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Meaning, we all knew that the 2017 GS Warriors were going to win the title before the season even started. Won 67 games, had Curry, KD, Klay etc and went 16-1 in the playoffs.

I have a feeling the Aces are going to be that team this year. There will be teams that beat them during the season (maybe) but we all know they're going to walk it in, and this is coming from a Liberty fan.

I think what they have in common with that Warrior super team is how ridiculously well they fit together. Adding Candace Parker's defensive versatility, passing, and off-ball savvy (and how she doesn't need the ball to make impact) to the Aces existing environment where there are so many perimeter gunners around A'ja has been so seamless thus far. No one has had to adjust their game really at all. Super teams that overachieve or underachieve often do so by virtue of what their stars can do when the ball isn't in their hands. Parker's not a great off-ball shooter, but she's able to add values in the aforementioned other ways. It's a beautiful thing when the whole is better than the sum of the parts, and the parts are multiple DPOYs, MVPs, and all-stars.

I do think the Liberty deserve a chance to gel. I think it was a fairly common sentiment among W fans that the Aces' moves were less flashy but more functional, while the Liberty were a staggering mountain of firepower but with some more uncertainty around role. I think we know the Liberty can be better than this, especially if Jonquel can get healthy and find a role on this team. Sabrina can't buy a bucket inside the arc, and Vandersloot can't buy one outside it right now. The Liberty team we'll see come playoffs is likely to be a lot more figured out and formidable.

zike_42 wrote:Meaning, we all knew that the 2017 GS Warriors were going to win the title before the season even started. Won 67 games, had Curry, KD, Klay etc and went 16-1 in the playoffs.

I have a feeling the Aces are going to be that team this year. There will be teams that beat them during the season (maybe) but we all know they're going to walk it in, and this is coming from a Liberty fan.

Sadly for me as a fellow Liberty fan, I think so. I can't figure out a way to beat this squad. Their three guard line up is elite and Wilson and Parker are as flawless of a C/PF pairing that you'll find in the sport.

Objectively though, they are so much fun to watch, they definitely have 2017 Warrior vibes

zike_42 wrote:Meaning, we all knew that the 2017 GS Warriors were going to win the title before the season even started. Won 67 games, had Curry, KD, Klay etc and went 16-1 in the playoffs.

I have a feeling the Aces are going to be that team this year. There will be teams that beat them during the season (maybe) but we all know they're going to walk it in, and this is coming from a Liberty fan.

I get where you're coming from here - they do look unbelievably good to the point where no one else has a shot.

I will say that my first impression of the analogy was off. I was thinking in terms of super-teams making everything unfair, and there, I actually think they were more of a super-team when they had Cambage. Parker's a big name coming in from the outside sure, but she's nothing anywhere near the level of a prime-KD-type superstar at this point in her career, so it doesn't feel the same to me.

In the end I see this Aces team primarily through the lens of them getting 3 #1 overall draft picks in a row, and then building on that good fortune well.

cupcakesnake wrote:I think what they have in common with that Warrior super team is how ridiculously well they fit together. Adding Candace Parker's defensive versatility, passing, and off-ball savvy (and how she doesn't need the ball to make impact) to the Aces existing environment where there are so many perimeter gunners around A'ja has been so seamless thus far. No one has had to adjust their game really at all. Super teams that overachieve or underachieve often do so by virtue of what their stars can do when the ball isn't in their hands. Parker's not a great off-ball shooter, but she's able to add values in the aforementioned other ways. It's a beautiful thing when the whole is better than the sum of the parts, and the parts are multiple DPOYs, MVPs, and all-stars.

Parker is having a remarkable post-prime run. I'm someone who generally thinks that in her prime her impact was less-than-the-sum-of-the-box-score, and now she's way more-than-the sum. Speaks to how all around her talents are, and makes me wonder if her teams were held back primarily by her coaches not thinking to try playing other ways.

cupcakesnake wrote:I do think the Liberty deserve a chance to gel. I think it was a fairly common sentiment among W fans that the Aces' moves were less flashy but more functional, while the Liberty were a staggering mountain of firepower but with some more uncertainty around role. I think we know the Liberty can be better than this, especially if Jonquel can get healthy and find a role on this team. Sabrina can't buy a bucket inside the arc, and Vandersloot can't buy one outside it right now. The Liberty team we'll see come playoffs is likely to be a lot more figured out and formidable.

I agree with all of this. I'll be really surprised if the Liberty aren't a high performing team by season's end in part because I just don't think it's that hard to have a high performing team when you have Stewart.

