bucks.com: Mo Williams has surgery

[NeedsMoreCheese]

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Mo Williams doesn't do anything for the "team's sake" and he doesn't think he is a shooting guard, he is a shooting guard.

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[lawrybeard]

He obviously didn't hurt it playing defense.

[carmelbrownqueen]

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I'm hating on Mo Williams because I think he is an SG in a PG'S body, and want him moved this offseason? Interesting. If that truly makes me a hater then I'm fine with that because I honestly think moving Mo Williams and Charlie Villaneuva is in the best interest of the team.

So for everyone else who chose to respond and state similar criticisms they aren't haters? Hmmmmm....

[NeedsMoreCheese]

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I'm hating on Mo Williams because I think he is an SG in a PG'S body, and want him moved this offseason? Interesting. If that truly makes me a hater then I'm fine with that because I honestly think moving Mo Williams and Charlie Villaneuva is in the best interest of the team.

So for everyone else who chose to respond and state similar criticisms they aren't haters? Hmmmmm....

Oh so you didnt claim that he never does anything for the teams sake then?
I guess i misinterpreted this part then,

Mo Williams doesn't do anything for the "team's sake"

My bad.

And I dont see why you have to needlessly bash Mo in a thread reporting his surgery. Havent you done that in 200 other threads already?

Just because you say hes a shooting guard doesnt make him one. But of course this goes back to the "if enough people claim something it must be true" theory.

Where did i say there werent other haters? You were the one that made the thread and decided to turn it from reporting Mo's surgery to bashing him right away, hence why it makes sense that your post is the one used.

[unklchuk]

Amazing. Pro Mo and Anti Mo - the blood still courses in both directions. Clearly, the man has the power to move people. Bet he'll still be getting threads 5 years from now, if the Bucks aren't in Beijing.

Moving fans is no small accomplishment. Moving teammates on a basketball court is rarer still. One out of two ain't bad.

[carmelbrownqueen]

[quote="Kohl Is A Mome"][/quote]So tell me what did Mo Williams do this season that was for the sake of the team?

[ReasonablySober]

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So tell me what did Mo Williams do this season that was for the sake of the team?

Other than CV willingly taking a seat for an unproven and ineffective rookie, what player did anything for the sake of the team?

[carmelbrownqueen]

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My bad.

And I dont see why you have to needlessly bash Mo in a thread reporting his surgery. Havent you done that in 200 other threads already?

Just because you say hes a shooting guard doesnt make him one. But of course this goes back to the "if enough people claim something it must be true" theory.

Where did i say there werent other haters? You were the one that made the thread and decided to turn it from reporting Mo's surgery to bashing him right away, hence why it makes sense that your post is the one used.

Is Mo Williams above criticism? Are only the staunch Mo Williams supporters allowed to post about him? Because I thought this was a message board where fans could post opinions about players, the team and anything else connected with their team.. Seems as if whenever an opinion isn't popular with one segment of the board.. one of the most popular things to do is run around calling the opposing view and poster a hater. It's so convenient, so predictable and really shows a lack of discussion and conversational skills...

[carmelbrownqueen]

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Other than CV willingly taking a seat for an unproven and ineffective rookie, what player did anything for the sake of the team?

CV didn't willing take a backseat to Yi. CV was domoted into his position on the bench. He didn't want to be on the bench and pouted because of it. He never was a willing bench player.. he wasn't happy and wasn't doing it for the sake of the team.

[ReasonablySober]

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CV didn't willing take a backseat to Yi. CV was domoted into his position on the bench. He didn't want to be on the bench and pouted because of it. He never was a willing bench player.. he wasn't happy and wasn't doing it for the sake of the team.

Bottom line is he sat and didn't make a fuss in the media or demand a trade. We didn't see him called out by anyone and he was the model of a good teammate from everything that came out of Bucks camp.

I find it absolutely fascinating that in this day and age, someone it's only the Milwaukee Bucks that you never see or hear players taking their gripes to the press. Sure, we hear from unnamed sources on anonymous message boards that so-and-so did whatever, but amazingly, all we ever hear from the players is a laugh and how nothing of the sort ever happened.

And CBQ, you still haven't answered my question. What player did something for the sake of the team?

