybulle - Lower mid floor/Semi High ceiling. Has starting role player potential.

24t. Nic Claxton - Low floor, Semi high ceiling. System versatility. Could be a big mover if he enters. His ceiling and skill-set is legit.

24t. Luka Samanic – Low mid floor with high mid ceiling. Could be a rich man’s Niko Mirotic.

29t. Jalen McDaniels- Teams have been high on his ceiling and role playing potential off the bench for awhile. He is a Swiss army knife and teams could see him as the big man's version of Terrance Ferguson. I can see him going in this range and his floor is higher than people think.

29t. Gafford - More of a 2nd round floor. He does play the PnR well, move well and space and flash potential in space on defense. He is more inconsistent but his potential to be a two way player who can defend in space on defense and play in space on offense makes his NBA ceiling higher than most in this range. Teams will be higher on him after workouts. His ability to play in space on both ends will appeal to a lot of teams looking for a big who can protect others, especially on D in the switching parts of the game.

29t. Kevin Porter Jr. - Low floor/High ceiling with questionable work ethic and character. – I haven’t heard nothing to move him up higher. He is lucky he plays a need position where teams will overlook the weaknesses for the potential.

29t. Cameron Johnson - Big mover, lower mid floor/semi high ceiling. More NBA ready than Final Four hero Justin Jackson. He is a clearly better NBA prospect to me.

33t. Admiral Schofield - semi low floor/semi high ceiling - I see a lot of P.J. Tucker long term is Scho in flashes. I need to see more of Scho, Tennessee just hasn't been a team I've watched a lot of. This is could change the time the draft is here.

33t. Ty Jerome - Not quite the shooter Shamet was but a better PG and a much better defender. But he doesn't have the positional versatility that Shamet had. Jerome really is a PG. Potential to be a low end starter in the NBA which is pretty good for a 2nd round grade. high floor/semi low ceiling.

33t. Darius Bazley – Very low floor, high ceiling. Excellent value in this range.

33t. Isaiah Roby - Isaiah Roby - 3/D potential ceiling. 6'8, has the size, can get blocks and steals. His shooting needs work. Doesn't quite have the athletic ability. Clearly a 2/way guy. Some will say he has RoCo potential but he really going to have to improve his shooting. Guys like Ennis and Covington shot it better but than again, they played for small schools, not in the Big 12. For positions where they have taller better bigger players, we should take it more seriously as well seen with guys like Taurean Prince. – Had an excellent combine. Moved into my top 35.

33t. Terance Davis – Measureables are there, hand size, skill, athletic ability, Davis has a great chance to be a major sleeper in this class long term.

33t. Justin Harper – Another kid who just has so much talent and ability and really can be good. I really compare him to Ben Gordon and another kid in this class (Justin Wright-Foreman).

33t. Terrance Mann - I actually like his potential. Clearly 2/way contract. Not NBA ready whatsoever but he does show enough to play in the G-League and see if he can have a NBA career. Low floor/low mid ceiling. – I bumped his floor to low high and his ceiling to mid. 1st round potential to me long term.

33t. Tremont Waters – He had a major bump. The only PG outside of tier 4 to just into tier 4. Tremendous talent. D.J. Augustin like potential. Higher floor than many will expect, low mid ceiling.

33t. Kyle Guy – low mid floor, mid ceiling, Guy is a polished prospect with the potential to be a decent NBA player in the long run.
33t. Tyler Cook – very low floor with mid high potential, a player who lacks the feel of the game but the talent and athletic ability is there. Needs time and the right situation. Could be a steal.

33t. Chuma Okeke - Semi high floor with a mid ceiling. Injury dropped his value. Top 20 value when healthy!

33t Jontay Porter - Semi high floor with a high ceiling. Injuries have majorly dropped what would be a top 5-10 player in this draft.


Tier 5: Low floors with Decent Role player potential or career backups with limited potential - I don't

45. Justin Wright-Foreman - Ben Gordon like but not as long (6'6 wingspan compared to Ben's 6'8.25 wingspan). More skillful scorer than Ben, not as athletic which shows especially on defense. Good passing vision. Has potential as an instant scorer off the bench.

46t. Naz Reid - Brian Grant like - Semi mid floor, low mid ceiling. Limited on defense. Rotational piece for the NBA at the 5.

46t. Zach Norvell - semi low floor, semi high ceiling. Has two way potential. Consistency is an issue. Flashes Michael Redd potential.

46t. Tacko Fall - semi high floor, low ceiling. rotational big. system based player.

46t. Dylan Windler - semi mid floor, semi mid ceiling. system based player.

46t. Shamorie Ponds - High Floor/low ceiling. D.J. Augustin type depending on what you think. I will likely lean more Augustin.

46t. Jalen Lecque - Placeholder spot, I have no clue about him for now.

46t. Miye Oni - Low floor - high mid potential - I think he could be the Josh Richardson of this class in the right situation. Not sold he will come out as a 2nd rounder. His potential is his calling card.

46t. Louis King - Low floor - semi mid potential - Has the size and skill. I am not sure about the rest. Workouts will matter, if he does poorly, I can see him going back to Oregon.

54t. Marial Shayok - Low floor - semi mid potential, consistency is an issue for Shayok but his talent and skill as well as his body isn't. He will likely go undrafted but his development in the G-League could see him playing good in the NBA sooner than later. Sleeper.

54t. Carsen Edwards - Mid high floor with a low ceiling, shooting will be critical for his prospects. Moved up the list due to the tourney but I can see him having issues translating to the NBA. Shooting will be everything.

54t. Lindell Wigginton - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

54t. Markus Howard - More of a high European prospect. He is an elite scorer and shooter but not much else and his defense can be labeled as a better Jimmer. Mid floor/low ceiling. His shooting, ability to create his own shot and BBIQ will appeal to teams looking for a 2/way. His 2/way appeal helps his NBA profile.

54t. Lawson - He is a really good college player. One of the best but he doesn't really have a position or a legit skill. Growth will be critical but should be a 2/way prospect with potential to be a low end rotation player. Low floor/low mid ceiling.

54t. Jordan Bone - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. He is unique. He is one of those rare seniors who can take a major leap. Don't be surprised if him and Yves Pons takes a major leap in 2020. Both have the athletic ability and their development has been ample. Rick Barnes is working his magic in Knoxville.

60t. Charles Matthews - Injuries could lower his status but he is a clear NBA player to me. Mid high floor/low ceiling.

60t. Jordan Poole - Sam Veceine is sold on him. I just haven't watched Michigan much and when I did, they played bad and lost or they just played bad this year. Like Maryland last year, when I get a chance to watch their games, I will probably bump these guys up.

60t Iggy Brazdeikis - See Poole. I am pretty much putting the UM guys in this range till I can really rate them.

60t. Konate - His potential is much higher than his floor. He has talent and ability but the G-League should be an option for him. low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

60t. Paschall - Been watching Paschall for a while. Not sold on his standing reach. 2/way guy. He can play in the NBA right now but I am not sure he can stick. mid high floor/low ceiling.

65t. Cassius Winston - Moved up due to the tourney but I have questions about his ability to play bully ball 6'1 185.

65t. Tookie Brown - Mid high floor, with a semi low floor, this is my steal of the draft. I didn't really watch his games much but I watched him at Portsmouth and he clearly looked like a NBA player, the numbers and highlights match and he has that IT0 factor of just getting buckets in kinda way. He has moved up my draft board. IT0 of this class. I think he will get some looks in the draft.

67t. Ahmed Hill - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

67t. Nick Perkins - semi mid floor with low ceiling

67t. Justin James - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

67t. Fletcher Magee - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. I like his 2/way potential. An elite shooter and can get from three in every way like Redick. I wouldn't be suprised if he was drafted in the 2nd round.

67t. Obi Toppin - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

67t. John Konchar - semi mid floor, semi low ceiling. All around player. Flashes potential to be a good NBA player. G-League will be a need. Shades of a bigger, strong, taller, not quite the shooter and skill of Scott Skiles. Like Skiles, doesn't lack a skill but does he have the athletic ability. He isn't anywhere near as good as Scott was. Scott was a lot more polished but John is 6'5, 215. His potential is there.

67t. Simi Shittu - very low floor with a semi high ceiling

67t. DaQuan Jeffries - high low floor with a semi mid ceiling

67t. Reggie Perry - high low floor with a semi mid ceiling

67t. Dewan Hernandez - high low floor with a semi mid ceiling

67t. Oshae Brissett - high low floor with a semi mid ceiling

67t. Cody Martin - high low floor with a semi mid ceiling

80t. Jarrell Brantley - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

80t. Daishon Smith - mid floor, low ceiling, good player who has 2-way potential to be a decent player.

80t. Luguentz Dort - low floor/mid ceiling. Has a projectable frame and skill-set but just is completely unpolished and not ready for the NBA.

80t. Mike Daum - Mid high floor - low potential - I compare his type to Kris Humphries. 23 years old but he has a lot of translatable skill.

80t. Aric Holman - projectable player. Obviously has to put on more size. 3/D PF. A clear low floor semi mid ceiling who is a 2/way option. Could move up into the 2nd round with ease.

80t. Caleb Martin - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

80t. Juwan Morgan - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

80t. Josh Reaves - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. His defensive potential will warrant some looks in the 2nd.

80t. Cody Martin - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. Great passer for position and you hope he can develop into a secondary playmaker who is a 3/D player long term. Has long term

80t. Robert Franks - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

80t. Bennie Boatwright - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

80t. Brian Bowen - low floor/mid ceiling, workouts will be critical for him. Could move up.

80t. D’Marcus Simonds - low floor/semi mid ceiling, he can play but he has to develop his shooting ability and his decision making. If he can develop it, he could be a NBA player but it's unlikely.

80t. Amir Hinton - very low floor/mid ceiling, he has the tools, skills and the talent but he is so far away from others. It's like watching a HS player who played HS ball.

80t. Jaylen Hoard - low floor/semi mid ceiling, his ability to play in Europe next year could push him into the 2nd round. He has the talent and size to play in the NBA but he doesn't have the skill, readiness, or feel at this point.

Tier 6: G-Leaguer who have the potential to be career backups with limited potential or non NBA prospects who will practice their trade overseas.

95t. Ethan Happ - Tremendously skilled big with no range whatsoever.