That's not to say I'd expect them to beat the Aces if the Aces keep it up, but I'm sure the rest of the league is going to be pretty freaked out trying to stop what the Liberty have to offer.

As an Australian, I cringe everytime I hear Cambage's name because she's been horrible for Australia basketball (and seems like a horrible person in general).

zike_42 wrote:As an Australian, I cringe everytime I hear Cambage's name because she's been horrible for Australia basketball (and seems like a horrible person in general).

That's the right response, but when I think of Australian basketball, I think of...

Ayo the Aces are getting their asses BEAT!!!!

Doctor MJ wrote:

zike_42 wrote:As an Australian, I cringe everytime I hear Cambage's name because she's been horrible for Australia basketball (and seems like a horrible person in general).

That's the right response, but when I think of Australian basketball, I think of...

Lauren Jackson is a class act. I've met her twice and both times she seemed like a great person.

MrDollarBills wrote:Ayo the Aces are getting their asses BEAT!!!!

Guess it was a jinx thread.

"I will not win the lottery this weekend..."

zike_42 wrote:

MrDollarBills wrote:Ayo the Aces are getting their asses BEAT!!!!

Guess it was a jinx thread.

"I will not win the lottery this weekend..."

Yeah it was

Still, it was awesome to see the Sun not only rise to the challenge, but put the entire W on notice. Bonner has the dog in her for real

MrDollarBills wrote:

zike_42 wrote:

MrDollarBills wrote:Ayo the Aces are getting their asses BEAT!!!!

Guess it was a jinx thread.

"I will not win the lottery this weekend..."

Yeah it was

Still, it was awesome to see the Sun not only rise to the challenge, but put the entire W on notice. Bonner has the dog in her for real

I was waiting for the Sun's defense to have a big defensive performance like this but didn't figure it would be against the #1 offense. Aces had to lose at some point.

Something to be said about how the Suns can be huge on the perimeter and make life hard for a 3-guard lineup like the Aces have. Bonner isn't an amazing on ball defender, but her long arms are such a menace at the nail and she really disrupted the Aces ball movement. On the other end, Chelsea Gray couldn't disrupt Bonner's shot (and was getting caught on screens) so the Aces were sending their bigs out to help and stretching their scheme further than they like to.

It was a little surprising how much the Sun had success just posting up the Aces bigs.

The Kiah Stokes/A'ja Wilson lineups continue to be a weak link for this team.

Doctor MJ wrote:
Parker is having a remarkable post-prime run. I'm someone who generally thinks that in her prime her impact was less-than-the-sum-of-the-box-score, and now she's way more-than-the sum. Speaks to how all around her talents are, and makes me wonder if her teams were held back primarily by her coaches not thinking to try playing other ways.

I forget if we've talked about this before, but I also wasn't a fan of the Candace Parker superstar era. While she had some brute scoring efficiency, I didn't love her decision-making as an offensive hub against elite defenses. That would always show up in the playoffs and be a core part of their struggles. I started being more into Parker once Nneka took over more scoring and Parker shifted to flexing her might as one of the most versatile players ever. I think once Parker started doing that, it was like a lightbulb went on and she honestly has looked like she's had more fun playing basketball this way over the second half of her career.

The value was always staring us straight in the face with how good her defense was, and how much potential she flashed as a passer. It's been a joy to watch her blossom into the best parts of her game in a way that's probably helped her have this longevity.

cupcakesnake wrote:

MrDollarBills wrote:

zike_42 wrote:
Guess it was a jinx thread.

"I will not win the lottery this weekend..."

Yeah it was

Still, it was awesome to see the Sun not only rise to the challenge, but put the entire W on notice. Bonner has the dog in her for real

I was waiting for the Sun's defense to have a big defensive performance like this but didn't figure it would be against the #1 offense. Aces had to lose at some point.

Something to be said about how the Suns can be huge on the perimeter and make life hard for a 3-guard lineup like the Aces have. Bonner isn't an amazing on ball defender, but her long arms are such a menace at the nail and she really disrupted the Aces ball movement. On the other end, Chelsea Gray couldn't disrupt Bonner's shot (and was getting caught on screens) so the Aces were sending their bigs out to help and stretching their scheme further than they like to.

It was a little surprising how much the Sun had success just posting up the Aces bigs.

The Kiah Stokes/A'ja Wilson lineups continue to be a weak link for this team.