[carmelbrownqueen]

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Bottom line is he sat and didn't make a fuss in the media or demand a trade. We didn't see him called out by anyone and he was the model of a good teammate from everything that came out of Bucks camp.

I find it absolutely fascinating that in this day and age, someone it's only the Milwaukee Bucks that you never see or hear players taking their gripes to the press. Sure, we hear from unnamed sources on anonymous message boards that so-and-so did whatever, but amazingly, all we ever hear from the players is a laugh and how nothing of the sort ever happened.

And CBQ, you still haven't answered my question. What player did something for the sake of the team?

CV expressed frustration and even speculated (in the most politically correct of ways) about his future in Milwaukee in that blog on nba.com. He was not direct in the media, but he did somewhat elude to his displeasure and desire to be in a different situation. Behind closed doors he asked for a trade, and even during games his body language spoke volumes about his "willingness" to come off the bench for the good of the team. CV was never happy with his role, and he never pretended to be.. so I'm not sure where you are coming from on that.

In response to who did what for the sake of the team.. very few of our productive players consistently did something for the sake of the team. However, I think Sessions came in at the end and passed the ball the way none of our other starting or backups would. Ivey came in and willingly played whatever role was asked of him. Ruffin came in and willingly played his role whenever he was called upon. Yes.. all of these guys are bench players but they willingly played their role and seemed content to do whatever was asked of them for the sake of the team.

[El Duderino]

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In response to who did what for the sake of the team.. very few of our productive players consistently did something for the sake of the team. However, I think Sessions came in at the end and passed the ball the way none of our other starting or backups would. Ivey came in and willingly played whatever role was asked of him. Ruffin came in and willingly played his role whenever he was called upon. Yes.. all of these guys are bench players but they willingly played their role and seemed content to do whatever was asked of them for the sake of the team.

I don't think guys like Ruffin and Ivey always play hard or do whatever asked out of some noble sake for the team, they do this because they have no other choice if they want to keep collecting an NBA paycheck. There are only about 375 NBA jobs for a player, job security is paramount for 11th/12 men.

Back of the bench guys in most sports get praised all the time for doing anything their coaches ask, but if they actually had many great skills, my guess is a good number of those easy to please scrubs would end up also having some prima donna in them.

When your the 10th/11th/12th man on a basketball team and usually playing year to year on one year contracts, you better do pretty much anything asked of you or you'll get the boot and the teams will find some other low talent fringe hustler.

I'm not excusing all the mega rich prima donnas in the NBA that choose to hustle when they please or bitch when they don't like their role, but the reality is, most players who are skilled enough to get a big contract, also come with healthy egos that have been stroked for years.

[NotYoAvgNBAFan]

This is another reason why this hook is not a starter...

HE CAN'T STAY HEALTHY!

TJ Ford is tougher then he is! He will never play in 82 full games...never much less a quality 48 minutes.

That is why you move him and keep Redd if you had to make a choice.

[Jez2983]

to repair ligament damage in his right thumb

That's pretty severe - need a large force to damage ligaments - don't generally just break down unless something is being done repetitvely wrong...

He obviously didn't hurt it playing defense.

Ok this is a guy we know will be shopped around this summer. And we wait over a month for him to have the surgery? He last played on 4/4. Have the damn surgery right away. He'd already be more than 4 weeks into the 6 week recovery time. Teams will want to make sure he's going to be 100% before trading for him.

Maybe there's already a trade agreed to in principle and his new team has asked him to have the surgery to be ready for camp later in the year

As far as his injury goes he had that bandage on his thumb since December I believe. Maybe even earlier then that.

Heaps of dudes just have tape coz they got a ball on their thumb 2 years ago and just can't play without it for mental reasons. Epi brought up an example of the Celtics (?) years ago where guys played and looked like mummys. Some people just need to think they're OK.

Wrist/finger surgeries can take a while to recover from though - not as bad as feet (!) but he would need maximum possible recovery time to get his wrist/fingers OK.

[pilprin]

On this present squad, we have a SG in a PG body (Mo), two SF in a PF body (CV &Yi), a SG/SF who plays like a PF (Dez), a SF who plays like a SG (Simmons) and a spaz in a C body (Gadz).

We are more like a team from the Island of misfit toys than an NBA team.