95t. CJ Massinburg - Euro

95t. Kerwin Roach - Euro

95t. Ky Bowman - G-League

95t. Chris Clemons - China

95t. Matt Morgan - G-League

95t. Makai Mason - G-League

95t. Tyus Battle - 2020 prospect but not getting drafted in 2020 either.

95t. Dean Wade- Has a lot of potential in countries that value big men passes in Europe but no NBA Potential.

95t. Kenny Goins - G-League

95t. Christ Koumadje - G-League

95t. Zac Cuthbertson - G-League - poor man's NAW

95t. Jakeenan Gant - very poor man's Jarian Grant

95t. Trayvon Reed - G-League

95t. Matt Morgan - G-League

95t. Cameron Young - G-League - Klutch Client

As I stated on top, this is an extremely DEEP class but not so top heavy or mid heavy. If this was mixed last year class. Zion would be 1. R.J. and Ja would be ahead of Mikal/WCJ/Trae/JJJ at #7/#8. While Cam/Clarke/White/Garland/Bol in the same tier with Sexton/SGA/Miles B./Knox and to be honest, they would be behind all of them but Knox's as well. Trae was in that tier for the longest till I bumped him up a few weeks before the draft ahead of JJJ. It took me the longest to be convinced Trae was good enough to be an All Star potential type and not just way down the road.

Basically, this draft isn't nowhere near as top heavy as 2018. You got basically the #4 prospect in this class, would be #16th in last year's draft combined. That's said, after the first 13th prospects, last year class doesn't hold water to this year's class in terms of rotation potential and I haven't included the 2nd round internationals yet. Just a lot of rotation pieces in this draft with some upside. That's the strength of this class. Clearly not the top.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#2 » by King Ken » Fri Mar 8, 2019 2:23 am

December 31 2018:

NOTE: This big board was for the Hawks exclusively at this time period. The Jan and Mar ones are general ones. This one was specifically for the Hawks board.

Here is my big board for the Hawks: This is mid-season before conference play so we have along way to go.

Tier 1:
1. Zion - The best overall player and fit for me. He can protect the rim. He covers space in lighting speed, I have issues about his post defense but he is an offensive monster and no NBA big will be able to guard him. He will protect Collins like a Ben Wallace like center while having the offensive talent of a Russell Westbrook for 6'7 282. INSANE! #1 player by a mile.

2. Reddish - Raw, still has a lot to work on in terms of coverages and not overly fouling and he still working on learning the off ball game but shows a lot of promise at this stage. I posted articles on him but I like him for us simply because he is a perfect fit with what we have with Trae, Kevin, and John. I don't think he is the best prospect and needs work but his ceiling could be the highest of his class outside of Zion of course.

3. Bol - Do I think he is a perfect fit. No but I do like his fit in our trap heavy defense, I do like that he can protect the paint and I do like his length on D and I love his defensive instincts to block shots which is extremely good but hate his awareness which can be well bad. I understand our defensive communication will take time with him. I understand he doesn't have the bulk to deal with the bigs at this stage in the paint and that he doesn't move laterally well. His offensive value is top notch. Can shoot the three at a high clip with great accuracy.

Can move extremely well without the ball. Gets good positioning in the paint. Extremely skilled. Quick for his size. Excellent ball handler for his size and position. He has as much talent as anyone in this class.

He's my boom or bust for this class. He is a lot like Trae Young to me from that stance. That said, the talent is tremendous. He covers everything we need from a 5 where we have a 4 like Collins who defensively is a liability since Collins isn't laterally quick, doesn't cover a lot of ground, is not an instinctive defender, and simply doesn't have the bulk either. Sometimes I feel like Collins is the Jamal Crawford of NBA defenders. Of course Collins can get blocks based on athleticism and of course, he is a tremendous rebounder who does boxout with good fundamentals. Collins lacks the defensive potential to be any better than below average. We would need a 5 who can cover for Collins weaknesses defensively while still adding value on offense which is most critical for us. Bol Bol can do that. But can we cover Bol for his weaknesses, that's the question with this one. Right now, we got 4 skinny guys starting (Bol, Kevin, Trae and John) Can that work in the NBA?

Tier 2:
4. R.J. - I love love love R.J. My #2 overall prospect. The only prospect outside of Zion I think has multiple time All Star potential with the ability to still be impactful year 1. He would be in the mix with last year's guys as well like Bamba, Bagley, Ayton, Doncic, Trae, WCJ, and JJJ. My issue with him is even though he is Bazemore replacement and he can be that. He isn't a SF. His best position is SG. But so is Kevin's. At this point, we would be drafting R.J. to start over Kevin and still playing Prince at the 3. I am not sure that's as helpful. Kevin does a lot of things that help Trae. Kevin communicates on defense and protects Trae. He just fits with Trae extremely well.

R.J. fits well and he solves a critical issue of a #1 option which we lack but I personally think Trae could be a #1 option. Do we need someone who can just take the ball out of his hands and doesn't really move the ball without dominating it. I think he would be an amazing fit with the Knicks or the Cavs but with us. It's tough. I do think he can be really good with us but if winning a title is our goal, fit really really matters. Especially with our ace being Trae. I'll draft him #4. After 1-3, the others just don't have the potential to justify getting drafted over R.J.


Tier 3:
5. Little - I have my issues with Little. I think he is more Justise Winslow than Leonard.

I see high end role player but I don't see any star potential. I think he is a good fit but he's not a legit top 5 pick in a good draft. I don't even see him as well as I saw Buddy Hield. I personally think he is like Prince, just younger and a better fit and not as skilled or the same quality of shooter. I would look to moving back at this point but this draft becomes pretty even on my board so in the 8-20 range is where I would look to draft Little.

Like how Prince fit Bud's system, Little fits our current one but I don't see the potential to be a star but I like him.

6. Culver - I posted a lot on him already so I will focus on what I like. He is a great system fit in what we do especially at the SG. He gives a depth and a legit baller to mix and match with Kevin. Not really a top 5 guy in my book in any draft but like Little, the 8-20 range is good.

Tier 4:

I actually like my 4th tier guys a lot. Usually super raw and just average role player potential, these guys can be much better than projected.

7. Okpala - I love Okpala. I call him Giannis before the growth spurt lite. Does not have as wide of shoulders as Giannis, as big as hands, nor as coordinated as the Greek Freak but they have a similar skill-set and baseline as prospects. Okpala maybe more advanced as a prospect than what Giannis was but Giannis at this point grew two inches to 6'11 and Giannis just has better tools but both are similar. I think K.Z. is a better shooter at this stage. I know K.Z. has more experience and K.Z. is a smart player. Doesn't have any of Giannis playmaking ability either.

I see a lot of potential. I think he could be special. I don't think he would be Giannis thought, I think he could be a steal even in the top 10. But he's not going to be a top 10 player in the NBA but he might develop into a multiple time All Star.




8. DeAndre Hunter - I like this kid. He has a mix of Marvin Williams and JJJ in terms of how he moves and how he looks gangly on the court. He marks out high on my of my adv. marks but his tape tells me he could be capable of a lot more in the future. Doesn't move off the ball all that well but he moves very smart.

His defensive fundamentals are elite. He is a 3/D prospect with good playmaking skills. Doesn't sellout to rebound, he actually boxing out and getting clean boards. He doesn't look to blocks shots or get steals outside of help side or weak side assignments. He adjust on the fly, his instincts and BBIQ is 100% there. His focus is consistently playing fundamentally sound defense, defending in space and on the ball and communication on defense with his teammates. I actually think he could be coached to be more aggressive in getting steals and blocks. He has elite defensive instincts. He just so fundamentally sound. Look, I think he is a MUCH better player than most everyone on this list. But his ceiling will never be that high because he is just willing to play within the team concept. I think he is an elite fit. I am probably doing him a disservice at this spot. I would take him before Culver and Little.

He is not Mikal Bridges, he is not an elite role player type who makes All Stars. He is more like Tony Allen or Pascal Siakam who does a lot of winning plays and impacts that show up in the W/L column. His lack of stats will likely see him never be an All Star but his impact will feel like a star. I would not pass on him. I am taking him with a top 10 pick. Not top 5 but I will take him in the top ten. He fits perfectly for us. I will move him up on the next list.



His tape is just as impressive has his advanced stats. He has ZERO star potential but he has superstar team player written all over him.

9. Sekou - Potential, Potential, potential. I have my doubts, but his potential can be good. I don't see the fit. He shouldn't be the on list.

10t. Kevin Porter Jr. - TBA, like his highlights but I haven't evaluated him yet.
10t. Nickeil Alexander-Walker - TBA, like his highlights but I haven't evaluated him yet.
12. Jontay Porter - I like him and I clearly felt he was a fit last year. Nothing has changed. Still feel the same. I wanted him then at 18. I am just not as high on taking a center so high knowing John is who his partner will be and paint protection isn't his calling card.

13. Simi - I need to see more but I like what experts are projecting which fits what we need from the 5.


Tier 5:
14t. Gafford - I like his profile for us, need to see more. I like his game tape as well.

14t. Jason Hayes - I like his profile for us, need to see more. I like his game tape as well.

16. Naz Reid - Not as big on him but I liken him to Brian Grant and that would be a great backup for us right now.

17. Bassey - I like his profile for us, need to see more. I like his game tape as well.

18t. Bruno - I like his profile for us, need to see more. I like his game tape as well.

18t. Brandon Clarke - I love Brandon Clarke and I see him as a perfect fit as a backup 4. That's why he is on this list. I have backup 4 as a need position and around the mid to late 1st in this draft. I like him as a possibility.

20. Romeo- He needs to stay another year. The talent is there but he isn't where he needs to be BBIQ wise to take that leap to the NBA. Development is going to be good for him. The NBA isn't good to raw skinny SG's without great athletic ability. He needs to bulk up, improve that jumper, and get smarter so he can dominate his level.

I have two new list. Early season and I'll break it down later:

My top players and then my top list for the Hawks

My top players:
Tier 1:
Zion

Tier 2:
R.J.
Bol
Morant

Tier 3:
Reddish
Little
Culver
Rui
Garland

Tier 4:
Sekou
Okpala
Kevin Porter Jr.
Jontay Porter
Nickeil Alexander-Walker
DeAndre Hunter


Tier 5:
Gafford
Romeo
Jason Hayes
Naz Reid
Bassey
Bruno
Simi
Brandon Clarke
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#3 » by King Ken » Fri Mar 8, 2019 2:23 am

My top 13 on my personal big board Jan 30th 2019

For me, from 6-25, they are all similar in terms of overall to me. Just the ones I like the most potentially is higher on my board. To me, this class is much better than the 2016 class but that class was known for having a strong top 7 with Chriss being the one with the massive untapped potential and being the 8th guy. This class is much much much deeper. The issue with this class is #1 is as good or better than any class ever but #2 would have been fighting for #7 pick with Wendell Carter Jr. last year. Ja is a similar prospect for me to Trae and that could be much better than you expect long term while going through the struggles, short term. I actually like Ja more than Trae as a prospect, just a tad, personal preference. Honestly, I can't rate Cam or Jarrett in the same class with Mikal Bridges which was slightly higher than WCJ or Trae although I like Cam and Jarrett more than Knox as a prospect.