The funny part is, Kiah had the highest +/- on the team last night 0pts, 5rebs, 3blks

I'm never a fan of saying we know what will happen in months, because a lot can happen. Injuries are the obvious one, but NY could also gel and they could become the competitor I expected to start the season.

But jeez, the Aces sure do look formidable. Alysha Clark has also been a really nice complementary piece.

I'm going to the Aces/Liberty game tonight. Expecting a good one.

Chris Porter's Hair wrote:I'm never a fan of saying we know what will happen in months, because a lot can happen. Injuries are the obvious one, but NY could also gel and they could become the competitor I expected to start the season.

But jeez, the Aces sure do look formidable. Alysha Clark has also been a really nice complementary piece.

I'm going to the Aces/Liberty game tonight. Expecting a good one.

Well... and then that happened.

NY did look good. They made a handful of really great plays, and looked competitive at almost any individual point in the game. But the Aces got the lead, and just kept slowly but surely increasing it throughout the game. Until garbage time when their bench made it look closer than it really was.

I think NY really is good. I just think Vegas really is better. Someone could get hurt, NY could improve as they get more playing time together, but for now it looks like Vegas' to lose.

Chris Porter's Hair wrote:

Chris Porter's Hair wrote:I'm never a fan of saying we know what will happen in months, because a lot can happen. Injuries are the obvious one, but NY could also gel and they could become the competitor I expected to start the season.

But jeez, the Aces sure do look formidable. Alysha Clark has also been a really nice complementary piece.

I'm going to the Aces/Liberty game tonight. Expecting a good one.

Well... and then that happened.

NY did look good. They made a handful of really great plays, and looked competitive at almost any individual point in the game. But the Aces got the lead, and just kept slowly but surely increasing it throughout the game. Until garbage time when their bench made it look closer than it really was.

I think NY really is good. I just think Vegas really is better. Someone could get hurt, NY could improve as they get more playing time together, but for now it looks like Vegas' to lose.

Yeah it felt competitive but Las Vegas came out in the second half and just ripped off 11 straight points and never looked back.

The biggest difference I saw with these 2 teams going head-to-head: Las Vegas' backline defense. Both teams guards were getting good dribble penetration, but New York's guards were surrounded by bodies in the paint once they got there. On the flip side, Las Veagas would run a basic action out of horns, and that's all it would take to take Stewie and Jonquel out of the action. Las Vegas felt like an impenetrable shell, while New York was out there rolling over like a dog that wants tummy scratches.

Jealous you got to watch the game live! How was the vibe?

cupcakesnake wrote:

Chris Porter's Hair wrote:

Chris Porter's Hair wrote:I'm never a fan of saying we know what will happen in months, because a lot can happen. Injuries are the obvious one, but NY could also gel and they could become the competitor I expected to start the season.

But jeez, the Aces sure do look formidable. Alysha Clark has also been a really nice complementary piece.

I'm going to the Aces/Liberty game tonight. Expecting a good one.

Well... and then that happened.

NY did look good. They made a handful of really great plays, and looked competitive at almost any individual point in the game. But the Aces got the lead, and just kept slowly but surely increasing it throughout the game. Until garbage time when their bench made it look closer than it really was.

I think NY really is good. I just think Vegas really is better. Someone could get hurt, NY could improve as they get more playing time together, but for now it looks like Vegas' to lose.

Yeah it felt competitive but Las Vegas came out in the second half and just ripped off 11 straight points and never looked back.

The biggest difference I saw with these 2 teams going head-to-head: Las Vegas' backline defense. Both teams guards were getting good dribble penetration, but New York's guards were surrounded by bodies in the paint once they got there. On the flip side, Las Veagas would run a basic action out of horns, and that's all it would take to take Stewie and Jonquel out of the action. Las Vegas felt like an impenetrable shell, while New York was out there rolling over like a dog that wants tummy scratches.

Jealous you got to watch the game live! How was the vibe?

It is a fun place to watch a game, for sure. Arena holds around 12,000, and was at least close to full yesterday. Very loud and lots of excitement. Definitely some Liberty fans, but not a ton. Some of the Vegas bench players are really fan favorites (Bell and Colson in particular), so even up to the end there was a lot of support and cheering.

And re: defense. Yes, some of what you describe is what has really struck me this year. Tall trees. Lots of blocks, steals, and deflections. Not much comes easy. Jonquel is a handful, and definitely put a few defenders under the basket. But on the whole, even when they got the ball into the paint, it was still crowded and busy.

Liberty Liberty