Everyone of those players could be good complimentary players on a normal team, but together...well we have seen the painful play.

1/2 of this roster needs to be turned over with players that fit. We have a bunch of accessories, but few quality pieces.

[smauss]

On this present squad, we have a SG in a PG body (Mo), two SF in a PF body (CV &Yi), a SG/SF who plays like a PF (Dez), a SF who plays like a SG (Simmons) and a spaz in a C body (Gadz).

We are more like a team from the Island of misfit toys than an NBA team.

Everyone of those players could be good complimentary players on a normal team, but together...well we have seen the painful play.

1/2 of this roster needs to be turned over with players that fit. We have a bunch of accessories, but few quality pieces.

I have been saying this for a long time. LH, Herbie and the Yes-men or maybe all of the above, whoever was responsible for putting this team together may have an eye for talent but doesn't do very well at putting together a team. I believe Hammond does and will (if he's allowed to)........

[ReasonablySober]

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In response to who did what for the sake of the team.. very few of our productive players consistently did something for the sake of the team. However, I think Sessions came in at the end and passed the ball the way none of our other starting or backups would. Ivey came in and willingly played whatever role was asked of him. Ruffin came in and willingly played his role whenever he was called upon. Yes.. all of these guys are bench players but they willingly played their role and seemed content to do whatever was asked of them for the sake of the team.

Wow. Our 8th, 9th and 10th best basketball players came off the bench and played...their roles.

Don't hurt yourself reaching, there, CBQ.

[europa]

I'm not excusing all the mega rich prima donnas in the NBA that choose to hustle when they please or bitch when they don't like their role, but the reality is, most players who are skilled enough to get a big contract, also come with healthy egos that have been stroked for years.

The problem - and CBQ correct me if I'm misinterpreting your point - is that too many of the Bucks placed their egos above the team. I think the three worst culprits this season were Mo, Redd and Villanueva. Mo's ego was way out of control; Redd's ego obviously became a problem and Villanueva thought he should start even though he was outplayed by Skinner last season and by Yi in camp this year. So he spent a lot of time griping behind the scenes and playing like absolute garbage most of the time when he came off the bench.

Every good player has an ego. That in itself isn't a bad thing. But the great ones understand that placing their own interests above the team's produces nothing of substance. The Bucks have yet to figure that out and I think it's one of the big reasons why they have been so bad the past two seasons.

[ReasonablySober]

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The problem - and CBQ correct me if I'm misinterpreting your point - is that too many of the Bucks placed their egos above the team. I think the three worst culprits this season were Mo, Redd and Villanueva. Mo's ego was way out of control; Redd's ego obviously became a problem and Villanueva thought he should start even though he was outplayed by Skinner last season and by Yi in camp this year. So he spent a lot of time griping behind the scenes and playing like absolute garbage most of the time when he came off the bench.

Every good player has an ego. That in itself isn't a bad thing. But the great ones understand that placing their own interests above the team's produces nothing of substance. The Bucks have yet to figure that out and I think it's one of the big reasons why they have been so bad the past two seasons.

Personally, I think the problem is talent.

There's a reason that the average pre-season position predicted by a dozen ESPN experts was between 12th and 13th in the East. These guys looked at the rosters and coaches before the season, and they thought that Bucks didn't have enough to even sniff the playoffs. They were right.

Say that the team, or rather your three main culprits, did exactly what was expected. Redd reigned in his scoring, Mo looked to others more often than not and CV simply played as hard coming off the bench as he does when he's starting.

I actually think that team wins less. Face it. The the only three players on this team capable of winning games with their scoring are the ones you'd rather deferred. The one stretch of games that they appeared to play unselfish coincided with the wheels coming off and the season going down the drain.

The problem isn't egos, it's talent. This team doesn't have it.

[europa]

I agree there's a lack of talent. I talked about that before the season and was called "Mr. Gloom" or something of that nature because I didn't believe this was a talented team. I thought the talent and roster composition was terrible. On top of that, some of the players think they're more talented then they really are. That's when the egos become a problem. It's a bad team and there are a number of reasons why. That's why I'd be fine getting rid of as many players as possible this summer and starting over. No way it'll be any worse than the crap we've seen the past two seasons.