After that, it's like last year's draft for me. SGA and Garland are similar rated prospects in my tier system. 6-25 range equals the SGA and 13-22 range of last year. It's all about who you like the most. This isn't a weak draft at all. A lot of 3/D guys, a lot of guys with the size or athletic ability. A lot of two way potential guys with some BBIQ as well. But the superstar quality is extremely low in this class. It's literally, get a top 3 pick or SOL and truthfully, get Zion is you really only option. This is a great draft to have a mid or mid late 1st. Maybe not as much for a lottery pick. That said, I personally rated the guys I liked the most after 5.

I like K.Z., I think he could be a star long term. I see a potentially better Tobias Harris long term. I really like Jaxson Hayes, he is raw but smart, freaky fast twitchy but not skilled, high motor but not a scorer. Has a great bounce, great shooting form and shows a lot of potential with his shot long term. He is a strange prospect. - rebounder for position and doesn't have active hands in the passing lane but covers ground at an elite level, a tremendous shot blocker and already a tremendous team and PnR defender. Good frame. He has room for grow due to his broad shoulders. I like kids with NFL and West African dads, they usually have broad shoulders and are able to quickly add weight.

Read on Twitter


Rui is high on my personal list because he is one of the few guys that just translates for me. Combo forwards who can defend and switch, play on and off the ball, can dribble, can shoot and pass are in vogue in the modern NBA. It's hard to pass on him. Tobias Harris is about to be a max contract. These guys are the wave. Garland like SGA aren't going to set the NBA on fire but they translate and will help you ASAP. For both players, it's their ceiling but I am fond of their floor. I think both will land between All Star and good PG. A tad higher than prime Jeff Teague range.

Hunter is my favorite. 3/D, translates, can defend multiple positions, can pass. If he had more upside for me, I would have him with Mikal Bridges. I personally think he is a lot like a smaller Danilo Gallinari. He is a lot more skilled than he gets credit for and he is such all a plus in every area but he isn't a 1-3 option. In fact, like DMC, he is a #4 to #5 option on offense. NAW for me is a rich man's Arron Affalo. He has all of what Arron has but a much better shooter and maybe scorer. I can see in the right system, him becoming a potential All Star. I know some who think he is another Jamal Murray. It's possible, he is such an efficient scorer.

I am not as high on Langford, I think he is as talented as anyone in my 6-25 if not more talented. But talent isn't everything. I don't think he is athletic enough to get to the rack in the NBA for his first couple years and doesn't shoot the ball well enough to keep the defense honest. I think he will struggle honestly. But he is as talented as anyone in this draft after Ja, R.J. and Zion. Little has a lot of talent but I don't really know what he does at a NBA level. The potential to be a star is there with him but he is so far from it and it's unlikely he gets there. My Stanley Johnson of the class. I loved Johnson as a prospect. I focused on his star potential and less on his rawness and he doesn't do anything to get on the court at this stage at the next level. For prospects like these, they pray to go to Boston, San Antonio, Brooklyn, etc. Most teams will make them busts. Simple as that.

That's my personal 13 for now. It will consistently change. Guys move up and down.



1. Zion
Major Gap
2t. R.J.
2t. Ja
Gap
4. Cam Fam
5. Jarrett Culver
Slight Gap
6. K.Z. Okpala
7. Jaxson Hayes
8. Rui
9. Darius Garland
10. DeAndre Hunter
11. Nickeil Alexander-Walker
12. Romeo Langford
13. Nassir Little
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#4 » by King Ken » Fri Mar 8, 2019 2:24 am

End of conference Play rankings. March 7th 2019

Tier 1: Superstar potential
1. Zion - The best overall player and fit for me. He can protect the rim. He covers space in lighting speed, I have issues about his post defense but he is an offensive monster and no NBA big will be able to guard him. He will protect Collins like a Ben Wallace like center while having the offensive talent of a Russell Westbrook for 6'7 282. INSANE! #1 player by a mile. - Not changed since 12/31

Tier 2: All Star potential
2t. R.J. is still my #2. He passes the pass, shoot and dribble part extremely well. He has star potential and a high floor. Not quite sure he is a better fit than Kevin but he is worth the flyer.

2t. Ja is still #2. He has a combo guard game with a floor game of a true PG. He will put up numbers in the NBA. Not sure if he will be a winner yet but that's the least of issues drafting this high. Getting a star is always your top priority.

Tier 3.5: Decent Role player potential with All Star possibilities down the road. I do see these guys as Day 1 contributors.

4. Reddish - Raw, still has a lot to work on in terms of reading coverages and overly fouling and he still working on learning the off ball game but shows a lot of promise at this stage. This is the same thing I said in Dec 31st of 2018 and it remains true today. I like him for us simply because he is a perfect fit with what we have with Trae, Kevin, and John. I don't think he is the best prospect and needs work but his ceiling could be the highest of his class outside of Zion of course. I dropped him a tier and a half because he hasn't made any positive strides that the top 3 have made throughout the season. He has been consistency inconsistent.

5. Bol - Do I think he is a perfect fit. No but I do like his fit in our trap heavy defense, I do like that he can protect the paint and I do like his length on D and I love his defensive instincts to block shots which is extremely good but hate his awareness which can be well bad. I understand our defensive communication will take time with him. I understand he doesn't have the bulk to deal with the bigs at this stage in the paint and that he doesn't move laterally well. His offensive value is top notch. Can shoot the three at a high clip with great accuracy.

I seemly copied this from Dec 31st. I removed him off my board in Feb but I put him back on as a top 5 prospect.

Tier 4: Decent Role player potential or raw with AS possibilities. Deep Tier 4 class.


6. K.Z. Okpala - I still have him high on my board just due to his ceiling. I think he is better than many think he is. I still think he can be a star potentially. I still think he is Giannis lite.

7. Brandon Clarke - The big mover on my board. While I don't find him to be the ideal 3/D 3, I think he has tremendous potential in a system where he can develop his SF skills. Much more of a PF right now but I do believe he has the potential to be a SF and he has the potential to be an All Star and a rare defensive player. More of a PF/C at this stage.

8. Jaxson Hayes - His floor is really low. I doubt he is better than Miles Plumlee but his ceiling is sky high. He has all star potential and at the least, top 10 center potential. Top 10 lock.

9. DeAndre Hunter - Moved up but moved down from a week ago. He to me has Otto Porter Jr. like potential. That to me is worth a TON in this class. Top 10 lock for me and he is already a SF so he will translate Day 1.

10. Darius Garland - He has all of the potential you want as an off the ball scorer and a smart PG. Not the passer of yet but just plays a good game. I compared him to Mike Conley. Worth a top 10 pick.

11. Rui - Efficiency, consistency, high floor, hasn't been playing long so he has the potential. I see him like a Kenyon Martin type which is a great fit in today's position-less NBA. He is a lottery lock for me.

12. Jontay Porter - Was off the board for the same reason as Bol and that's due to injury. But if you watch his tape, who at the 5 passes, shooting and dribbles better than him in this class or even close? Maybe Bol but key word is pass as well. His defense and injury history puts a knock on him for me but his ceiling is high.

13. Jarrett Culver - Big drop mainly due to his shooting ability. He can't shoot it from range. I really liken him to Even Turner. His skill level is very high and a lot will compare him to Smitty as well who had more success than Turner but I really don't think he fits the modern NBA even if he is one of the best college players. His defense does show more potential than Smitty and Turner which is a good sign. He clearly has a high floor but he's not a top 10 prospect for me in the modern NBA.

14. Goga Bitadze - The more I watch, the more I like. He looks like the rich man's Memo Okur potential. Will fit the modern NBA and be quality for someone for years to come. Not a good defender but he is a smart one.

15. Sekou - His potential has always been high like Gobert but like Gobert, where does he fit. If he goes to the right team, he can have a tremendous career but that's easier said than done.

16. Bruno Fernando - He can pass good, rebound and play off the ball on offense. His defense is okay, nothing special, he is mainly a shot blocker. He is the closest prospect to Clint Capela in this draft.

17. Nickeil Alexander-Walker - NAW is one of the better scorers in this class. I really look at him as the rich man's Aaron Affalo. Worth a look at this point of the draft. Gary Harris potential is a possiblity.

18. Romeo Langford - DeMar DeRozan comparison is fair for Langford. Better overall athlete, not anywhere near as explosive or the same dunker. Might have better defensive potential. Lower floor than most others hurt him but his ceiling is as high as anyone in this class after 3.

19. Nassir Little - Has as much talent, upside, length, measureables and gifts as anyone in this class not named Zion. But his extremely low floor and low feel for the game probably caps his potential. Look for him to tease whoever takes him like J.R. Smith, Josh Smith, Whiteside, Dion Waiters, and Andre Drummond but Drummond is the hope that you get from Little. A player with the potential but can actually reach it. He is not in my lottery but his talent and package is attractive, especially at this spot.

20. Keldon Johnson - I am not as high on him as others, I see him as a bigger but slower Avery Bradley. 3/D potential. Will have value.

21. Kevin Porter Jr. - A lot like Lonnie Walker of last's year class, he is a raw unpolished player with the ceiling that could be an All Star. Developmental guy but one you could win on in three years.

22. Grant Williams - One of the most productive players in college basketball players is the next P.J. Tucker to me. He is the rich man's verison. Some have even compared him to Sap but he doesn't rebound as good but he too has that SF skill for a PF body. Grant will be a steal but it's clear why he is ranked right here. This is his level.

23. Charles Bassey - He has all of the potential and ability to be a top 10 pick but is raw and does he translate to the modern NBA like that. Either way, he will be an effective starting 5 and his shooting stroke gives you hope that he can be a player with good versatility down the road. Flashes David West like game but Bassey has a couple of inches on West in terms of height but doesn't have that 7'4 wingspan West had. I think he is underrated honestly. Him and Grant Williams could surprise people. He is average sized as a 5 but he can be good down the line.

24. Naz Reid - He fits the modern NBA offensively but defensively, he doesn't and he is consistently inconsistent. Not to mention, he has motor issues. But his skill level and easy rotational fit should impress a team in the bottom half of the 1st round.

25. Jalen McDaniels- Teams have been high on his ceiling and role playing potential off the bench for awhile. He is a Swiss army knife and teams could see him as the big man's version of Terrance Ferguson. I can see him going in this range and his floor is higher than people think.

26. Gafford - More of a 2nd round floor. He does play the PnR well, move well and space and flash potential in space on defense. He is more inconsistent but his potential to be a two way player who can defend in space on defense and play in space on offense makes his NBA ceiling higher than most in this range. Teams will be higher on him after workouts. His ability to play in space on both ends will appeal to a lot of teams looking for a big who can protect others, especially on D in the switching parts of the game.

Tier 5: Low floors with Decent Role player potential or career backups with limited potential
Colby White
Naz Reid
Kris Wilkes
Tre Jones
Ty Jerome
Chuma Okeke
Guy
Cameron Johnson
Ashton Hagans
Matisse Thybulle
etc. Just a name of few.

My take on this class is, Strong top 3 compared to most classes. But 4-10 is most weak than strong. Comparable to 2015. That said, 4-24 is consistency strong. That's comparable to 2017. Also, the Tier 5 of this class is much stronger than most years which makes me think a lot of these guys will return for 2020. We haven't had a strong 5th tier since 2014.
Justwar
Rookie
Posts: 1,141
And1: 222
Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Location: Kentucky
Contact:

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#5 » by Justwar » Sat Mar 9, 2019 4:26 am

Can't see pj washington not being there
User avatar
GimmeDat
Forum Mod - Bulls
Forum Mod - Bulls
Posts: 23,915
And1: 16,880
Joined: Sep 27, 2013
Location: Australia
 

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#6 » by GimmeDat » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:46 am

Nice board. I don't see the star potential in Okpala though.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#7 » by King Ken » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:39 pm

GimmeDat wrote:Nice board. I don't see the star potential in Okpala though.

I am doing my comparison charts and Okpala has nose dived. My eye test loves him, data, comparisons charts and synergy doesn't. :banghead:
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#8 » by King Ken » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:41 pm

Justwar wrote:Can't see pj washington not being there

I have him in tier 5. This might be the worst UK class I've seen under Cal. They work well collectively but for the NBA. They fail my eye test, my data test, I haven't did the comparison test with them so far but I am sure they will fail there too. I love Coach Cal and his eye for talent but I never liked these ones even dating back from their AAU days. What's crazy is I was high on Shai and Knox before many others but this class is a let down for me.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#9 » by King Ken » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:42 am

Comparison Test: This is when I comparison their style of play, talent level, readiness at this particular time and rookie impact. Please note, some guys get way better during pre-draft and workout team. John Collins really showed range potential in his pre-draft time and in year 2, has showed tremendous 3pt% potential. Donovan Mitchell reached his expected peak 3P% in year 1 by making tremendous improvement. Personality test, work ethic, internal drive, vision, team, organizational fit, personnel, vet leadership and willingness to learn, and coaching greatly matters. It can really boost a prospects ceiling like the Hawks, Clippers and Nets for example or sink a prospects ceiling like the Suns, Magic and Pistons till D. Casey joined.

Let's start: 1-10 prospects on my big board.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#10 » by King Ken » Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:12 am

1. Zion - There is no comparison in the history of the game for Zion. Offensively, he is one of the best we have ever seen. Defensively, he is one of the best we have seen as a prospect.

style of play - His style of play is clearly like an overaggressive combo guard. Similar to a Westbrook. He loves to post up smaller players and take larger players off the dribble. He has an ability to go skinny on his spin moves and his movements are swift and tight. His agility in the air and on the ground is down right impressive and the amount of torque he gets off the bounce is likely never been reached by others.

Defensively, his style is aggressive. He likes to take risk, especially when around the perimeter. Has a tendency to reach and get caught standing but his tremendous ability to make up ground. With Zion, you have to understand angles because he can take them away unlike anyone else in this class outside of Clarke and maybe in general, Shawn Marion. His shot blocking is actually quite great. His ability to impact the attacker from even attempting the shot really puts Gobert and Ben Wallace pressure on the offense. At times, you see the lack of standing reach but for the most part, it's difficult because he is so strong and tough to get position on and it will only get hard as he gains experience and better tutelage. I like to say he reminds me of Ben Wallace defensively. I still think he is a better defender than an offensive player at the next level. I think he is more of a #2 but he won't be stop in the NBA anyway so it doesn't matter.

Talent Level- It's really tough to compare anyone to Zion in this area. He isn't the most talented offensively player. He clearly isn't the most skilled. But he is extremely gifted and doesn't show many flaws.


NBA readiness and rookie impact - He is clearly ready, we all know that. It depends where he goes on how much he will average as a rookie. But I see him being the rare 6 tier. That's impacting points, steals, blocks, assists, rebounds, and for a big FG%. For a wing/guard, it's FTA and FT%. Guys who do this have rare impact. Zion off the ball expertise is where I see more work needed, shooting of course is a weakness and stamina. Some of this will improve with NBA coaching and the NBA training but the off the ball stuff is important and where coaches earn their check.

I will keep it short from now on. Zion is just rare.


2t. R.J. is another player who there is no legit comparison for. I looked across the database in the last 30 years, no one is an elite tier scoring potential with elite tier passing as well as a + rebounder. The closest player is who I used to compare him to, Kobe Bean Bryant. The other is Pistol Pete Maravich.

His style of play on offense is very unattractive with flashes of beauty. Some will say it's Harden like and he just gets it done. I think his game is probably beautiful but everyone knows he wants to shoot mid range jumpers or drive to the basket and in the NCAAs, they can really take the beauty out of things if you aren't shooting or showing elite athletic ability.

He does do a lot of Kobe like things. He is the best slipper I've seen since Kobe. No one just finds holes in a defense just to get a chance to score like him. No one has that Mamba mentality to chuck ish like him either. You can see a lot of Kobe in him. Similar level athletes too. Kobe's more explosive to me but both are great athletes. Defense is something he has potential in but he needs a lot of work. When he locks in a common phase with R.J.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - He is way more skilled than anyone else in the NCAA's that I've seen this year. He is the only one in this draft I've seen close to Luka from a skill stance from a wing in a very long time. Some will say what about Tatum but Tatum not this good at scoring right now. He could use a lot more polish. He is not polished the way Luka was. He will take some time but should still be a Day 1 impact guy.

2t. Ja is still #2. Ja is a blend of multiple players for me. His explosiveness and ability to rebound from the guard position is like Westbrook as a prospect. He is built like Fox. He passing vision and feel is a lot like Trae Young although he doesn't have the same floor game and BBIQ. His ability to attack the basket is similar to Dennis Schroder. His PnR proficiency will be beyond elite from the jump.

His style of play on offense is a lot like Dennis Schroder, similar BBIQ, feel for the offensive game and how he attacks and shoots like Dennis. With the explosiveness and athletic ability of Westbrook and the passing feel and vision of Trae Young. Does not have elite end to end speed of Dennis, Fox, or Westbrook but can finish like Russ. His first step is beyond elite. His ability to pass anytime makes him one of the scariest PnR PG prospects I've ever seen and truly, the most in all honesty. His ability to rebound on offense is scary as well as he is a foul drawing machine. He can play change of pace and change the tempo which is something you see only from true PGs but his decision making and stubbornness can get in his way.

Defensively, he isn't much outside of stats. Great PG rebounder, excellent at getting steals because all he really plays is the passing lanes and getting blocks. His game is dedicated to stats on defense, not impact. Like Dennis and Russ, good on D when he locks in but he rarely locks in and I wouldn't count on it as well. Plays at a mid level motor on both ends but his teammates love, love, love him. He always seems to have belief in them and that's a great trait.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - He will be 1st team all rookie with Zion and R.J. He will score around 15-17/7 rebounds and 7 assists per game. Not to mention be in the top half of blocks and steals for a PG and get some fans who will talk about him being an All Star but not a realistic one. Elite PG prospect like R.J. is an elite SG one.


4. Reddish - The comparison is OBVIOUS and Cam might be slightly better at this stage. It's Paul George. The only ones who say otherwise want him to drop to them. Their college stats were similar when you balance the margins in terms of comparisons.

His style of play on offense is a lot like Giannis in Europe. I don't care what no one says, he moves extremely smooth and covers a lot of ground quickly. He continues to pop off the screen for me. He still hasn't grown into his body. He doesn't have the explosiveness but his agility for a man his size is rare. Further along as a playmaker than stats indicate. Being on good on a bad team hurts his numbers and he is raw. Defensively, he is a major work in progress but he does have a good motor. Good at playing the passing lanes and has decent defensive instincts.

He is like PG at the same stage in every way. Just a tad further than Paul as a FR than Paul as a SO. I really don't care to go into more details. The eye test, data, and comparison test passed in flying colors.

5. Bol - We all know there is no one like Bol Bol. KP is the only one with his charts but his euro stats were meh while Bol's small sample size was crazy good.

His style of play on offense is a low motor extremely skilled big who has a tremendous translatable face up game with tremendous range. His back to the basket was good in college but I doubt it will translate as it's not that quick but his excellent footwork makes him at least a threat in back the basket. His ability to shoot short, mid, long and styles of pull-up, catch and shoot, isolation, and off the dribble makes him an extremely lethal offensive big. Even though his form is poor, his release is fairly quick and his length is generational. He will be a 20+ ppg scorer with ease in the NBA. Healthy or unheathy. Rare generational scoring ability from a big. He is also a very fluid athlete for his size that has at least average explosiveness.

His style of play on defense is what you expect from someone with a low motor. He doesn't like to move much outside of the lane. He is a drop defender but his rim and paint protection is real as is his shot blocking due to his athletic ability and length. Just don't expect much more than that. His low motor just doesn't make him a great fit for the modern NBA.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - He will make a larger impact than Reddish as a rookie but he will show you who he is and can he get better is the question or is he the Black KP? That said, he has franchise player potential and that will be appealing to most of the 4-15 teams. What's his injury status? Is he ready is to play NBA Basketball is the question? Will he work hard? Does he want it? This is for the NBA teams to answer, not us. KP made some jumps each year, can Bol do the same?


6. K.Z. Okpala - My comparison chart failed my #6 prospect. It compared him to Mo Harkless. Said nope to Giannis, Odom, even Tobias Harris. It looked like Okpala as a better player less potential than Mo Harkless. This is where my eye test has failed me.

I still hold the eye test dearly as anyone would but the data wasn't in my favor with Okpala and I decided to stick to my guns but the comparison chart is fairly good. It rarely fails me but it has for some prospects. Russell Westbrook, Gerald Henderson, Hasheem Thabeet, Evan Turner, and Ben McLemore. It really hasn't in the last three classes as we just simply have a lot more data as fans than we had in 2010.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - He is going to be in the G-League. No doubt about it. But his potential is much higher than any data chart or comparison chart. Guys just don't move like that with his work ethic and not become good pros. He has the tools and the measureables and he is smart and a hard worker for someone who's also at Stanford. Guys like him who are agile, smart, can handle the rock, covers a lot of ground in their strides, takes guys off the dribble fairly easy without seemingly looking that quick at doing it are doing it because they are great long strider athletes. Those guys rarely fail. He is 225 and hasn't grown into his body. He can be 240. Don't count him out. He can be special. I will move him down from here but I am still sky high on him long term.


7. Brandon Clarke - Clarke is a tough comparison for many because he is not a NBA PF. Clarke is 215 with the potential to be an optimal 215. While some will say, look at guys like Grant, Grant can't guard wings consistently and he has a 7'3 wingspan with a plus standing reach. Isn't laterally quick enough. Clarke is a defender who can guard 1-4 and consistently guard 2-3 and spot guard at 4. Clarke for me was extremely easy because I seen him as a future SF. He is like Demarre Carroll in terms of elite movement, BBIQ, execution, shooter and off the ball defensive skills. While being the athlete that Shawn Marion is with better finishing skills. Clarke also has good passing vision and instincts.

His style of play on offense is all about movement, BBIQ, timing, agility and more movement. On the ball, he is a tough cover because of his tremendous first step and decent handle. He has a feathery soft touch and he is excellent from 17 in which is tremendous in terms of shooting potential for most trainers. Isn't really that skilled so you are not going to see many moves from him. It's the simple jab, pump fakes, basic baller package but it's his first step and effectiveness with it that puts defenses in a tough position. Decent form for a big, miles better than at San Jose St but still average tier for the NBA. Should get 10-12 per24 off of movement, hustle and athleticism alone. Doesn't really set screens, a lot of flash screening from him but is an excellent roll man. Tremendous finisher. Tremendous awareness. I think it will translate. Elite offensive rebounder for a SF. His offensive ceiling is very high which is surprising for someone his age at SF. He will be a wealthy man's DMC at SF on offense.

His defensive potential at SF is generational. You are talking plus plus lateral quickness, elite communicator for his level and will translate in the NBA, plus plus at switching, plus plus at cutting off hedges, plus plus awareness, plus plus at closing out, elite athlete. Quick leaper and fast twitch, great defensive speed, can protect others. Can protect the paint, perimeter and the rim. Rare defender. Good defensive rebounder. Just can cover a lot of ground and efficiently. The best college defender I've seen. This is where he mixes the best of Marion and Carroll. He will not take long to translate on defense. On offense, different ballgame.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - On defense, you think someone like Okogie with his athletic ability and length is amazing, his guy makes him look like child's play. That said, it will take some time on offense. His career expected peak is .318 from three and DMC's was .319. DMC has been a career .362 from three and 74% from the FT line and become a reliable shooter. Which is better than Marion's .331 but not close to his 81% FA but Marion's three point peaks were in the high 30% and let's be clear, he didn't play in today's NBA. He did it when shooting threes wasn't look at like that till D'Antoni came to PHX which you saw a spike in Marion's % and even then, it's nothing like 2019. My guess is Clarke will average 10.6/7/2/2 BLK/1.5 STL in 24 MPG mainly with mins at SF if the team is smart. His percentages should be high close to the basket.


8. Jaxson Hayes -

This is taking too long. I'll finish the rest of the top 10 tomorrow. Thanks everyone!

9. DeAndre Hunter -

10. Darius Garland -
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#11 » by King Ken » Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:16 am

Con't

8. Jaxson Hayes - Hayes comparison is one of the unique bigs in this class. For me, he is a blend of Robin Lopez, Clint Capela and John Collins with shades of AD. Not a perfect blend or the best of but just has some parts of his game from those four.

His style of play on offense is all about movement, agility, his hands, his soft shooting touch and finishing. Think John Collins lite. He doesn't have John's feel for the game or for scoring and is such a negative with the ball that he is limited to finishing like Gobert/Capela for the most part. He does have a soft touch like Collins and shows signs he wouldn't be a 100% waste in the post-up. Lack of handles and passing is an issue for Hayes. His offensive rebounding reminds me of a freshman Robin Lopez. Once he grows into his body, he will need to really become a good boxout guy because he doesn't have a feel for rebounds at all. I think he has the potential but he is really going to have to do it.

His style of play on defense is a lot like Capela in that he is used to drop but his ability to defend is space is important when looking at his projection and his biggest advantage is his frame, coordination and fluidity is like AD. That means A LOT in terms of long term ability to defend in space and guard both 4 and 5s down the road. Once again, his rebounding is like Robin Lopez. He is raw mainly due to experience and size but he is very talented.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - Due to his talent, I expect him to at least see the floor but his body is not ready yet and he is still growing. His potential is tremendous as he has 3/D potential while being an elite potential finisher. Somewhat like Zach Collins and JJJ. Closer to Collins than JJJ due to readiness, talent wise, closer to JJJ. He should be a top 10 pick without question. I do see him getting mins at the 4 and 5. 20 mpg but he should get 30 mpg in year 2. He is a potential based guy. Don't expect much in year 1. Not ready for the NBA yet on both ends but don't count him out. Coaching and role can go along way for him.

9. DeAndre Hunter - The most polished prospect in this class is Mr. Hunter. His comparison is Otto Porter Jr. Both players were polished out of college. Both players have similar potential as prospects. Both are talented players with good height and wingspan for position.

His style of play on offense is about doing the little things to help the guys around him, movement off the ball, shooting, feel for the game, execution and taking advantage of mismatches when given the opportunity. His game is a tad different than Otto as a propsect. Otto has mid tier aggressiveness. Hunter is low tier. He is not aggressive but that doesn't mean he is not passionate. He is extremely passionate and it shows up possession by possession. Makes the right plays, cuts, moves, passes, dribbles, and makes his teammates better. His ability to shoot and space the floor spreads the floor for others and he is tough to defend. Does have Otto's explosiveness but is more athletic and a tad quicker.

His style of play on defense is a lot like Tony Allen in terms of it's conservative but tough and it's demanding as well. He defends in space and on the ball very well. He plays at an even tempo and can take it up a notch if needed. He really feels the game well on defense and forces the offense into tough plays. Just a smart kid who is always comminating and very athetlic. I feel he would be stronger in a system with other strong defenders but he is not a risk taker. Most of his steals will be legit. He will make you earn those buckets, every single one. A player who truly has 3/D ability and talent and like Tony Allen, he has ++ weight for his height which gives him flexiblity to both 2+3 but also 4 if needed. His veristiliaty will come in handy in the NBA.

Talent Level/NBA readiness and rookie impact - We saw Brodgon as ROY. I wouldn't be surprised if he is 1st team All Rookie. A legit 13-5-4 will be ideal for most teams getting top end perimeter defense. Has defensive anchor potential which also matters.


10. Darius Garland - I won't be the best person on Garland. Even after watching about 3 games of his in it's entirety, I need more time and tape, Other will be better for you with Garland. I like his talent, he has some Jeff Teague mixed with Mike Conley for me but I do not feel confident enough for him.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#12 » by King Ken » Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:06 am

Coby White and Kabengele (formerly 2020 draft prospect) will move into the top 15. Jontay will drop out of the 1st round with the recent injury of his ACL again. KZ is the big mover down the board. Still top 23 prospect but no longer a top 15 prospect.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#13 » by King Ken » Tue Mar 26, 2019 6:26 am

I lost some of my damn content due to the RealGM form validation issue :banghead: I created a full big board. I still think this is the deepest class in awhile but as we all know, a lot of guys return to school which weakens the class. But here it is right now:

Update: 3/26/2019

Tier 1: Superstar potential
1. Zion - Great NCAA tourney thus far. Just superior at this level. - NC

Tier 2: All Star potential
2t. R.J. has taken a hit with his Q card but nothing has changed much for me. I watched all 36 of his games. I have a great feel on what he is at this point.

2t. Ja had probably the best game of the tourney v. Marquette while having one of his head scratchers v. FSU and their high end NBA size. I am always a believer in him but he will need some development and won't be an easy fit in the NBA.

Tier 3.5: Decent Role player potential with All Star possibilities down the road. I do see these guys as Day 1 contributors.

4. Reddish - Cam is a great talent, average College Basketball player and is very inconsistent. The weight room, skill training and the NBA spacing is NEEDED for Cam.

5. Brandon Clarke - Having a tremendous tourney. I strongly think he can be the next DeMarre Carroll with Shawn Marion athleticism.

6. Coby White - Big mover. Proved to me he is a 1st rounder. I am hard on PG prospects. You either have All Star potential or you aren't a 1st rounder for me. The NBA PG position is just too hard. If you aren't an All Star talent at that position, you might as well be a backup. Comparison- Ty Lawson (less PG skills/far less polished decision making skills with a high aptitude to learn and the same speed and quickness and both are used by Coach Roy in similar ways), Michael Carter-Williams frame and defensive potential, stronger than MCW, and Gilbert Arenas (Walking bucket like Gil, just very skilled, great shooter and an excellent feel of the game).

7. Darius Garland - He has all of the potential you want as an off the ball scorer and a smart PG. Not the passer of yet but just plays a good game. I compared him to Mike Conley. Moved ahead of Hunter just based off of potential for me.

8. Bol - Bol simply got dropped to 8th for no other reason other than Clarke, Garland, and White got added up a tier. I strongly felt those prospects along with Bol could be All Stars down the road and also Day 1 contributors.

Tier 4: Decent Role player potential or raw with AS possibilities. Deep Tier 4 class. One of the best in years. Of course, some of these guys could return.

9. Jaxson Hayes - His floor is really low. I doubt he is better than Miles Plumlee but his ceiling is sky high. He has all star potential and at the least, top 10 center potential. Top 10 lock.

10. DeAndre Hunter - Moved down again. Potential is Hunter's issue. Still one of my favorite prospects and one of the 5 best college basketball players right now with Zion, Clarke, Culver, and R.J.

11. Rui - Efficiency, consistency, high floor, hasn't been playing long so he has the potential. I see him like a Kenyon Martin type which is a great fit in today's position-less NBA. He is a lottery lock for me.

12. Mfiondu Kabengele - Formerly on my 2020 list, he has moved into the 2019 draft class. While he is not without issues, man D, awareness issues on defense, polish. He has tremendous talent, skill, shooting, athletic ability for his position and size. A clear talent that could challenge Jaxson Hayes for the top NBA prospect at 5.

13. Charles Bassey - Bassey is another big mover for me. Some scouts have underrated him and want to label him a traditional old school big but he can really shoot. What if he is a more athletic Nurk? I think people are overthinking it with him. I am moving him up again.

14. Goga Bitadze - Impressive play of late. He really has taken the leap. His feel for the game has always been there but his movement defensively has improved a lot. I wouldn't be surprised if he was drafted in the top 10 over Hayes, Kabengele and Bassey.

15. Jarrett Culver - He didn't do anything negatively to move back. If anything, he solidified his position as the 3rd best player in College Basketball. Had a great 1st round game but his 2nd round game which I watched in it's entirety just simply confirmed what all season I already knew. He is a high end backup who is an army swiss knife. He is not a top 10 pick.

16. Sekou - NC.

17. Bruno Fernando - NC.

18. Nickeil Alexander-Walker - NAW is going to be a good NBA player. Any team in the 15-20 range should jump at the chance to add him into the rotation. I would watch for teams who have salary cap assets (J.R. Smith - Cavs) to show serious interest in this range but it's unlikely those teams will want to trade that pick. I don't see any of them as major players for FAs or like Boston, just don't have any reasonable bad contracts with just a year on them. Too rich for those teams blood.

19. Romeo Langford - Low floor/High ceiling, low end All Star potential but he has a lot of work to do.

20. Nassir Little - Semi low floor/Semi high ceiling. He translates extremely well physically and talent wise but his low feel for the game, lack of ball handling and inconsistent shooting. Who knows, his types have translated better than average into the NBA so he is not a risk in this range. I could see him being pushed up the draft board due to the need for wings in today's NBA and the lack of them in FA in 2019 could push him into the top 10 like it might for Romeo Langford.

21. Keldon Johnson - NC.

22. Kevin Porter Jr. - I still liken him to Lonnie Walker in terms of development, lacks the character that Lonnie had, risky player to bank on in the 1st round. Then again, so was Mitchell Robinson and that turned out well. :banghead:

23. Chuma Okeke - Semi high floor with a solid ceiling. Formally a 2020 prospect who is looking more and more like a 2019 prospect due to his size, versatility, BBIQ, and feel for the game. Comparison: Horford type of game, doesn't have Al's athletic ability and it shows on both ends but can pass it like Al out of UF with similar length. David West, moves off the ball like David and athletically is similar but doesn't have the 7'4 wingspan which shows during rebounds. Okeke is a tweener who is clearly more of a 4 but has shown he is a 2019 prospect for me.

24. KZ Okpala - Big drop from #6. The issue is simple. He lacks too much polish and his numbers have failed. Still passes the eye test but he is moving closer to 2020 where he is a top 5 prospect for me. I would like to see him with Team USA this summer.

25. Grant Williams - High floor/Low ceiling. Likely to see a drop after MM. NC.

26. Naz Reid - NC

27. Jalen McDaniels- Teams have been high on his ceiling and role playing potential off the bench for awhile. He is a Swiss army knife and teams could see him as the big man's version of Terrance Ferguson. I can see him going in this range and his floor is higher than people think.

28. Gafford - More of a 2nd round floor. He does play the PnR well, move well and space and flash potential in space on defense. He is more inconsistent but his potential to be a two way player who can defend in space on defense and play in space on offense makes his NBA ceiling higher than most in this range. Teams will be higher on him after workouts. His ability to play in space on both ends will appeal to a lot of teams looking for a big who can protect others, especially on D in the switching parts of the game.

29. Matisse Thybulle - Lower mid floor/Semi High ceiling. Has starting role player potential.

30. Cameron Johnson - Big mover, lower mid floor/semi high ceiling. More NBA ready than Final Four hero Justin Jackson. He is a clearly better NBA prospect to me.

31. Nic Claxton - 2020 prospect (top 10 for me) but he is raw on offense with potential to be solid and has elite defensive potential long term. His ability to cover ground, deflection and impact the game on the defensive end is top notch. His potential will get him drafted in the 1st round regardless when he comes out. No one is like him. Rare talent for a 5.

32. Talen Horton-Tucker - 2020 prospect (top 10 for me) Talent is MUCH Better than he is as a player. He is barely above average as a college player. He should come back and be a top 5-10 college player and with his talent, we could be looking at a rare prospect who has five tier potential. (points, assists, steals, blocks, and 3pt%). He needs to work on his body and polish but was a good freshman for the most part.

33. Admiral Schofield - low floor/semi high ceiling - I see a lot of P.J. Tucker long term is Scho in flashes. I need to see more of Scho, Tennessee just hasn't been a team I've watched a lot of. This is could change the time the draft is here.

34. Tyler Herro - I am not sold on his floor but I have finally gotten around on his potential. He is a more talented Luke Kennard who is not as polished or as NBA ready. Still not a 1st rounder and should come back to college but he will get looks. Better defensively as a prospect than Kennard by a large margin. low floor/semi high ceiling.

35. P.J. Washington - I have watched some early UK games and P.J. showed flashes. He is physically most like David West but his inconsistency and BBIQ says otherwise. I think he will need a great playmaker to help him at the next level or the NBA can be a short blip for Washington. low floor/semi high ceiling. He has moved up my list. I didn't think he was going to be a potential starter for the longest time.

Last player in Tier 4.

36. Ty Jerome - Not quite the shooter Shamet was but a better PG and a much better defender. But he doesn't have the positional versatility that Shamet had. Jerome really is a PG. Potential to be a low end starter in the NBA which is pretty good for a 2nd round grade. high floor/semi low ceiling.

Tier 5: Low floors with Decent Role player potential or career backups with limited potential - I don't have any Euros in the range, just haven't watch much at this stage. I usually watch them during pre-draft season.

37. Tre Jones - Semi Mid floor/Low ceiling. Great defense mixed with excellent game management skill but like Melton, do you pass on him because his shooting just doesn't translate?
38. Zach Norvell - Must be role specific and right fit, Must be role specific and right fit, Must be role specific and right fit, - Bart Simpson on the board... mid floor/low ceiling. Specialist.
Ashton Hagans
40. Tacko Fall - Why? Simple. 7'6, 310, strong hands and body, 8'5 wingspan and 10'5 standing reach with decent lateral quickness for his size. His defense has been transformational at the college level: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/tacko-fall-is-7-foot-6-and-hes-breaking-basketball/ You do have to take into account he has almost no vertical, terrible stamina and an extremely poor FT shooter. You have to look at this play with Tre Jones. This isn't the block but he blocked Jones who dribbled in one step within the 3pt line and blocked it within the FT line. That was more insane than the Zion-Hunter block. That's go-go gadget type of block. That told me that even in a switch, he has the length (8'5) and reach (10'5) to cover twice as much space as any NBA player. For 15-18 mins in a rotation like Philly uses Boban depending on the matchup, that could be a major coup. He has moved up from unranked to top 40 for me. His rotational impact potential is as high as anyone in this range.

Read on Twitter


41. Dylan Windler - Big Dylan Windler fan. Love his potential to be a decent role player. Maybe even starter potential but he does have a low floor. His defense is bad and his athleticism isn't much. But his ability to shoot and rebound will translate. Clearly a G-Leaguer till he improves his D. More of an undersized 4 at this point and that's not going to work in the NBA. He is a great investment for teams who really value having shooters and they have a defensive minded team. A low end PDS guy. (Pass, dribble, shoot).

42. Killian Tillie - His advanced stats are high but that might be a product of his competition and his team being superior more than anything else. He can shoot and has great size but doesn't really fit well. Better shooting and passing but less defense and and post game Mike Muscala.

43. Shamorie Ponds - IT0 is a realistic comparison for Ponds. Not the movement player or slasher that IT0 was out of Washington but better at PG play, shooter, and PnR Basketball. If you are looking for a PnR player who can score and create at a high level, provide next to nothing on defense. Ponds is your man. Ponds is a high end steals guy so it isn't a complete farce on D. High Floor/low ceiling

44. Jalen Lecque - I haven't watched him play but his highlights look real good. Not sure how he translates. G-League instantly.

45. Haliburton - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

46. Ochai Agbaji - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

47. Miye Oni - Low floor - high mid potential - I think he could be the Josh Richardson of this class in the right situation. Not sold he will come out as a 2nd rounder. His potential is his calling card.

48. Markus Howard - More of a high European prospect. He is an elite scorer and shooter but not much else and his defense can be labeled as a better Jimmer. Mid floor/low ceiling. His shooting, ability to create his own shot and BBIQ will appeal to teams looking for a 2/way. His 2/way appeal helps his NBA profile.

49. Terrance Mann - I actually like his potential. Clearly 2/way contract. Not NBA ready whatsoever but he does show enough to play in the G-League and see if he can have a NBA career. Low floor/low mid ceiling.

50. Lawson - He is a really good college player. One of the best but he doesn't really have a position or a legit skill. Growth will be critical but should be a 2/way prospect with potential to be a low end rotation player. Low floor/low mid ceiling.

51. Nwora - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

52. Jalen Smith - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

53. Queta - Obvious 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability. The 1st round hype he was getting was misguided.

54. Jordan Bone - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. He is unique. He is one of those rare seniors who can take a major leap. Don't be surprised if him and Yves Pons takes a major leap in 2020. Both have the athletic ability and their development has been ample. Rick Barnes is working his magic in Knoxville.

55. Charles Matthews - Injuries could lower his status but he is a clear NBA player to me. Mid high floor/low ceiling.

56. Jordan Poole - Sam Veceine is sold on him. I just haven't watched Michigan much and when I did, they played bad and lost or they just played bad this year. Like Maryland last year, when I get a chance to watch their games, I will probably bump these guys up.

57. Iggy Brazdeikis - See Poole. I am pretty much putting the UM guys in this range till I can really rate them.

58. Konate - His potential is much higher than his floor. He has talent and ability but the G-League should be an option for him. low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

59. Paschall - Been watching Paschall for a while. Not sold on his standing reach. 2/way guy. He can play in the NBA right now but I am not sure he can stick. mid high floor/low ceiling.

60. Isaiah Roby - 3/D potential ceiling. 6'8, has the size, can get blocks and steals. His shooting needs work. Doesn't quite have the athletic ability. Clearly a 2/way guy. Some will say he has RoCo potential but he really going to have to improve his shooting. Guys like Ennis and Covington shot it better but than again, they played for small schools, not in the Big 12. For positions where they have taller better bigger players, we should take it more seriously as well seen with guys like Taurean Prince.

61. Luguentz Dort - 2020 prospect. 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has to really work to improve. His drop was bad.

62. Aric Holman - projectable player. Obviously has to put on more size. 3/D PF. A clear low floor semi mid ceiling who is a 2/way option. Could move up into the 2nd round with ease.

63. Caleb Martin - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

64. Juwan Morgan - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

65. Josh Reaves - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. His defensive potential will warrant some looks in the 2nd.

66. Fletcher Magee - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. I like his 2/way potential.

67. Anfernee McLemore - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

68t. Tremont Waters - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

68t. Cody Martin - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. Great passer for position and you hope he can develop into a secondary playmaker who is a 3/D player long term. Has long term

70. Darius Bazley - low floor/mid ceiling, workouts will be critical for him.

71. Robert Franks - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

72. Bennie Boatwright - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

73. Udoka Azubuike - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

74. Brian Bowen - low floor/mid ceiling, workouts will be critical for him.

Tier 6: G-Leaguer who have the potential to be career backups with limited potential or non NBA prospects who will practice their trade overseas.

75. Carsen Edwards - Tremendously skilled player who can score and shoot. Not a NBA prospect at all.

76. Ethan Happ - Tremendously skilled big with no range whatsoever.

77. Cassius Winston - Euro

78. CJ Massinburg - Euro

79. Kerwin Roach - Euro

80. Ky Bowman - G-League

81. Tyler Cook - Euro

82. Chris Clemons - China

83. Matt Morgan - G-League

84. Makai Mason - G-League

85. Tyus Battle - 2020 prospect but not getting drafted in 2020 either.

86. Dean Wade- Has a lot of potential in countries that value big men passes in Europe but no NBA Potential.


As I stated on top, this is an extremely DEEP class but not so top heavy or mid heavy. If this was mixed last year class. Zion would be 1. R.J. and Ja would be ahead of Mikal/WCJ/Trae/JJJ at #7/#8. While Cam/Clarke/White/Garland/Bol in the same tier with Sexton/SGA/Miles B./Knox and to be honest, they would be behind all of them but Knox's as well. Trae was in that tier for the longest till I bumped him up a few weeks before the draft ahead of JJJ. It took me the longest to be convinced Trae was good enough to be an All Star potential type and not just way down the road.

Basically, this draft isn't nowhere near as top heavy as 2018. You got basically the #4 prospect in this class, would be #16th in last year's draft combined. That's said, after the first 13th prospects, last year class doesn't hold water to this year's class in terms of rotation potential and I haven't included the 2nd round internationals yet. Just a lot of rotation pieces in this draft with some upside. That's the strength of this class. Clearly not the top.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#14 » by King Ken » Sun Mar 31, 2019 8:22 pm

A couple changes will happen on the next list:

Carson Edwards to the 2nd round.
Okeke to the 2nd round due to injury.
Jontay Porter to the 2nd round due to severe injury.
Herro and Washington to the mid-late 1st round.
Jared Harper on the big board
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#15 » by King Ken » Tue Apr 9, 2019 5:52 am

I am adding about 10 more players to this list as well as other player movement.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#16 » by King Ken » Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:11 am

All Updates (No Euros outside of the 1st round till the combine and more notes)

Update: 4/21/2019

Tier 1: Superstar potential
1. Zion - Elite floor, Elite but NOT a HOF ceiling, fit will play a role if he becomes an superstar level player. As special as they come. Even if others may have potential, no one should pass up on him for any reason whatsoever.

Tier 2: All Star potential

2t. R.J. Barrett - High floor, very high ceiling, could be one of the best players in the league in the right situation. Like this entire in this class, fit is important for Barrett long term.

2t. Ja Morant - One of the best talents in this class but one has to seriously question his floor. A bad fit could limit his impact. Best to put him around shooters. Special PG talent.

Tier 3.5: Decent Role player potential with All Star possibilities down the road. I do see these guys as Day 1 contributors.

4t. Reddish - Semi low floor, very high ceiling. System based player.

4t. Brandon Clarke - Mid high floor, very high ceiling, I strongly believe he can be the next DeMarre Carroll with Shawn Marion level athleticism. System based player. Will need time to translate into a SF.

4t. Darius Garland - Low mid floor, high ceiling.

4t. Bol - High floor and very high ceiling? System based player. Extremely bad flaws. Extremely good strengths.

4t. Coby White - Semi-Mid floor and high ceiling, System based player

Tier 4: Decent Role player potential or raw with AS possibilities. Deep Tier 4 class. One of the best in years. Of course, some of these guys could return.

9t. Jaxson Hayes - Low floor with high ceiling, Hayes has a blend of J. Noah, Capela and Robin Lopez in him. He is so far from ready to play, anyone who takes him will likely send him to the G-League for a season. System based player

9t. DeAndre Hunter - Very high floor with mid ceiling, you are looking at a Otto Porter Jr/Ron Artest type who can help you right away. He can fit any system to a degree and he fits the modern NBA.

11t. Rui - Teams will underrate him but he is a critical piece to a PnR team looking for a high end PnR finisher who can switch. May never be a superstar but in the right fit, you got someone who can really play. High floor, high mid ceiling. System based player.

11t. Mfiondu Kabengele - Low floor, mid high ceiling and not a system based player. He will generate a lot of attention in the mid 1st to late 1st range. To me, he is a prospect that you must look at due to his ability to fit the modern game.

11t. Goga Bitadze - Mid floor, mid high ceiling who is a system based player. The right team will have to draft him but in the right system, he could be more than valuable.

11t. Jarrett Culver - mid high floor with a lower-mid ceiling who would be at his best in a PG based role. Jalen Rose type.

11t. Sekou - low floor with high ceiling who has tremendous smallball four potential. Not the next Siakam but he can be very good down the road.

16. Bruno Fernando - mid floor with mid potential who has play in numerous systems but could be very good in the right one. Good pickup in this range.

17t. Tyler Herro - Low Floor, semi high ceiling with tremendous work ethic. Will need to adjust to the NBA game but has potential.

17t. P.J. Washington - Mid Floor, Mid potential who has a projectable jumper. David West type.

17t. Nickeil Alexander-Walker - mid floor with mid potential who can be a good role player for most teams in time. Gary Harris type

20t. Romeo Langford - Low floor/High ceiling, low end All Star potential but he has a lot of work to do. Work ethic will be critical with this one.

20t. Nassir Little - Semi low floor/Semi high ceiling. He translates extremely well physically and talent wise but his low feel for the game, lack of ball handling and inconsistent shooting. Who knows, his types have translated better than average into the NBA so he is not a risk in this range. I could see him being pushed up the draft board due to the need for wings in today's NBA and the lack of them in FA in 2019 could push him into the top 10 like it might for Romeo Langford.

20t. Keldon Johnson - mid floor with mid potential who is a system player. Needs to be protected.

20t. KZ Okpala - Low floor/High ceiling who is a system based player. System/culture/and fit will be critical.

24t. Grant Williams - High floor/Low ceiling. High quality late 1st round pick, wouldn't risk taking him 20 or better.

24t. Matisse Thybulle - Lower mid floor/Semi High ceiling. Has starting role player potential.

24t. Nic Claxton - Low floor, Semi high ceiling. System versitaility. Could be a big mover if he enters.

27t. Talen Horton-Tucker - Lower low floor with a semi high ceiling. His projectabiity is everything.

27t. Jalen McDaniels- Teams have been high on his ceiling and role playing potential off the bench for awhile. He is a Swiss army knife and teams could see him as the big man's version of Terrance Ferguson. I can see him going in this range and his floor is higher than people think.

27t. Gafford - More of a 2nd round floor. He does play the PnR well, move well and space and flash potential in space on defense. He is more inconsistent but his potential to be a two way player who can defend in space on defense and play in space on offense makes his NBA ceiling higher than most in this range. Teams will be higher on him after workouts. His ability to play in space on both ends will appeal to a lot of teams looking for a big who can protect others, especially on D in the switching parts of the game.

27t. Kevin Porter Jr. - Low floor/High ceiling with questionable work ethic and character.

27t. Charles Bassey - Mid-high Floor, mid ceiling who will enter the draft without an agent. Likely returning back into the draft.

32t. Cameron Johnson - Big mover, lower mid floor/semi high ceiling. More NBA ready than Final Four hero Justin Jackson. He is a clearly better NBA prospect to me.

32t. Admiral Schofield - semi low floor/semi high ceiling - I see a lot of P.J. Tucker long term is Scho in flashes. I need to see more of Scho, Tennessee just hasn't been a team I've watched a lot of. This is could change the time the draft is here.

32t. Ty Jerome - Not quite the shooter Shamet was but a better PG and a much better defender. But he doesn't have the positional versatility that Shamet had. Jerome really is a PG. Potential to be a low end starter in the NBA which is pretty good for a 2nd round grade. high floor/semi low ceiling.

35t. Justin Wright-Foreman - Ben Gordon like but not as long (6'6 wingspan compared to Ben's 6'8.25 wingspan). More skillful scorer than Ben, not as athletic which shows especially on defense. Good passing vision. Has potential as an instant scorer off the bench.

35t. Chuma Okeke - Semi high floor with a mid ceiling. Injury dropped his value. Top 20 value when healthy!

Tier 5: Low floors with Decent Role player potential or career backups with limited potential - I don't have any Euros in the range, just haven't watch much at this stage. I usually watch them during pre-draft season.


37t. Naz Reid - Brian Grant like - Semi mid floor, low mid ceiling. Limited on defense. Rotational piece for the NBA at the 5.

37t. Zach Norvell - semi low floor, semi high ceiling. Has two way potential. Consistency is an issue. Flashes Michael Redd potential.

39. Tacko Fall - semi high floor, low ceiling. rotational big. system based player.

40t. Dylan Windler - semi mid floor, semi mid ceiling. system based player.

40t. Killian Tillie - Hasn't declared. semi mid floor, semi mid ceiling. system based player.

40t. Shamorie Ponds - High Floor/low ceiling. D.J. Augustin type depending on what you think. I will likely lean more Augustin.

44. Jalen Lecque - Placeholder spot, I have no clue about him for now.

45. Jalen Pickett - Entered but not really entered. Could be a 1st rounder next year.

46t. Miye Oni - Low floor - high mid potential - I think he could be the Josh Richardson of this class in the right situation. Not sold he will come out as a 2nd rounder. His potential is his calling card.

46t. Mike Daum - Mid high floor - low potential - I compare his type to Kris Humphries. 23 years old but he has a lot of translatable skill.

46t. Louis King - Low floor - semi mid potential - Has the size and skill. I am not sure about the rest. Workouts will matter, if he does poorly, I can see him going back to Oregon.

46t. Marial Shayok - Low floor - semi mid potential, consistency is an issue for Shayok but his talent and skill as well as his body isn't. He will likely go undrafted but his development in the G-League could see him playing good in the NBA sooner than later. Sleeper.

46t. Carsen Edwards - Mid high floor with a low ceiling, shooting will be critical for his prospects. Moved up the list due to the tourney but I can see him having issues translating to the NBA. Shooting will be everything.

46t. Lindell Wigginton - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

52t. Markus Howard - More of a high European prospect. He is an elite scorer and shooter but not much else and his defense can be labeled as a better Jimmer. Mid floor/low ceiling. His shooting, ability to create his own shot and BBIQ will appeal to teams looking for a 2/way. His 2/way appeal helps his NBA profile.

52t. Terrance Mann - I actually like his potential. Clearly 2/way contract. Not NBA ready whatsoever but he does show enough to play in the G-League and see if he can have a NBA career. Low floor/low mid ceiling.

52t. Lawson - He is a really good college player. One of the best but he doesn't really have a position or a legit skill. Growth will be critical but should be a 2/way prospect with potential to be a low end rotation player. Low floor/low mid ceiling.

52t. Nwora - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

52t. Jalen Smith - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability.

52t. Queta - Obvious 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. Has the ability. The 1st round hype he was getting was misguided.

52t. Jordan Bone - 2020 prospect but low floor/mid ceiling. Can boost his ceiling in 2020. He is unique. He is one of those rare seniors who can take a major leap. Don't be surprised if him and Yves Pons takes a major leap in 2020. Both have the athletic ability and their development has been ample. Rick Barnes is working his magic in Knoxville.

59. Charles Matthews - Injuries could lower his status but he is a clear NBA player to me. Mid high floor/low ceiling.

60?. Jordan Poole - Sam Veceine is sold on him. I just haven't watched Michigan much and when I did, they played bad and lost or they just played bad this year. Like Maryland last year, when I get a chance to watch their games, I will probably bump these guys up.

61?. Iggy Brazdeikis - See Poole. I am pretty much putting the UM guys in this range till I can really rate them.

62t. Konate - His potential is much higher than his floor. He has talent and ability but the G-League should be an option for him. low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

62t. Paschall - Been watching Paschall for a while. Not sold on his standing reach. 2/way guy. He can play in the NBA right now but I am not sure he can stick. mid high floor/low ceiling.

62t. Cassius Winston - Moved up due to the tourney but I have questions about his ability to play bully ball 6'1 185.

62t. Tookie Brown - Mid high floor, with a semi low floor, this is my steal of the draft. I didn't really watch his games much but I watched him at Portsmouth and he clearly looked like a NBA player, the numbers and highlights match and he has that IT0 factor of just getting buckets in kinda way. He has moved up my draft board. IT0 of this class. I think he will get some looks in the draft.

62t. Ahmed Hill - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

62t. Nick Perkins - semi mid floor with low ceiling

62t. Justin James - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

62t. Fletcher Magee - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. I like his 2/way potential. An elite shooter and can get from three in every way like Redick. I wouldn't be suprised if he was drafted in the 2nd round.

62t. Obi Toppin - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

62t. John Konchar - semi mid floor, semi low ceiling. All around player. Flashes potential to be a good NBA player. G-League will be a need. Shades of a bigger, strong, taller, not quite the shooter and skill of Scott Skiles. Like Skiles, doesn't lack a skill but does he have the athletic ability. He isn't anywhere near as good as Scott was. Scott was a lot more polished but John is 6'5, 215. His potential is there.

62t. Simi Shittu - very low floor with a semi high ceiling

62t. Jarrell Brantley - semi low floor, with a semi low ceiling

62t. Daishon Smith - mid floor, low ceiling, good player who has 2-way potential to be a decent player.

62t. Isaiah Roby - 3/D potential ceiling. 6'8, has the size, can get blocks and steals. His shooting needs work. Doesn't quite have the athletic ability. Clearly a 2/way guy. Some will say he has RoCo potential but he really going to have to improve his shooting. Guys like Ennis and Covington shot it better but than again, they played for small schools, not in the Big 12. For positions where they have taller better bigger players, we should take it more seriously as well seen with guys like Taurean Prince.

75. Luguentz Dort - low floor/mid ceiling. Has a projectable frame and skill-set but just is completely unpolished and not ready for the NBA.

76t. Aric Holman - projectable player. Obviously has to put on more size. 3/D PF. A clear low floor semi mid ceiling who is a 2/way option. Could move up into the 2nd round with ease.

76t. Caleb Martin - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

76t. Juwan Morgan - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

76t. Josh Reaves - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. His defensive potential will warrant some looks in the 2nd.

76t. Anfernee McLemore - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

76t. Tremont Waters - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

76t. Cody Martin - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player. Great passer for position and you hope he can develop into a secondary playmaker who is a 3/D player long term. Has long term

76t. Darius Bazley - low floor/mid ceiling, workouts will be critical for him. Could move up.

76t. Robert Franks - semi mid floor with a low ceiling who has potential to develop into a rotation player.

76t. Bennie Boatwright - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

76t. Udoka Azubuike - 2020 prospect but low floor/semi-mid ceiling.

76t. Brian Bowen - low floor/mid ceiling, workouts will be critical for him. Could move up.

76t. D’Marcus Simonds - low floor/semi mid ceiling, he can play but he has to develop his shooting ability and his decision making. If he can develop it, he could be a NBA player but it's unlikely.

76t. Amir Hinton - very low floor/mid ceiling, he has the tools, skills and the talent but he is so far away from others. It's like watching a HS player who played HS ball.

76t. Jaylen Hoard - low floor/semi mid ceiling, his ability to play in Europe next year could push him into the 2nd round. He has the talent and size to play in the NBA but he doesn't have the skill, readiness, or feel at this point.

Tier 6: G-Leaguer who have the potential to be career backups with limited potential or non NBA prospects who will practice their trade overseas.

91t. Ethan Happ - Tremendously skilled big with no range whatsoever.

91t. CJ Massinburg - Euro

91t. Kerwin Roach - Euro

91t. Ky Bowman - G-League

91t. Tyler Cook - Euro

91t. Chris Clemons - China

91t. Matt Morgan - G-League

91t. Makai Mason - G-League

91t. Tyus Battle - 2020 prospect but not getting drafted in 2020 either.

91t. Dean Wade- Has a lot of potential in countries that value big men passes in Europe but no NBA Potential.

91t. Kenny Goins - G-League

91t. Christ Koumadje - G-League

91t. Zac Cuthbertson - G-League - poor man's NAW

91t. Jakeenan Gant - very poor man's Jarian Grant

91t. Trayvon Reed - G-League

91t. Matt Morgan - G-League

91t. Cameron Young - G-League - Klutch Client

As I stated on top, this is an extremely DEEP class but not so top heavy or mid heavy. If this was mixed last year class. Zion would be 1. R.J. and Ja would be ahead of Mikal/WCJ/Trae/JJJ at #7/#8. While Cam/Clarke/White/Garland/Bol in the same tier with Sexton/SGA/Miles B./Knox and to be honest, they would be behind all of them but Knox's as well. Trae was in that tier for the longest till I bumped him up a few weeks before the draft ahead of JJJ. It took me the longest to be convinced Trae was good enough to be an All Star potential type and not just way down the road.

Basically, this draft isn't nowhere near as top heavy as 2018. You got basically the #4 prospect in this class, would be #16th in last year's draft combined. That's said, after the first 13th prospects, last year class doesn't hold water to this year's class in terms of rotation potential and I haven't included the 2nd round internationals yet. Just a lot of rotation pieces in this draft with some upside. That's the strength of this class. Clearly not the top.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 15,734
And1: 3,655
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#17 » by Stillwater » Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:49 am

I don't agree with some of your takes about the ceilings; Keldon Johnson, Bassey, Hoard(2020), Carson Edwards and Jalen Smith(2020) all are high ceiling prospects imo.but overall this is pretty well thought out and you have some good observations here.
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,619
And1: 5,394
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#18 » by King Ken » Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:59 am

Stillwater wrote:I don't agree with some of your takes about the ceilings; Keldon Johnson, Bassey, Hoard(2020), Carson Edwards and Jalen Smith(2020) all are high ceiling prospects imo.but overall this is pretty well thought out and you have some good observations here.

Thanks Stillwater! Looking forward to your 2019 list this year.
Justwar
Rookie
Posts: 1,141
And1: 222
Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Location: Kentucky
Contact:

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#19 » by Justwar » Mon Apr 22, 2019 2:42 am

Fletcher Magee I don't think should be even top 100, good college guy in a good system, extremely limited against any kind of focus on him
User avatar
clyde21
RealGM
Posts: 61,883
And1: 69,291
Joined: Aug 20, 2014
   

Re: King Ken's Big Board (MS, PCP, FF/NC, Pre Draft, Combine, Mock) 

Post#20 » by clyde21 » Mon Apr 22, 2019 3:05 am

Stillwater wrote:I don't agree with some of your takes about the ceilings; Keldon Johnson, Bassey, Hoard(2020), Carson Edwards and Jalen Smith(2020) all are high ceiling prospects imo.but overall this is pretty well thought out and you have some good observations here.


Hoard is 19 for sure

Return to Mock Drafts